DeeSpencer

There's a rule about allowing the other ruck a chance to jump at the ball but as long as Grundy is under the bounce/throw up and goes for the ball then I wouldn't penalise him for taking up space. The interesting this is the 1m rule now that says both rucks have to separate. If both rucks want the same position I guess they have to split it half half then fight for it once the ball goes up? Unfortunately Preuss is rubbish and maybe someone like Vanders is injured because if I were coaching against Grundy I'd absolutely rough him up. The Eagles did it to Gawn but he was very sore after 2 big finals, that they then did it to Grundy in the granny was even better and worked a treat.

No thanks, the last thing we need to do now is hand out undeserved debuts. If a new player is to get a chance it should be Jordon but even then it would be getting pretty desperate. They won't play well. About the best that can happen is they kick a goal and we all get a bit excited but it's adding a number to the jumper list for no reason.

You'd think Hore, Lockhart and Stretch would only have to get through the game and perform at an ok level to get picked in the seniors next week, although the Sunday to Friday turn around is less than ideal. With Box Hill losing today a win would put Casey in the 8, although they'd need Box Hill to lose one of the last 2 against the Blues or Pies due to the final round bye.

Gawn won't be. Too many good mids and even though it was a bit of a 0-0 draw today they'll give the points to Grundy, call it a split for the year and give him the spot based on games where he racks up a bunch of handballs and uncontested marks on the back flank rather than doing his job and getting down the line.

Disappointing we couldn't keep the scoreboard ticking just a little in the 2nd and 3rd to make a game of it. But it is what it is. The same errors keep occurring and we'll likely keep occurring until the side gets a fresh start next year. The midfield is so one paced they are forced to drop the wingman at centre bounces to stop a quick burst out. No issues with that plan. Apart from a drop off in intensity in the middle quarters when Oliver was off or forward and Viney got tired they did a pretty decent job. We just have to get in about 4 fresh bodies in around the midfield mix who can make smart decisions about how/when to run, can lay some tackles and can keep pressure up. Forward line did about the best they could. Fritsch and Petracca looked excellent but were supported with stuff all. The defensive aspects are a mess. Kick outs the most excusable that there's no plan at all. Backline - mostly did ok against an undermanned forward line but still a lack of cohesion and trust with the talls. Lever kept getting dragged deep because the midfield and forwards couldn't hold position. Hunt can't lay a tackle or break a line so he's not valuable down back even though we need someone with pace. Hibberd's lost it. Jones has lost it. Salem's going through the motions after carrying the backline pretty well for about 15 weeks. This isn't fun or good for anyone but it is what it is and we've just got to get through the last 2 weeks. Hopefully May's injury isn't serious. Hopefully the way Petty's carrying his shoulder isn't serious and it can all be over soon.

Preuss hasn't been good up forward but in the one chance he got in the ruck he did the job. We're stuck with him for a while so I'd be looking at finding the next guy rather than rushing out to replace Preuss with a different older back up for a year or two.

Looks to me like he's lost a yard of pace or hard running, the Hawks have used him at half back a fair bit this year and he's kicking more end on end floaters than ever. If we want a pure outside runner we'd be better off looking at Brandon Ellis who has some flaws but as a free agent in his prime could do the job. There's plenty of other alternatives as well. Whatever we do we shouldn't involve pick 2 or go after a 31 year old.

The reason they keep losing - particularly after the first month of the season - is because they are so young, not because they lack talent. They have a pick 3 from last year who hasn't even got on the park. Their list is far more talented than Melbourne and Carlton at the same stage. That's the argument against a priority pick. If the AFL wants to help them improve quickly then help them sign some free agents or mature players.

Not sure about that, I think you have to fit most of it in the salary cap if you want the list spot. With 2 years left on his contract Vanders might well be redrafted the rookie list even if he does retire in order to spread the payments. If that's the case unless he really is done and happy to call it you might as well keep him on the list and can then put him on the inactive list prior to the season or prior to the mid season draft. All in all it's probably better to give him the summer to see if he gets right.

I said it earlier in this thread but I'll say it again. The supplemental list period allows clubs to have guys train with them before officially being listed. That's the move for Bennell. If his body holds up all summer and he's ready to play by March that's when you give him a contract.

Forget what he brings with his superb tackling and grunt - even if it comes with some shoddy kicking and decision making - he's proven capable of playing on the wing when so many others on the list can't and he's been part of a run of terrible injuries at that position. Vanders - out for the year with the foot Fritsch - needed to play back and now forward KK - missed pretty much all year with groin/concussion/concussion Stretch - foot JKH - misses the first 10 weeks with a knee Even young Nietschke who might've been an option did an ACL The best thing to see before this year was Fritsch and KK nailing inside 50 kicks on the wings in match simulation and knowing Vanders could provide that big body to rotate on the wing, forward and on ball. None of that's come true.

I'm not sure Beams is an A grader anymore. I think he's on about par with what Brayshaw should be doing but isn't and not that far off what Vanders could be doing, although that seems unlikely to happen again. We lack the competence that Mayne and Phillips bring to the wing for the Pies, that's our first area of deficiency. Then we're clearly inferior up forward. McDonald and Weidemen should provide us more than Mihocek and Cox but are both missing. Melksham probably equal if not better WHE when fully fit. Petracca and Fritsch are probably the closest thing to De Goey and Stephenson but they are different types of players. We're definitely short a dangerous crumber and some half forward class. Varcoe, Thomas and Elliot have all had their struggles this year but at least they are options and that's where the depth of our list has fallen away, but again, the guys we've had in those roles - Hannan, Spargo, Garlett, Lockhart - have all had a lot to overcome this year. Except for ANB, he's been a huge disappointment. Hunt's been ok, he's had moments of looking dangerous and good pressure. I'm not trying to defend the club for some of the list management, recruiting, coaching, injury management etc, but to me it's just not apples with apples to say both teams have similar injury lists now so should be playing similarly.

McDonald - DeGoey (best forward) Cox - Weideman Jetta - Langdon (back pocket) Beams/Sier (can’t play both) - Vanders Stevenson - Hannan Aish - Stretch or Joel Smith or Garlett or Spargo Moore - ? Lever Wells -KK - both theoretical afl players at this stage Not quite an equal comparison but not too far off if Lever doesn’t play. But I take issue with the idea that we are meant to be able to perform to the same level as a Collingwood side that: 1) was better than us last year and 2) has had a decent run for most of this year until recently. Our backline hasn’t had a chance to gel. When Moore and Howe both came out for the Pies they fell apart. Our inside mids have been short on fitness all year. It can’t just change. The Pies without Adams and Beams/Sier were shown up, but Pendles, Treloar and Sidebottom have been mostly healthy. Our outside mids have been a mess, how do fix it without talent? Our forward line has also been a mess. Part of that was coaching, but mostly talent. I’d like to see Fritsch, Melksham and Petracca do something against an undermanned Collingwood but without a tall to work around it might be hard. Look at the guys we are bringing in - Baker who didn’t do a preseason, JKh who missed 10 weeks, Dunkley signed mid year, Lockhart from Casey preseason. Hore who had ankle surgery In summer and recently broke his collar bone. Petty as a key forward. Lewis as a forward. The missing players might be in the Pies favour but the journey to where both teams are at isn’t.

Mid year he missed a couple of weeks and their were rumours he needed hip ops. First I've heard of it since though. Broken jaw may be a blessing in disguise if they were waiting to do them.

What????? A coach can be 70, morbidly obese and spend half their time on a mobility scooter and still do the job. 67 year old Bill Belichick or big Red Andy Reid wouldn't make good NFL assistants? Or 70 year old Greg Popovich in the NBA? Daniel Cross is a physical freak capable of doing rehab group training. Any else who's retired has almost instantly lost the ability chase, pressure and reproduce drills at AFL players levels. It's good to have fit and healthy younger coaches who can feed the balls in and demonstrate body positions but assistant coaches by and large aren't joining in drills. It's demonstrate the techniques then use the group of 40+ players to execute the drills. I'd be trying to bring a complimentary group in alongside Goodwin. A coach with experience like Richo makes sense, no one else on the MFC staff can give Goodwin advice on how to deal with senior coaching issues. And a young on the rise assistant with fresh ideas and ambition would make sense too. I'd take a close look at the non Victorian teams and look for a coach keen to come to Melbourne on the path to a senior job, that's Teague and Rhyce Shaw's pathway as well as another higher rated assistant in Justin Longmuir.

Maybe we won't trade him. Or maybe we've finally learnt a thing or two about negotiations. I'd trade him for a good deal, but I don't know about his mental state, confidence, fitness/health and any number of things that could be impacting his form that might be easier to fix than I think.

He's had some deeper forward moments lately, he isn't really getting any loose ball as a forward and with our ball movement I struggle to see him winning a lot of contests. Not to mention we can't have 2 Lewis' just cheating forward and hoping it works. Tagging worked against the Eagles, but he's not a great fit for Treloar and he's priority number 1 to stop carving us up through the middle. Pendles maybe? Half back is where he can find plenty of it and doesn't have to think too much, just stick to a man, get the ball and feed it out wide.

Pretty clear it's pushed not walked. But that doesn't mean it's a falling out as such. Macca had issues at the Dogs, but as much as anything they didn't win enough games, you don't win games and you move a coach on for the same kind of problems that can be fine if you're winning. Plus failing as a senior coach doesn't have a lot of bearing as an assistant. If it did then people wouldn't be nearly as excited as they seem to be for Bolton or Richardson.

A few people here unfamiliar with the concepts of either: A) Contracts And/or B) The footy department salary cap Not all of Rawlings, Chaplin, Mathews, Plapp etc will be going. Nor should they be. This is still the coaching group that had us playing some very good footy last year.

From watching trainings Macca was an important voice who stressed the fundamentals and had a good relationship with players where he'd boost them up or give them a rev depending on what was needed. I think the shame here is instead of sticking with a well defined role we moved him around and probably ended up having him in the way. Whoever we bring in we need to make sure the roles are clearly defined, that everyone is on board with the game plan and that training is well rounded.

Gus has 3 more years on what I assume is a pretty decent contract, are we sure anyone even wants to trade for him? If he was at another club I wouldn't be racing out to get him with anything like a top 25 pick. Especially given his concussion history it would be a huge risk based around a number of games in 2018 where he was really prolific and strong at winning the ball but hardly all that skilled. Right now he just doesn't have any pace or confidence. I'd probably play him half back and have the game come to him, he'll get some easy touches by reading the play and winning it. See if that keeps it simple for him for the last 3 weeks. Otherwise it has to be a lack of confidence and physical limitations because he looks so far off it. It's going to take some Darren Burgess miracle work and if it does go to plan that will mean more fitness and burst for Viney, Oliver, Petracca and Harmes as well and then they can all rotate through.

Exactly. Lever, Hore and Oscar in the same backline against the Tigers would've been terrible and only 1 of those was some chance of playing on Riewoldt so they put poor Oscar in to do it. And even though Hore is a mature player with plenty of VFL footy under his belt it probably doesn't kill him to go back and get 30 kicks. If we do play Lever and Hore together - and I think we should this week - then they both have to be ball users and provide rebound. I'm never been on the Lever is a superstar track but he's shown some really promising signs against West Coast, St Kilda and in the first half yesterday. These games are important to get his confidence and some game time in to him before next season. The idea he should've sat out half a season when healthy to make it the best part of 2 years missed is crazy.

The only case for giving them pick 2 is that they aren't a viable football club without it, in which case you have to ask if they are a viable football club with it? Would be making an absolute mockery of the competition given their list and results are both better than when Melbourne and Carlton were knocked back for a priority pick after 2 win seasons. If they really want pick 2 to get the best mates in together and fix player retention there's a very easy solution - they can trade Ben King (who sounds desperate to get out of their immediately) to us for pick 2. If we aren't interested in that straight up they can add Izak Rankine, Ben Ainsworth or Charlie Ballard for our future first. Or Bowes, or Martin, or Sexton, or Fiorini, or Powell, or Weller, or Lukosius in some deal. Compare those names to the list Roos took over at Melbourne, they are miles ahead. They have a stack of talent. Giving them even more in the hope they all stick is the exact reason PP's were taken out, teams can get it right and then they rocket to the top. Sliding them extra salary cap room in ambassador payments and having then nab a few handy free agents or good solid B grade players is the way to fairly turn them around with the young players they have already and pick 1.

Can we just start banning people who suggest Frost on the wing? It's absolutely ridiculous.

Out: Oscar, Lewis (rested), Preuss In: May, Hore, Lockhart Hore in down back, Hunt back forward. If Lever's no good then either Hunt/Brayshaw at half back and bring in Stretch. FB: Hibberd May Frost HB: Hore Lever Salem C: JKH Oliver Baker HF: Dunkley Melksham Petracca FF: Hunt Fritsch Petty Foll: Gawn Harmes Viney Int: Brayshaw, C Wagner, Jones, Lockhart Go small and quick up forward. Petty can ruck for 5 minutes a quarter against Cox.