george_on_the_outer

Welcome back to Raymondo, who has joined the group again in 2007

There is no doubt that Adem Yze got plenty of games last year simply because the club had no other options due to injuries. Remember the last couple of rounds, when we had Godders 426, and Phil Read getting games? And we were fortunate that we had kids like Bartram, Dunne,Bate, Bell and CJ fit and playing well enough to be selected on a regular basis. So let's not write off Adem yet. Yes his position in the side is under threat. Yes he has to show something to justify his continued selection. But even at this stage we have Bartram, Frawley, Wheatley, Sylvia and now Dunne probably missing for round 1. So who would get a run in the seniors ahead of Adem, even if you wanted to drop him? He'll be there round 1, but as these other players return......

Thanks to Judee who has signed on again for 2007

Also: # Chewy also has a lot of compatriots in the Hawthorn membership numbers, so he won't seem out of place # But Chewy may be at risk of being identified, because he has teeth # He is a great scout because unlike most of their supporters he has 2 eyes # He is prepared to put his nose into areas where others would not go

None at all. For those of us who have been around a long time, while we remember fondly turning up early to watch the U19's and ressies before the main game, the reality is that the grounds cannot cope with the damage, particularly in winter ( if it ever rains again ). Also when do you play the ressies game for a club playing on Friday night?. No as Jack said we won't be going back there, and to see a reserves side, you will in all likelihood be heading to Princes park or the Western Oval or Junction oval.

I hope the re-building never ends, because that is the secret to long term success. Does West Coast go chasing people like Everitt or Jolly or Polak ? No, they grow their own, knowing they will have them for 10 years. Now I haven't got the exact statistics in front of me, but the WCE finals appearances is something frightening like 15 out of the past 17 years! Or do you follow the Richmond approach who thought they were close around 7 or 8 years ago, recruited a serious of discards hoping to get them over the line, and are still paying for it today. The are still trying to find the future replacements for those same players. But they will never find them, because when you finish in the middle of the table constantly you don't have the draft picks to trade, and you don't have the draft picks to get the best on offer. Despite what most people think, not too much quality is ever traded. Finals appearances? Once or twice in the past 20 years! Or do you completely tank it..ala St.Kilda and Hawthorn? It certainly gets you some fantastic players, but as has been seen at St.Kilda, there is more to winning a flag than that. Lady luck and injury can determine the difference between ultimate success and abject failure....or to put it another way: the best laid plans of mice and men......... Finals appearances? A couple here and there with some awfully long gaps in between. In the meantime kills the supporters and the club. We have a strong chance of success while Neitz is playing. However, as others have said, we will only lose a couple of people of the next few years due to retirement. Our chances will remain. The long term sustainable rebuilding approach is better, simply because while it doesn't guarantee success, it does give you the best possible chance.

We had all better get used to seeing this type of play in action. It is being used by other teams in the NAB cup, Hawthorn as an example last night. It is used to beat the flood!!! At the moment it is poorly executed which makes it doubly worse. The real concern is that it is turning the game into a game of baskeball or netball, just instead of throwing it we handball it. So we see a pack of 30 men running from one end of the field to the other handballing it among themselves. The AFL failed to introduce rules against the flood and this is the result! Believe me, football will not be pleasant to look at this year.

sorry Chief...but we aren't blooding a young side. Unlike previous years pre-season, when the likes of Davey, Bate, Dunn, Rivers, McLean, Jones, and Bartram stood up and said "you must pick me", I see nothing this year. Buckley is a maybe, but is he in the starting 22? No. Garland, Frawley, Petterd and Weetra show promise but not for 2007. Jones, Mclean and Maloney were there last year, they are already "blooded". Yes they will get better, but that is not the case for players like Brown, Holland, White, Bizzel and Neitz. Their best is behind them. So we will have essentially the same side going into 2007. I don't know what the game was like because second hand reports are nothing like being there. But we lost by 10 goals again! We have won 2 of our last 9 outings! We can't go into the season proper without a winning mentality. And we cannot afford the luxury of the Swans approach to the pre-season as they didn't lose 7 of their last 9 games. I want to be proven wrong, believe me, but at the moment I cannot see any evidence which indicates we have improved since last year.

Thanks to John T and Bernie H who have signed up again, for the 2007 season.

First time tonight that we saw the new "run and carry" game plan.......I hope that we still need time to perfect the execution, but it failed miserably tonight in my opinion. Run and carry implies two things- running and carrying. Neither happened, apart from running into the opposition wall. The handpassing to static players was rampant. I know the intent is to release a player, but like the "give and go" in basketball ( on which this seems to be based ) is that both players must be in motion. And unlike basketball you can be tackled, so you don't give to someone unless they are in a better position than you. The other downside is that based on tonights effort, it absolutely crucifies the forwards. Instead of a kick to a leading forward, the back and forward handpassing means they cannot lead, because they never know when it is coming. Even a scrubby kick out of the centre is to the advantage of a forward who is in front of his man. That is one of the reasons that Miller hardly got a touch. Neitz despite 2 goals was in the same position. Fortunately, the NAB cup was the time to experiment, because we had a far superior forward line to their backs, and this tactic should not be used again when that is the case. Happy with the performance of Buckley, who was the best of the new blood. Hughes showed nothing with the opportunities he had, and was a long way out of the game. Warnock got a bath, especially when on Franklin in the last ( he only kicks on his left son!). Frawley got a taste of the big time, and we will see him playing in 2008, not this year. Not unexpectedly we got what we already know about Brown, Ward, Bizzell and Godfrey.

Contributions received from Tim_ and Demon o Phile thanks guys, welcome to the group

Correct, it is CJ in that clip. Chris is also featured in a couple of the stills. He has a tape on his knee. Both Fan and I had problems trying to differentiate between the two all day, although Buckley without his top on is far more muscled. We were utterly confused by Godfrey who kept changing tops with others.....for a while we thought Heath Neville was an inside ball-magnet.

We now have 2 clubs ( before the season starts ) with serious off-field problems. North has largely gone under the journo's radar, with a board member sending solicitors letters to the coach etc.... So we will have evidence to either prove or disprove the various theories by season end (or earlier )

I have put up a report and photos and video of todays training at Moorabbin on Demonology

Thanks to those that have signed up so far: Rono re-equitates Rollinson 65 George_on_the_outer Brian and Shirley Booth dees of 26 Tim Holland undeeniable

..as one who writes a little for 'ology and who has been to a number of training sessions this year and in the past it is difficult to give DD36 and others something to "chew on" A training session is just that. When we report about it, the items of interest are: 1. who is injured and who is recovering from injury and the progress of their recovery. 2. whether anyone during the session is playing a role different to normal 3. where the newer players, particularly the most recent recruits are "playing" in the exercises 4. the types of drills employed, and are these different from previous years 5. any obvious phsical changes There is not a training report from any club about their players which isn't full of positives, because to use an old cliche, it is like dancing with your sister. It's not the real thing! No pressure from opposition trying to bury you in the ground. No physical aggression, because players don't want to injure team mates ( and neither do the coaches). No opposition tactics. So how do you report about a Hughes, Bode, Frawley, Petterd? They do the drills, they participate in all the exercises, they may look a bit bigger than last year ( but show me a kid who doesn't after 12 months at an AFL side ). And that's it! It's the same as there is little mention of Green, Miller, Godfrey, Junior, Robbo, White, Neitz etc. They are just out there doing the drills, building the body, keeping fit.....just the same as everybody else. We could write reports that X is training the house down, that Y is flying, that Z has lost weight and has build strength and muscle instead, that A has never had better times on the tan, that B is enjoying the new regime at his new club, but it is best left for the Punt Road End or the Lulie Street Dash. Are these juniors any better than last year? We won't find out until the first inter club or NAB cup game, or even the first Sandy match. Then you can form your own opinion. But in the meantime, they are not injured, they look a little bigger than last year, they're playing where we expect, and they are completing the sessions.

Dees of 26 and others....... We have secured Clint Bartram as our sponsored player for 2007. I am just finalising some details with the club, but I expect to put something out very soon. It will be a similar package as last year, with presentations from Craig Cameron on our recruiting as well. I anticipate the sponsorship to be about the same as last year i.e. $110. I am trying to organise an event with Clint early on, so if you wish to be part of this we will need people signed up early. Thanks for the interest, and we are hoping to get a lot more people involved as all the money ultimately goes back to the club. Those that have been part of the group would say that it is the best $110 football value for money they get.

Hard to see but I think it is Davey... from the front Bruce, Jones, Junior, Davey, TJ, ?, Godfrey, Brock, Bode, Yze Second thoughts based on the 4th last photo of what appears to be the same running group, it is CJ. Also notice how Godders and Brock have worked forward, being 2 of the best runners at the club.

Also agree, what a great thread. There would appear to be 2 schools of thought about Premiership success. 1. the top up theory 2. the progressive theory. 1. The top up theory. Based on the infamous clock it would seem to suggest that when you "feel" that you are close to a premiership, then you recruit older more experienced players to get you over the line. Does it work? I can't find any evidence in the past 6 years. Collingwood did a fantastic job of getting a large group of players from other clubs together that got them to 2 GF's. 3 years later they face implosion as that group are about to retire, and unless you are in a prime trading position i.e. bottom 3, then you cannot rebuild without pain. St. Kilda have tried it, to this point unsuccessfully. Richmond thought they were close a couple of years ago, and only managed to recruit a series of old duds, but then their assessment of their actual position was overstated. Brisbane, Port, Sydney...where are the quality players they topped up with? Yes they picked up a couple of average also rans that may have filled gaps, but did the likes of Darren Jolly really get them over the line? And let's be really serious here...how many genuinely good players are traded? Yes, there have been some, Stevens, Woewodin, Pickett. But for each of them there is a Hay or Rawlings. You simply will not get a good genuine KPP, which makes the statements that you see around the fan sites at this time of year simply laughable..."we only need a solid mid-fielder and a genuine FB to win a Premiership" 2. The progressive theory. Just keep on taking the best kids in the draft and although it takes a long time, maybe 10 years, you finish with a constant stream of ability coming through. West Coast and Adelaide seem to have this as the basis of their recruiting, and we Victorians keep asking how they keep producing these good kids. Hawthorn are doing it, but they are probably 5 years behind us. I think this is the direction that our club has been following now for some time. This year we had Bartram and Jones play in the year following the draft, but we had Bate and Dunn show their goods as well. We have now put together a series of first class selections and developed them over a number of years, to the point that we have now a good age and experience profile throughout the list. This will ensure constant top level performances, which increases the chances of success and avoids the drop to the bottom. Much more preferable from a supporters perspective as well. So if that is the case why did we select Pickett? Probably because the talent available in last years draft was limited. We used our top pick wisely and then made a more solid investment with the next one, rather than a gamble on someone without high credentials. I predict that we will seek to trade well this year- average players for other average playrs, but will stick with the picks that we have to be used on more youth.