How much are we paying Jamar for two years? Hardly a dent in the salary cap. There is a shortage of good capable ruckmen in the AFL. Jamar is only proof of that fact. So is Meesen. If you want to spit the dummy, I would be asking who traded pick 37 for Meesen. I know players can surprise but hell he is coming off a low base of performance and after 4 years in Adelaide.

Did we ever see Meesen play before we traded for him?

Sounds stupid but he was injured a lot. Maybe traded for him purely based on his size and the fact he was a first round pick?

Did we ever see Meesen play before we traded for him?

Sounds stupid but he was injured a lot. Maybe traded for him purely based on his size and the fact he was a first round pick?

You would hope so. I dont like the thought of trade a 3rd round pick on the basis of footyfan website profile! B)

Once a player is picked, his draft number should not qualify as a basis of future recommendation for a trade or later recruitment. Although sometimes with some of the deals you see.....you wonder.

Our biggest hole we have to fill is key forwards. We need to find a Goal kicking key forward to replace Neitz and Robbo. Newton is in the same mould as Robbo and would be more suited to the secondary forward role. Rucks again over-rated unless they can play in other positions such as Key Forward. That is our big problem White and Jamar can only play on ball PJ can play forward but needs to hold his contested marks.

Our first three picks must be the best talls available.

Getting Natanui and Warnock means all of a sudden we'd have 5 ruckmen on our list (Jamar and Meesen are both contracted for 2009), 6 if White plays another year. Of a list of 38 that is probably too many.

If Warnock becomes available I say we use that first pick on either Hurley or Watts. We have never drafted a truly successful KPP, this is our chance.

Having said that has Natanui got the attributes to become a key forward?

Just play 1 in the square, and the other 5 ruckman in the goal square, and just bomb it to there. They can take turns.

I know nothing about Watts (is he related to Fergus?) but if by the end of the year if he is as good as is currently predicted, I would take him as a part of a solution to the forward line. But at the moment, Naitanui does more than play, he might get people into the ground to watch.

In regards to Meesen, when he was drafted, we had pretty much the same ruck scenario as we do now (save for Spencer on the rookie list), so it seems to me as though he was selected knowing that we would, over the next few years, be looking to overhaul the ruck division for the future. So I don't think he will be cut this year. Who knows, until he gets out there and plays, maybe he will take PJ's spot.

Just play 1 in the square, and the other 5 ruckman in the goal square, and just bomb it to there. They can take turns.

Or perhaps a strategem overtaking "Pagan's Paddock" that we could call "Bailey's Volleyball". Arrange all 5 ruckman in a straight line from the centre bounce to near the square. The ruckman's job is now to tap it up to the next ruckman and so on until its eventually tapped down to Aussie Wonaemirri who puts it through the big sticks.

Could come seriously unstuck if the ball comes to ground in the meantime.

Fergus's cousin i think.

For a smokey, Cam Pederson at Box Hill could be worth a look.

He did a pre-season at Hawthorn but they wanted him to get fitter before they drafted him.

Got best on ground in the ruck on the w/end but is better suited as a forward

depressing thread. In order to become a premiership contender we will have to recruit and develop about 5 true quality players. You just need that core of stars there is no way around it. Look at Geelong's season, with 9 blokes in the All-Australian side. If this is what we have to beat we are pretty much effedGiven that we've produced about 5 players like this for the whole of this decade I don't like our chances of being able to do it anytime soon. Unfortunately, after McLean, Morton is about the only one currently on the list who has a chance of becoming elite.

What would be our corresponding players be for a premiership tilt in a couple of years? Brackets is number in the draft they were taken

Scarlett (F.S.)-> Garland?

Milburn (48) -> Warnock, Buckley?

Egan (62) -> Rivers?

Bartel (8) -> McLean?

S.Johnson (24) -> Sylvia, Davey?

Mooney (56) -> Bate, Newton, Morton?

G.Ablett (F.S.) -> Morton?

Corey (8) -> Jones?

Ling (38) -> Moloney, Bartram?

We basically have to rely on all these blokes stepping up to become as good as these Cats players or its no flag for us. I think you'll agree it seems a tad unlikely

not necessarily. look at the swans. In terms of successful midfields, the Swans would be the ones we could most likely emulate. obviously we are missing the consisetncy across the park that the swans had.

We need to be looking at the gaps in our list for 2010, because Neitz, McDonald, White, Whelan, Holland, Yze and Carrol will have reitred by then and we will have been able to fully clean out our list of the rubbish (Bode, Weetra, Jamar, C.Johnson, Buckley (probably Meesan and Wheatley too).

The players to survive on our list for 2010:

KP defenders: Martin, Garland, Rivers, Warnock, Frawley (perhaps McNamara?)

KP forwards: Miller, (Newton?)

running defenders: Bell, Bartram (perhaps Cheney?)

Midfielders: Mclean, Moloney, Jones, Valenti, Grimes, Dunn, Morton

Forward flankers: Wonaeamirri, Davey, Maric, Bate, Sylvia, Pettard

Ruckman: P.Johnson

(Veterans- Robertson, Bruce, Green)

I think this list clearly shows the holes we need to aim our drafting towards in the next 2 years.

Problem areas----

1) Ruck: We have a golden opportunity this year to fix up the Ruck problem with Naitanui (pick 1) and Warnock (PSD 1).

2) KP Forwards: As shown above, this is a huge problem area. pick 17 AND possibly pick 18 should be used to try to fix this problem.

3) Pacey midfielders: we have the grunt, hard working midfielders. We need to fast finishers now. Draft appropriotly.

4) running defenders: Wat used to be our strength is now clearly a weakness.

Clearly the next 2 years drafting is critical.

What do people foresee as our real weaknesses in 2 years time and what types of players are most critical to be aiming at on draft day?

You talk about pace and you want to rid of Buckley, who just needs to work on his foot skills and, he will be that pace thought the middle we need, he is only 20 and we got him for pick 54, he is worth another 2 years on the list at least.

Well, with pick 1 we could really fix a few areas.

If Bailey wants a key forward, then Jack Watts is all the rage at the moment, and word is that by draft time he will be the favorite to be picked number 1.

We could then get Robbie Warnock in the PSD.

Or we could get Rich with pick 1 to help bolster the mideifler, which needs some excitement.

Or we could of course still get Natanui, then maybe go for someone other than Warnock in the PSD. Or go for both ruckmen.

Whatever the case, its obvious how important it is to finish 16th and have pick 1 in both drafts.

And I disagree about the running defenders part. Garland has shown he is extremely gifted in that area, and we have Petterd, Grimes and Buckley coming through also. We are stacked in that area.

I actually think Natanui will be more prolific playing FF to be honest. He has shown in games he can kick a bag and he has awsome speed and adjility. Similar to buddy without the mussle

Natanui kicked 13 goals from 14 games in the Colts last year.

And then 5 from 7 in the seniors with a high of 2 goals against Peel Thunder.

Not sure what your definition of bag is

How much are we paying Jamar for two years? Hardly a dent in the salary cap. There is a shortage of good capable ruckmen in the AFL. Jamar is only proof of that fact. So is Meesen. If you want to spit the dummy, I would be asking who traded pick 37 for Meesen. I know players can surprise but hell he is coming off a low base of performance and after 4 years in Adelaide.

I'm not worried about the salary cap, I'm worried about our list management. I don't think we have the money to waste by paying him out and he has done nothing to suggest that he will ever improve. The only difference between Meeson and Jamar is that Jamar has been around forever while it's Meeson's first year at the club if Meeson keeps on playing like this he will be the first one to get sacked at the end of next year if they can do it earlier I won't be shedding a tear.