Ouch!

Rivers has had a good year IMO, has adapted well to playing under Neeld, and the fact that he has shown to be effective as a swing man being able to play forward and back gives him some value. McDonald does not look like he has that flexibility. That being said I haven't quite made up my mind regarding Rivers next year though, I would have no issue with the club offering him another deal, but I also see him as having enough currency to get a handy player from another club in return... and I think it's fair to say we have other options if he or the club looks to engage in a trade. To say he would spend time @ Casey is a joke, Rivers is an AFL standard player and would get a gig in the back 6 a lot of AFL teams I reckon.

But who cares if it is 3 or 25? Thats not the issue, the issue is more that we get would get to spend 3 and 4 on another pick. It's not the first F/S that has been gotten for a steal, I still reckon the bombers potentially get a bigger steal than us regardless. The difference is that they will happily pay the price, and the price is lower than what we might pay. Happy to be amicable, but you are still bending the words with this bit " if they see him as top 2 or believe we will take him wherever - they will bid for him.what you say above." That last bit irks me. They will take him if they see him as a top 2. They will not bid if there is any risk we won't take him, and if he is not worthy of one of these picks then they are at risk of screwing up their 2012 draft... and for what? I know you rate Viney, I do as well. But I don't believe the MFC are going to be hoodwinked into paying more than what Viney is worth. If they nominate him, and we take him with 3, I believe it is going to be based on him being worthy of the pick. If it doesn't eventuate, even better.

Providing Essendon can get a juicy pick. Their first live pick is like to be mid to late 20s given they will take Daniher with the F/S pick. I won't disagree that we could give up a good pick for Caddy if thats the type of player we are going for.

Ummm,... because thats kinda how the F/S stuff works. You don't hear anyone moaning about the fact that Essendon are getting Joe Daniher for next to nothing are they? The only picks that are of importance to determining the fate of Jack Viney are picks 1 or 2, therefore the only clubs risking anything are GWS and GC. I gotta stop this now... I am repeating myself in numerous threads saying the same thing....

Not quite done. Tell me what does GWS or GC get out of helping these 'pleading' teams that would justify risking pick 1 or 2 to get a player who might be worth pick 5? This seems to be the one thing that you don't seem prepared to answer. Even if he is worth pick 3 or 4.... if the MFC believe that there is a clear distinct difference between the top couple of players and those rated 3-6 then they would need to think hard on what they do. Edit: I am kinda cranky RP that in having to feel the need to answer your post we have extended this unnecessary Poll further than it deserved j/k

Ok seriously can we stop with this rubbish! It is not THAT hard! It's based on the picks ahead of us in the draft not ours just as Fat Tony pointed out. If he is worth Pick 4 then why would GWS and GC pick him. Our picks are irrelevant UNTIL we know whether anyone ahead of us is prepared to take him, and in this case it looks like GWS and GC with picks 1 or 2 are the only ones that can prevent us from securing JV. If they don't warrant him worthy of one of those picks we will get him for a second round pick. If they rate him 4th, they won't compromise their position based on that. The only exception will be IF you have to throw a blanket over picks 1-4 or 1-5 type of thing, and rarely has that been the case, at least when looking at uncompromised drafts. More often than not the ranking of these players at the pointy end of the draft becomes pretty clear.

Problem with this is that their first round pick will be reserved to take Daniher as F/S. They are going to struggle to get Caddy (If he is available) unless they offload some decent players to secure the necessary picks.

Oh dear..... I thought you gave up a little easily on the discussion yesterday... Agree with comments above, Flawed Poll as my feelings aren't supported by any of the options.

Commentator "Player 1433 Calder Cannons " Barry: "Hey Dean! We won! Bingo! B.I.N.G.O!"

given what is at stake... I won't comment either way. But just remember the game is a 'Home' game for GWS, but it is at Manuka Oval.... so not the same as playing @ Skoda stadium.

He must? Dunno if you have listened to Neeld much, but he seems pretty happy with Trengove, and if anything suggests that Trenners focuses too much on doing the 1% stuff, and is too intense. Trengove still managed 22 possessions and was one of the leading possession winners on either team in the first half. In an ordinary year he is still top 3 for disposals, and top 2 for tackles... and high up on whatever 1% stats Neeld seems to track internally. Tell me why would giving Jones a share of the captaincy make things better for anyone?

Ah, but you are forgetting, Sheeds is growling and going 'Arrrghh!!!! I've never won a spoon in my life, don't you dare call this tank.. *cough* this player management scheme anything other than that. Cos I am Kevin Sheedy .... hey look is that Brock over there?'

Yeah I agree that if GWS finished last then yes thats an option to go to them via the PSD. At the time of posting though, we still had a game going between GWS and GC.

I'm saying that players can't just go to the club that they want without being unrestricted free agents. Sure he can ask to go go to the club of choice, but GWS have to come to the party and negotiate with MFC to make it happen... But my point is more that just cos Scully is there, does not mean that Blease would automatically go there too... are we saying that Scully is his ONLY friend in the world, and he just has to leave to join him, and leave his family etc.... it's just too simplistic a view to take.

and how exactly is that going to happen? He can't just leave. GWS can't poach from us again. Perhaps the pre-season draft, but only if GWS has the first pick. I can't stop shaking my head that people keep thinking just cos Scully is at GWS that Blease will do that. Wellingham and Buddy are best mates... is that worth spreading the rumour that they will hold hands and join up at the Pies or Hawks? Bastinac and Scully are closer mates than Blease and Scully, yet Bastinac chose to stay. Seriously people, this is rubbish. Great game today by Blease though, and I totally agree he needs to be secured by the MFC ASAP.

ummm, he looks like he is equal highest disposal getter on the ground, but don't let that get in the way of your rant!

Oh come on seriously? http://www.afl.com.a...64/default.aspx Hawks outscored us 16 scoring shots to 10 in the first half, we were smashed in the first qtr, accurate in the second qtr and humiliated in the second half. The match review isn't telling porkies. We got smashed by 45 points and should have lost by more. None of my Hawks mates were concerned that they were trailing at half time. If you wanted to prove your point about how we were going last year, this would have to be the worst example game you could have used to support your argument.

2011 we got flogged by the pies 129 to 41. 2010 we had a couple of good games against Collingwood thats true, but following it up with an 88 point smashing last year wipes that away pretty bloody quickly. Last year other than GC I think we had the highest losing margin of all teams in the competition. It was offset by some large wins, but the media slagged us off (well before 186) about how we had no gameplan at all, and we looked good against teams that didn't bother to play accountable football, but those that did smashed us constantly.

Hmmm ok, so you are saying our best football saw us win 1 out of 4 quarters, the other three were quarters we got smashed. You say yourself we need a defensive game but somehow think that doesn't come at a cost of being accountable? don't you think that will 'kill' our offensive flair somewhat? I do blame the gameplan (of Bailey's) for creating a bunch of unaccountable players that Neeld it struggling to turn into a cohesive unit!

For someone running a business, you seem to spend an awful lot of time on here talking about football thru the day. ... just saying.

... sorry I have to say that again. .... wow

You are actually serious when you say this... ... really? Our football last year was barely any better than this year. It certainly was not accountable football in any way. 'Our good football was as good as anyone in the league' umm, wow .... wow.

I'll try not to take any notice of Leroy Jetta and Gary Rohan but thats bloody hard given how talented they are!!

Technically hasn't been dropped to the seconds, but he is on the extended bench and named in the seconds as well. So yeah it's likely, but not a definite. Still not a good look I guess. Viney named as the 23rd player for the seniors I notice as well.

F/S nominations occur before tradeweek