nutbean

OK - five points 1/ Please point to exactly which rule we have broken 2/ If you can point to rule that we have broken, the AFL needs to unambiguously state the definition of the rule we have broken and then have proof of exactly how the rule was broken ( ie playing players in wrong positions constitutes tanking, resting players constitutes tanking...etc). 3/ If point 1 & 2 are put forward by the AFL and since the "crimes" were done in the past, there needs to be clear and unambiguous statements/actions by the AFL that other clubs will be held to exactly the same standards and investigations ( and presumably charges) have to be made into other clubs. Carlton, Collingwood, Stkilda, Richmond, WCE, Hawthorn are in trouble and even Freo's and GWS's actions in one game each would have to breach the standard. 4/ Unless players were told to go out and lose and unless there is an action plan in writing on how to lose, comments by an administrator that are open to interpretation or players who had a feeling for what was happening (Brock) would hardly constitute proof of anything - or again if these are accepted as proof then they are the standard and Richmond must meet the same standard in terms of Wallace's Cotchen statement and Carlton with their Fevola and Barry Mitchell statements. 5/ Lastly - I have never been paranoid about the AFL being out to get us - but this will be severely tested if there is a hard finding against us after the sissy, nancy boy, amby pampby handling of Tippett case and the penalties brought down for a cut and dried case that was not open to any interpretation what so ever edit - I think that should read namby pampby and you can add fairy floss marshmellow sooky la la as well

I like moderators, in moderation.

glad this thread came up - I can now say a big thank you as I was thinking to myself - "hey, myself, the new skin looks really good"

wtf ? ( I didnt murder him - I just shot him repeatedly for absolutely no good reason)

I don't know why we look at the FH money and say "we can't rely on FH money". I will never see it as a "given" and am extremely grateful to the wealthier benefactors who tip large sums in regularly and do not downplay this generosity - but we are not the only club that do this and get this kind of support. Collingwood and Carlton are extremely well fed by FH type donations. We should be the kind of club where its supporters are happy ( well..maybe willing is a better word) to contribute and strive to make the club stronger.

unless you are prepared to trade (and risking upsetting a wanted player)seeking market value is a waste of time as you dont get a true indication unless the other recruiters sense that you are prepared to trade. If we said "how much for trengove" - the opposition recruiters would think pfffttt - trading your 20 year old captain - I suspect the answer would either be 14 x 1st round draft picks or Simon Buckley and an old sock. I would think that any recruiter worth his salt would ask - what do you want for him ? Then what do you say ?

breaks your heart when you see a Dee streaming out of the centre and look up and then kick it to....the opposition. It will be a pleasure to see some lace out on the chest stuff ( to our people of course)

I need to take a cold shower ( remembering Robbies performances in State games...) Edit- demon from within - don't misinterpret the esteem I hold Neita in - just because I dont think he is champion of the game that shouldn't be measured against other forwards like Dunstall, Lockett, Carey etc does not mean I think he is dud - he is certainly a champion of our club - he will be remembered as Demon great. I think you need to take of the red and blue goggles and ask a non demons who are the great forwards who played at the same time as Neitz and see how many would rate him in their first five

I think you will find that the recruiters are a little smarter than that - you had your apartment valued 5-6 times - the AFL market is a much smaller pond - I am tipping that recruiters know who are time wasters and who are truely up for trade so I am not so sure that you would get a true market value - there is a fair degree of too'ing and fro'ing. You may even get a true value this year - but if you dont trade him and try the same next year you will get true nothing - this isnt like your apartment where you can go to 5-6 different agents. Also if you put any name up to get a true market value then dont complain when any name holds us over a barrell to extract every last cent on the next contract - after all we did put his name up for trade.

To me speed is key - he went from a good turn of toe andf nice kick in year one to plodding and struggling to get to 40 metres in year two for reasons unknown to me however I have to suspect injury (OP ?) as this shouldnt have gone over 1 year to a 20 year old. If he can get back some toe and penetration with the his kicking i think he will be fine.

wow...wow..and wow - ok - where to start - Neitz didnt play for another side so your assumption that he would have kicked 100 goals multiple times falls under the "IMSHBSBMB hypothesis (if my sister had balls she's be my brother) You are now lauding Green, Farmer, Yze and White as champions as well ? (FYI - a champion team will always beat a team of champions - well we proved twice that there wasnt quite enough cream to win flags - we had really good footballers playing as a team - but champion footballers ? noooooo) As for Sheedy's thugs - we didnt lose because they were thugs - we lost because they were bigger better and stronger mentally and physically than us ( same as 1988) Then in your last quote you have gone with the "if he played in the same sides he would have been a champion" - again, speculative at best, impossible to prove or disprove as he didnt play with the those team, and I do like the way you shifted to the "if" Lets compare him to Robbie Flower who played in far worse teams than Neitz - and only tasted success in his last year with Northey. No "if he played for other teams"...no "if had better footballers around him". He played in a crap team and distinguished himself in the top half dozen wingman to play the game. I think we have all have acknowledged that Neita is a champion of the club - but in my opinion he is not a champion of the game

My take ( and Laurie Fowler was the perfect example). During Flowers reign and before the B&F votes used to go to the player not with most skill but with the most G&D - Laurie Fowler was semi skilled and certainly not in Flowers league but he was suicidal brave and never ever gave in. Not that Robbie gave in or wasnt brave, but I also think his star rose so quickly that we came to expect 99/100 from him and he would get votes at 100/100 but not at 98/100.

When I read the title of this thread I thought it was a quote from a group of hopefuls trying to get selected in the 2012 NAB national umpires draft. ( and the answer is yes....yes you must)

I do not profess to have knowledge of the cultural divide that separates us but the thing that irked me was the complete lack of acknowledgment of the support the club had given him - I would have been happy enough for his manager or the club to make a statement on Liam's behalf "Liam has asked me to thank.....etc". I would be surprised if Liam's culture does not find the giving of appreciation necessary. I restate that I have no knowledge of the culture but I believe that it is a basic human trait that spans all cultures that when levels of support and help are given, appreciation/acknowledgment is shown/given in return

I quite like Robbo and I think the reason is that as hard as I try I just cant take him seriously - there is something quite comic about him. Even when he does start to say something with a straight face and full of importance I expect any moment him to stop and break into that huge ridiculous grin and say "only shittin' ya".

the words of star and champion are bandied about too easily and too often - agree with everything you have written above. Last champion we produced was tulip. The Ox in my opinion had the makings but unfortunately a large dose of bad luck to stop him ever reaching the heights I thought he would.

You think its a disgrace because people have different opinions to you ? I absolutely loved Neita but unbiasedly, should he be mentioned in the same breath as Matthews ? Carey ? Even Jono Brown ? nope.... as mentioned - a true great or champion of the club but not a great of the game.

Of all players we have let go he is the one that I hope goes on and plays well for the bullies - I have no understanding why I feel that way - I guess he has always been "honest" on the footy ground.

Mixed feelings on flash. I have never thought he is hard enough at the ball but he compensated for that to a degree by being lightening quick and disposing beautifully. He didnt accumulate possession because he was a smart footballer and knew to go where the footy is - it was all about pace. The question for me is can he get over injuries that have slowed him. If he doesnt have pace then I fear he doesn't have much to offer.

To those who are bemused or wanted Viney to chose a different criteria for Jones other than saying he was a different height - I concur with Viney that we certainly have a raft of smaller type mids and Jones provides something a little taller, possibly a mid that can go forward and take a good mark - that's good drafting, provided Jones gives us what we are looking for. We shouldnt throw Gys into this comparison because in the FD's opinion he wasnt going to provide what was being looked for so his height is a moot point.

"okay men...I need you take out Morton in case he...no wait..wait...leave Morton...I need you to hobble Moloney because he will..no wait..wait..leave Moloney..Now Petterd....ahhh damn it...back to your base boys"

really ? I am 188cm but they overlooked me. I'm tipping that the discussion they DIDN'T have regarding Gys is "gee's - he is 188cm - we should keep him" I, like everyone else, have no idea whether he will or wont make it, but we can only summise and I have summised that Gys wasn't dumped because he was too short or too tall. So I am not sure why it is ironic or a source of bemusement. ( is anyone bemused or think it is ironic that we dumped CHF Cook and drafted CHF Hogan ?)

This is me ...

By weight of number of clubs in Victoria it is likely to be 4.5 times easier to return to Victoria than it is to return to an interstate club - as long as you are not overly fussed which team you come back to in Vic.

I feel the same way but am a little more reserved - I am absolutely stroked with the "tracks" that Neeld and co have laid down - they look very solid and concrete and there is no ambiguity as to where the tracks are pointing. The next step is to see how well he can make the train speed along the very fine tracks he has laid down.