DeeSpencer

Can Salem and Hibberd not read the play and react to it across half back? Their play over a number of years tells me they can. And just how dumb are Oscar, Frost and Wagner is they don’t know their set ups by now? Same goes for the midfield, surely they can work out between them where the wings and mids go. Any of the 7 defenders should be able to yell out if they are leaving gaping holes at the corridor or goal side of contests. Lewis isn’t Hodge, Simpson or McVeigh, he’s a ball winning inside mid not a sweeping flanker. Matty Boyd did it for the Dogs in 15/16 but he was dropped and then retired quickly after that because the pace was too hot for him in 2017. I just don’t know how we are still plugging away with it in 2019.

Collingwood have conjured a really good playing culture out of a FIGJAM coach who took years and a lot of talent to get a good game plan in place and a bunch of pretty unusual or even rough characters as players. I'm not sure they've got a player with an IQ above 100 (maybe Tom Phillips) but they've got some brilliant footballers and they all work exceptionally hard. Bad tattoos, Brodie/Brody's, Taylor's, Dayne's, Brayden's, Jaidyn's, Roughead's and rough heads and keeping them all together some how is the way to build a mean football side. Somehow Bucks have kept them all mostly working together (lost one in a drug ban). Throw in some great facilities and off field support and I'm not surprised Dunny loves it there. I miss what he could've been and was for us for a brief period - one heck of a key defender with a sweet long kick. I don't miss the fat bloke who was in such poor shape that Oscar McDonald took his job. Nor do I miss the decade of contract year Dunn where he'd rally from his career death bed to reinvent himself and play well just before securing another 2 year deal.

Lockhart showed his upside today with his ability to turn congestion in to space with some quick moves and hands. Plus turned a hospital kick in to a shot on goal with that pretty move at half forward to Hunt. Glad we stuck with him, his skills on both sides and nippy movement should pay dividends if he builds from today

The ball goes where rhe players go. Everyone was keen to get back, so contest was going to come inside 50 with numbers around. Melksham made a bad error not laying his kick up in to the pocket so we could hem it in. If Gawn was drawing attention Keilty and/or Tom Mc should’ve been the targets leading hard to the boundary. 1 of 1000 mistake in the last 2 minutes alone but a controllable one. Still, he was clever to waste the 30 seconds

His decision making is so slow now, he waits for the easy option to be covered. Wasn’t helped by Oscar on that crucial late turnover but he was so slow and predictable to dispose. The high risk look away kick outs aren’t worth the risk. The majority of the backline have played a lot together, I just cant buy that his leadership adds huge value. When Viney comes back I would’ve thought Jones, Gus or Fritsch should move to half back and do the same role.

It’s not that we are losing it’s the way we are losing. Richmond and Hawthorn are still playing the same way even as results haven’t been to the same level. We haven’t lost so many players that it’s impossible to field a midfield that can run both ways, a backline that can win the ball and take it away and a forward line that works together. The lack of balance at the contest - in the air or on the ground - and lack of run are both huge list and coaching issues. A team should be more than the sum of their parts, we are less

Schwab was interfering with football matters. The only thing relating to the footy department that Pert has been involved with is signing Goodwin to a long term deal, which by all accounts was a popular move. Over time Pert will shape the Footy department - mainly with funding, direct hiring of staff, decisions on facilities as well as more indirectly with leadership/staff development etc. Its just too early to judge him on that when he hasn’t made those decisions.

If there's no structural deformity it's not really significantly weaker than it was, just more painful. That pain that acts as a way to avoid further injury. You don't tackle with that side, don't land on it and avoid the very rare chance of getting heavily bumped again. He's the captain and they are still playing for pride. Shutting down every injured player and effectively tanking games and the season isn't a great plan for us either. Our fitness and medical staff have a lot of improvement required, no one on here will argue against that, but it doesn't mean they are getting everything wrong. It was a 2 week injury as soon as the bump hit Jack.

The same Selwood who spat the dummy repeatedly in last years elimination final where Viney played nearly the perfect Jack Viney game? The same Selwood who the Cats thought about putting on ice in the one year they didn't make finals and the one year he didn't play alongside (often multiple) first ballot future hall of fame midfielders? Not to mention the amount of times Selwood has turned a player about to tackle him in to a free kick before the league finally caught on to his BS. Viney needs to get his fitness right that's for sure and always be working on his kicking, handballing and decision making. Plus there's a lot of work to be done on leadership. Observing a similar player like Selwood might be part of that. But I don't ever want him not to take the game and opponents on head first, that's a large part of his game. Some better team mates and team work and Viney has shown to be an attacking weapon at times in his career, no reason he can't get back to that.

A low grade AC joint injury that's 1-2 weeks isn't really a significant risk of further injury. They strapped it back up and had him play out the game. Adrenaline lets you do that. As the swelling and soreness continues you then have to miss a week or two before playing again. I know Jack has had his issues with injury management before but I don't think this is one of them.

That would be interesting. Unfortunately clubs don’t invest smartly in Footy managers so there’s probably not a huge list of capable replacements. Ryder has been handy and Lycett has been great. Otherwise I agree. Their kids have been amazing, but the guys that made them think they had a good list - Westhoff, Boak, Ebert, Jonas, Wines, Gray have been great as well. The strength of our list in our top 10 or so players should keep us in good health as long as we can make some smart moves and nail some picks

I don't think either Goodwin or Mahoney are going anywhere, so I guess it's about changing the staff under them. Todd Viney is still listed as the list manager, but I wonder what his role actually is in terms of decision making. Jason Taylor probably has enough runs on the board, but maybe they need to mix up the guys helping him. Misson's replacement is the big one. Head of fitness is probably one of the top 5 most important people at the club. Then changes to the assistant coaches. From what I've seen in years before going to summer trainings Goodwin and Rawlings would take the main drills and be quite vocal and really keep on the players about the standards. This year seemed more relaxed which I hoped meant everything was flowing nicely but in hindsight meant things were probably slipping. Skills were decent and the effort was there but I think we just lacked the intensity, hardly a surprise looking at that now giving how many experienced players were in rehab. We need some innovative assistants but to also make sure trainings are at the standard. I still think the list is good, maybe short one A grader with some pace/skill and then just needs some running talents to replace the older guys. We aren't right up with the top 3 or so lists but I look at Port who dropped away awfully last year and then mixed things up and are now looking very good, maybe not top 4 yet but with a healthy prognosis. Port made a huge amount of win now trades the last few years and it didn't really cost them. As long as you're adding good players and developing talent you aren't too far off bouncing back.

Sorry got my PJ and Roos comments mixed up. PJ was going to get a senior footy manager, then decided to keep Mahoney once Roos came on board. Happy for Mahoney to grow in the role. I guess my question now is was PJ right? Or did Roos do enough to make sure Mahoney had everything sorted. Similarly with the assistants, yes Goodwin clearly wanted many of them, but I think Roos and Mahoney had to make sure Goodwin was picking the right people. McCartney was a logical hire to follow on from Roos as a guy with a wealth of experience, I hope it's working out that way now. Rawlings was a guy Roos kept around. A lot of the newer Goodwin hires started out when Roos was still in charge, even if Goody picked them Roos should've given his opinion. Roos got the list in a much better shape but I want to know why we've been so slow to react to the need for more run and skill in the side. Might be harsh to not spread the blame equally but the Hawks were winning flags in 13-15 with hard running wings, skills and run from the backline and multiple pressure small forwards. Roos left us with Hunt and Hibberd firing at half back but Stretch and Bugg on the wings? Garlett as the only small forward? I'm not so much anti Roos I just think this season is still within the lag time of his legacy. It's not Goodwin coming in and destroying Roos' work, it's their shared legacy going balls up. If Roos really got things heading in the right direction then we should bounce back next year!

Our 3 biggest issues: 1. Fitness and injuries: The club has hinted at times about reviewing the fitness program but never made a move on Misson 2. Skill development: Roos oversaw most of the current assistant coach appointments 3. List management: keeping over the hill veterans and cloggers, not enough focus on speed and run. Why? Probably because Roos and Goodwin have been so insistent on contested ball rather than take chances on kids with upside. Josh Mahoney in charge of the footy department rather than the initial plan of Roos getting an experienced head to stay on after he went. I can't imagine Neil Balme being pleased with the way we play at the moment, I think he would've done wonders getting Goody and the recruiting team on a path to success. Roos' legacy was meant to be using his knowledge and connections to train up a coaching and football department. As it stands Neeld bought in Jason Taylor, Misson and reassigned Mahoney and all 3 have probably done a good job on the whole but have hit some troubled waters of late. The main Roos appointment left is Ben Matthews as the midfield coach.

The game changed and big bodied crash and bash mids are now too slow to play in the same side as each other. The defend before attack line was straight PR. We didn't know how to defend under Roos, we just flooded back and took the pace out of games. Our midfield worked very hard defensive and took down some big names but it wasn't a consistent defensive strategy. It was when Goodwin took over for round 23 2015 and 2016 that we finally added some zone defending and became a team playing proper AFL football with a 2 way focus. I'm not a Roos basher. He did phenomenally well in a tough gig. I just don't buy his catch phrases.

I somewhat agree, although Dunn was fat as a house and couldn't run. Had a few personal issues that summer I'm led to believe. And now his career is likely over. The lack of development of key backs - Frost and Oscar and otherwise - under Roos and since remains an issue. We should've stocked up on plenty of talls and had them come through the pipeline. Not superstars, just solid defenders. I'm also concerned Oscar and ANB were very Roos picks instead of going for talent. And somehow one of the great rebounding tall defenders of all time couldn't convince Jeremy Howe he was a defender, nor value his game. If Howe stays we never chase Lever. There's also the cost of bringing in guys like Hibberd, Melk, Garlett, Bugg, Vince etc to get instant improvement - much needed but has cost us valuable picks now.

FB: Hibberd Oscar Hore HB: J Wagner Frost Salem C; Stretch Oliver Brayshaw HF: Petracca Keilty Hunt FF: T. Smith Preuss Garlett Foll: Gawn Harmes Melksham Int: Fritsch Lockhart Sparrow Jones Out: Viney (inj), T Mc (inj), Weid, Lewis, ANB In: Sparrow, Oscar, Preuss, J Wagner, Keilty No point playing injured players, no point playing Lewis. May as well go back taller up forward to hopefully stop Sicily taking 85 marks. Keep the focus on heavy rotations with the midfield and give young Sparrow a job on O'Meara for part of the game at least. Edit: Tommy's tendinitis might be ok after a longer break so he probably stays in, wouldn't mind the idea of him starting back but swapping with Keilty if by some miracle we aren't out of the game at half time.

Clear sling tackle. No concussion = no penalty. Clear facial treatment. No free kick, no retaliation. Just weak. How they didn't fly the flag when Stretch was cleaned up was beyond me. Maybe they were all worried after Razor Ray told them all off last week.

Even last year I wasn't a huge Brayshaw fan. Great hands around the contest and can rack the ball up but I'll forever be concerned he's slow and can't kick. Runs with the ball but can't break free and then kicks under pressure = turnover = struggling to transition. I'd absolutely weigh up off load him for line breaking speed and skill if it were on offer. Moving Gus to a wing last night was an indication they are concerned about his defensive running and/or defensive pressure at the contest and ball use. The Oliver, Viney, Brayshaw combination doesn't seem right for where the game is going with multiple midfielders who have elite endurance and speed. That said, I'd like to know just how fit Clarrie, Gus and Viney are, if they are all at 80% then the easier thing to do is get them fit.

I thought our forwards worked their backsides off defensively. Lockhart/ANB/Hunt/T Smith in particular. It's the quality of forward entries and the ease of the defenders to win the ball back that created very little at ground level. Bombs to 2 on 1's for easy intercepts for Grimes/Vlastuin, or lowering the eyes then kicking it straight to a Richmond player because our forwards are all leading back and in to each other instead of a mix that involves some of them presenting up and keeping their opponents honest. The few times we did have forwards coming up at the ball the mid/backs were then under pressure and hacked a kick to where their team mate had just led from. Of course a lot of that comes because our midfield has no forward momentum, we can't get the ball to someone in the clear from stoppages and we can't do it in general play because the backline offers no drive or rebound.

He sure did, dropped a few he should've taken but at least got separation and hands to it. Sam is jumping nowhere near it. It's time to give Keilty a go as well.

Fitness looks really poor and his confidence is shot, but for hecks sake at least last week he had a run and jump at some. Tonight was just ridiculous seeing him lead back, across and absolutely no where near leading up to the ball carrier. The only time he had a decent contest under a kick there were multiple team mates dragging their opponent to him. Awful game, and time for him to go back to the 2's, but probably can't judge everything on tonight or on any games this year given how bad we've been. He can't be getting good coaching or an efficient forward set up.

Exactly, at least give it a go. The only game our mids stuck with their opponents was against the Swans - and suddenly our forward line looked dangerous and our backline looked capable. In current form ANB isn't tackling, using the ball or running to the right spots to be of any use as a forward, but maybe using his legs we can get some value from him.

Would actually like to see ANB played in the centre square and given the freedom to run all over the ground. Test some of the Tigers mids for fitness. I know he'll be ineffective with the ball but it's not like we are dominating clearances as is. Then our actual mids can all spend more time resting forward and play at a higher work rate when in the middle. The wings have copped a lot of the blame for the lack of transition running but if you watch the games it's actually Oliver, Brayshaw and Viney who are even further behind play. Harmes is about the only one sticking with it.

Hard to get enthused about those ins but it's about the best we can do. If Lewis is going to play then it has to be down back as the 7th quickest defender. So Josh Wagner makes way. Unlucky for Josh but he'll have a chance to earn his spot back and whilst my mind is made up that Lewis is done the coaches probably think he's worth another look I guess. Hunt probably goes back to replace Jetta with more speed coming in to the forward line in Jeffy. Stretch comes in on a wing in the spot vacated by Lewis going back, that's obvious. Lockhart as fresh legs for C Wagner. ANB for Spargo probably the only choice I didn't love but if there was ever a game to pick the fittest player on the list it's when both teams are coming off a 4 day break. And I never liked Preuss and 2 big tall forwards who offer nothing defensively. Tim Smith makes a lot more sense as the 3rd option. Can chuck him in the ruck if needed or use Tom or Sam.