Rhino Richards

Absolutely spot on WUL. Geez it hard for young kids to follow a side like MFC that gets whopped every week. We need to build a side for sustainable success not fleeting bursts of one to two weeks of glory.

Yes. I dont rate Jamar or PJ as ruckman. Jamar has limited impact in the centre, has poor decision making and does zip around the ground. PJ works very hard around the ground and gives a spirited display. He just cant ruck. He is a 200cm midfielder who is limited when the ball is above shoulder height. If we were getting Warnock, I'd trade PJ. For what the Bulldogs needed in the centre to compliment their midfield, Hudson is perfect as the bullocking ruckman. He is no Dean Cox but has shored a hole that was in the Bulldogs side.

I thought most of the non OP injuries were contact or collision injuries last year.

Interesting Points: 1. Carlton gets a sniff of upside and they get nearly 40,000 members. 2. Bombers have had an incredible unherald increase in a post Sheedy era. 3. Freo has over 40,000 members. So much pain so little culture. 4. Hawks and Cats have really turn things around in the past few years. I wonder how much m/ship upside there is for the Cats. 5. I would have expected the Bullies to be higher this year. Interesting to see the numbers they get for 2009.

Total Memberships for each Club CROWS 48,720 (This Year) 50,976 (Last Year) -4.4% (Change) LIONS 22,737 21,976 3.5% BLUES 39,360 35,431 11.1% MAGPIES 42,498 38,587 10.1% BOMBERS 41,947 32,759 28.0% FREMANTLE 43,366 43,343 0.1% CATS 36,850 30,169 22.1% HAWKS 41,436 31,064 33.4% KANGAROOS 32,600 22,366 45.8% DEMONS 29,619 28,077 5.5% POWER 34,185 34,073 0.3% TIGERS 30,820 30,044 2.6% SAINTS 30,063 30,394 -1.1% SWANS 26,721 28,764 -7.1% EAGLES 44,863 45,949 -2.4% BULLDOGS 28,306 28,725 -1.5%

Agree. When I look at MFC's list at the end of last year and the start of this year what player strengths did we have that you could build a viable and successful game plan around? Our list has fundamental flaws and we need to improve the lack of skills and decision making that is endemic within the team. No game plan covers those shortcomings.

I dont think Roos values White's capabilities. He did not seem to in 2004 when he was chasing a ruckman. He paid hard for Jolly and was not interested in White. And with the rule change, White has been frequently pantsed by Sydney in recent years. If Everitt does retire, they will trade for a ruckman. But they will trade for a ruckman that is or will be AFL standard in 2009 and beyond. They will trade for a ruckman who will compliment their game plan of tight contests, physical bullocking within contests and a high number of ruck duels. White offers them nothing in those areas. Nor can White move forward or back in a game. They would be better off scooping up Peter Street. At least he gives them an extra 16 cm in height. Now why would Sydney trade for a 195cm "short" ruckman who cant cut it in a bottom club, who's performance is in sharp decline and who has no physical impact arund the centre circle who is out of contract? If MFC can arrange a trade for White they should do it in a flash.

White is out of contract in October. Why would they trade for a declining sub AFL ruckman whose only strength was neutered by the 2004 rule change rather than pick him up for free in the PSD if they were actually interested?

Agree but unfortunately some are doing so.

Its naive to think that because White has played well against Club it creates value above and beyond any other performance he has put in. Strange things happen but Clubs arent that stupid these days. The WBs were not switched on for a game against a nagging cellar dweller and are focussed on the Cats game. Johnson and Cooney all had poor games. However I dont see the need to condemn them for one poor game like you do Hudson. I'll measure him over the year and he has been a great pick up so far for the Dogs. Hudson is not a brilliant technician but performs the role required of giving a contest at centre bounces and creating space for other players with the body on body work. And Adelaide have Griffen, Maric and Biglands. They could afford to shop Hudson around as there is every expectation that Griffen and Maric will be quite good rucks as they mature. FWIW, its worth Hudson has rucked more than 50% of the time this year with Minson pinch hitting as required. And filling Street's shoes is going to be a big one. He played 12 games last year and has not been called upon this year. I dont see them fussing too much about getting a ready made ruckman. You have to understand that ruckwork is far more than taps. Sandilands gets 40+ taps a game and his impact is zip because his decision making is poor, his mobility is limited and his work around the stoppages needs to improve. Street is 211cm tall. Thats where his advantage starts and stops. He's a dud at AFL level and I dont see why you want to talk him up when clearly his performance does not warrant it. Strangely you want to talk down Hudson who is clearly making an impact at AFL level and has been a good acquisition for the Bulldogs

Will his name draw sniggers from other Clubs like it did last year without any interest? There is no doubt his value went up since he has been dropped by the bottom team to the VFL and has put in ordinary performances. He is also a real culture asset that others Clubs really chase. Yes, another MFC player wallowing in the VFL that Clubs are going to fight tooth and nail for. We do overrate our list when it comes to trade time.

Oh dear you really do show yourself up with feckless comments like that.

No we had people crowing when we had Rivers, Carroll, Nicho, Ferg, Bizzell. Fool's gold. Its not the numbers, its the quality of the players. There is alot of promise in Garland, Martin and to a lesser extent Frawley and Warnock. Just a thought if Rivers comes back fit in 2009 would anyone play him forward???

Remove a strength to create a weakness. No thanks.

At the moment White cannot get a game in front of the dud and was beaten badly by another dud in the VFL. White has strong claims on Jamar's "title" ATM. After Meesen.

Meesen and Jamar are contracted for next year. Meesen has no value and Jamar is a third round pick at best. However MFC has a huge hole in its rucks now. Jamar just cant it consistently at AFL level. And PJ is 200cm midfielder who just has no presence in the ruck. White is finished. I'd actually see if you can get any value for PJ. Rookieing ruckman is 4 to 5 year plan and it wont solve our problems for 2009 to 2010. While I would prefer to get Warnock in the PSD, I would be prepared to go our 2nd round PP to get Warnock such is our poor ruck stocks. However its not a preferred position.

Agreed. However his disposal and decision making needs to improve and he needs to do it consistently. And having disposal better than Ward is nothing to crow about. Pace and willingness to take risks just blows up in your face if you massacre disposal of the ball.

....and stupid. The Saints would both be judging the punt on King and Gardiner as abject failures. Neither have offered the Saints much and they are now falling back on Kozi. Peter Street is in the VFL because he is not good enough for AFL period. He is way behind Hudson and Minson. You grossly underestimate the influence of Hudson. He has been a gun recruit for the Dogs and allowed them to play Minson up forward. Given the Dogs are pushing seriously at a flag why would they punt on an underperforming ruckman who has rather poor finals record? Ask yourself what would an undersized underperforming ruckman who does not have a physical presence provide in a hotly contested final situation? Not much. Everitt is a culture bogan but was at 34 a capable AFL ruckman and is well in front of White. In fact Everitt at 36 would still be a better bet than White now.

White cannot get a run at a bottom rung club that is screaming out for good ruckman. He got beaten by Peter Street (WB's 3rd ranked ruck and NQR player at AFL level) on Saturday. How far can you possibly fall? Sydney will not want a ruckman who has no physical presence in ruck or at the fall of the ball. Adelaide has Griffen, Maric and Biglands (come back from knee injury). They wont want White. Given the dinosaurs, Freo have on their list, they will be cleaning out alot of old players and wont be recruiting 32 yo VFL standard players. White is out of contract and will either retire (sensible) or nominate for the PSD and be disappointed. He is smarter than that.

He did a full pre season this year. There is no certainty all his injury issues will be gone. Given how much football he has missed and if he is fit to play, he plays. He needs the experience and to develop the nous to play good consistent football

All the more reason that he will remain at MFC. Putting his 2003 draft position aside. Its not relevant now. At best Sylvia could be a solid player for us who could be a hard match up given his strong ability overheard. Given where his currency is and the fact he is tarnished because of his injury disposition, we would better off seeing what we can get out of him. Its more the nature of some of the posters on this site than anything else. If we win two in a row, there will be posts about what great depth we have. Nah make that one in a row! :D

*BUMP* After seeing Brisbane's insipid and lazy response to their loss against MFC by collapsing against Essendon, I can see how TJ fits right in at Brisbane. Brennan, Corrie and TJ for starters are to varying degrees talented but are masters of the easy option both with the ball and without it. They are a various times lazy, undisciplined and unaccountable. The lack of defensive pressure by Brisbane on Essendon was appalling. Many years ago, TJ was brilliant at finding paths through contested traffic and as the rest of the field ahead opened to him like no other player, would find the best ball use options capped off with a spearing pass. He has lost that. And today he is an architect of the easy receive and just does not work hard enough with and without the ball.

If he continues to massacre the ball on disposal then all those gifts need to come with a pretty good warranty.

Its nice when your side "did not come to play" and still wins by 5 goals. The result and the effort of WB belies that at most times our work rate was commendable but our turnovers crucified us and let the WB punish us on the rebound even though their efforts were lazy. I would at least like to think we gave it our best shot and we pushed a top team to a close victory. But this was not the case yesterday.

I think Jones is our lead midfielder at the moment and is copping a fair bit of pressure which is causing his disposal problems to exacerbate. At 20, he can improve his decision making. It would be interesting if Valenti was played in a similar role how he will go. He needs to be good by hand and foot to cover a lack of pace. FWIW, I thought the pressure on the ball carrier was the only bright spot for WB in a lack lustre performance.