Adam The God

Ah, gotcha. Well, I agree we're in a good position to do it now, because of who we've got at the helm. But Neeld certainly broke something open. He calved the group in two and created a gulf between himself and the players. The definition of a poor environment and therefore a festering cesspool that was only going to get worse. He was as divisive as a progressivist at a meeting of Young Liberals. The only reason we are now able to nip this cultural issue in the bud is Paul Roos. I'm glad the likes of Moloney and Sylvia are gone, but it certainly could have been handled more sensitively, professionally and caused less division. Anyway, I may have opened a can of worms there, but let's hope the culture is on the improve from here on out.

How do you know they haven't?

Nail on the head, sir.

I agree. Just dispute that Pedersen is a culture changer. Let's hope he can improve though.

I was thinking about him today and wondering whether they might make him midfield coach. Well, well, well. Good times.

Culture changer and "lean & mean" is probably not something I would associate with Pedersen though.

Possibly. How about we agree that neither are convincing AFL players at the moment?

I think there is a fine balance to be met here. I trust Paul Roos and those that are in place around him, to get it right. On the one had, we must be level-headed and ensure we don't act like a desperate basket-case. However (and obviously this is speculation on my behalf) there's absolutely no doubt Chip has/is considering the possibility of leaving. Mahoney mentioned earlier in the year that we were trying to put an offer together for Chip and yet we've heard nothing. I'll leave it at that, but we must get our ship in order and obviously this is what the AFL have been conscious of since round 2. I'll be confident of retaining Chip if we improve next year and we offer him a big, long-term contract. RFA is on our side this time, so we have the power, which is fortunate, given it could be his final contract.

For the record, I'm neither here nor there with Pedersen. He's no better or worse than Dunn or Tapscott. I'd prefer he wasn't on our list, but there are quite a few of those and until we improve substantially, we will struggle to attract decent players to replace these guys.

I agree, but blokes like Garland improved. AFL is too short for a mature-aged recruit to come in and struggle to impact straight away. He hardly cemented himself in one of the worst sides of all time.

I was gonna say. Col Sylvia was not pick #2.

I wouldn't say we're playing hardball, BB. We're just not being ridiculously stupid. It was a rubbish proposed trade in hope from GWS and we would have been stupid to take it. I know it's a word people don't like on this site, but "elite" or "capable of elite" is what we're after with this pick. Otherwise, we go to the draft.

Not that it's his fault, but I'd say his three year contract has played a role in the frustration of supporters. There's also the fact that he's had bugger all impact onfield too.

Right. Well, I don't think Woewodin was anywhere near being a star. He had one top season, IMO. He may have had good seasons around that, but I guess I'm not as happy to anoint players "stars". I loved Neita, but even his "star" status is tenuous, and he was twice the player Woewodin was.

Was Shane Woewodin a star? One top season does not a star player make. Barry Hall had a solid midfield in front of him. As it turned out, a premiership winning one. Overrated. Good player, but not a star.

I'd agree to an extent. I just hope we're not repeating the mistakes of the '03 draft all over again.

We'll agree to disagree then, P.

Goodes was the only star. O'Loughlin was a good, solid player. Not a star though.

Thanks for that, Ron. I reckon the Hawks will be Chip's biggest suitor next off season. I think he'll stay though. We have so much cap space that we'll be able to offer him $700,000 comfortably and front load the hell out of it. I'd offer him a five year deal and he can finish his days at the MFC. He's a pillar and I reckon you risk five year deals on those guys, particularly with the ability to front-load contracts and essentially lessen the risk with every subsequent year. I'd offer Hogan $500,000 for five years too, during '14, but that's for another thread.

No one has said we're even entertaining this trade. Let's just take it easy, shall we? GWS may have proffered it, but nowhere that I've read even suggests we're remotely interested. Further, knowing this time of year, it's probably mindless speculation.

Now that's an interesting one. Given Myers is younger. Who would we prefer?

I just find Treloar a little outside for our needs at the moment. I've always found him a really smooth-mover though, with good disposal and pace.

Keep your current one. It's a beauty.

I can see where you're coming from with this comparison, rpfc, but IMO Howe's field-kicking is nowhere near O'Keefe's. Work-rate and discipline can be worked on, but field-kicking has that ceiling.

I'd put Watters in the same basket as Neeld. No, thanks.