Lucifers Hero

If we delist Jack, he would have every right to nominate as a Delisted FA and he could go to the club of his choice without going thru any draft.

Risky for a club to take him? Yes, but there would be takers as they only need a list spot for him and don't use any picks. We took Riley as a DFA while he had a broken leg...

Delisting Jack on a rookie promise doesn't seem very smart.

BTW the Newton situation was pre FA so not relevant anymore.

Why wouldn't Ablett play?

His shoulder is still dodgy.

Couldn't lift his arms at Brownlow to put medal over Priddis's head.

Jetta: “If I can get my fitness up another ten per cent, then I’ll be really happy going into 2015 because I’ll know that I can run the smaller forwards off their feet.”

Love that comment. I reckon he will get that 10%!! Imagine our team if all our players were 10% fitter. Happy days!

Yes, 6% of the cap. 16 players like that and no cap! What I'm hearing is around the high 500's, that is the point of difference at the moment as well as the term.

I'm staggered MFC is even debating this! We have plenty of cap room in 2015 so front end it!!

The average payment with a $10m cap is $250K. I could give payment patterns to show the cap is not an issue going forward. Suffice to say there will always be new low paid players to offset valuable high paid players and the cap will automatically go up over time.

On the contract 'term'. He will be 27 next Jan. 4+1 years takes him to 32 in his last year. So 5 years seems a very small risk to the club.

Jonesy will (rightly IMO) be mighty peeved if he has to accept high 500's so we can get a 'star FA' @ $1m for 5-7 years. I wouldn't blame Jonesy for walking away - Crikey he does all the hard yards just so some FA comes along and collects. No way Jose! If we think that Jonesy can't get more than the high 500's + 5 years somewhere else we are kidding ourselves. eg. GCS would take him in a heartbeat to support young midfield (Ablett will be 32 in 2016). Plenty of surfing up there!

Lets remember, if Jonesy walks next year and we get a 'star FA' there will be NO FA compo pick for Jonesy!! The FA's more than offset.

Pay what it takes to keep him, MFC and stop mucking him around!

The result is not so important as the performance. I can handle a loss against a side that will play finals next year, but if we put in repeat of the 2012 round 1 schemozzle, it will be a long, long year.

Totally agree, it will be endeavour that counts. A real test for us as we will have an almost new forward line for game 1. Dawes out, Frawley gone, Hogan (I hope) first game, Garlett new. Others who played forward weren't permanently there.

Will be interested to hear Saty and others training reports to know how our forward line is shaping up.

Given the new forward line, if we win round 1 it will be a fab result for us.

Being a game on a Sat afternoon @ the G will hopefully bring all the Dee's supporters out in force, especially if Hogan lines up. A game really worth going to

He will not get far more by staying at MFC.

Jones is craving success. He will see the big picture. He will know that by him accepting $100 to $200K less than what he might be worth it could help us in small part to land a big fish.

Because we will probably have trouble paying the minimum sal cap Jones won't need to accept less to land a big fish...we have to pay it someone, can't think of anyone else who we should pay it to in 2015...front end his contract...

Because the proposed salary was ludicrous

yes hes our best player. That doesn't mean you pay him just under a million per season, hes not a game changing superstar

Imagine our club if we can't sign Jones: unlikely to get FA; MFCSS goes off the richter scale; player morale goes down; struggle to win games; members stay away/drop off further.

While he is not a 'game changing superstar' of the game he the superstar of our team and he is a must keep player. He can almost name his price because his value cannot be measured in $. We will probably struggle to pay the min sal cap in 2015 and if any player deserves a premium it is Jones. I can't see any reason to not use the sal cap available in 2015 to not reward Jones then taper it as my post above suggests. He seems a fair person and to put his salary in context re-read WJ's post above. He will not hold the club to ransom.

Off the top of your head - what is the salary cap?

What is it next year?

What should it approximately be in 4 years time?

If you can't pull these out of your arse without the help of Google then what sense do you think it makes to dismiss a proposed salary for our best player?

From another thread posted on Saturday in response to potential sal cap available for an FA:

Savings: - Clark $600K

- Frawley $350K (because his contract had been front ended).

- Delisted players $1.6m (8*$200K)

- Savings from other front ended contracts eg Dawes/Trengrove but these probably offset by renewed contracts eg Dunn/McDonald

Savings of approx $2.5m

Cost of new players Frost $250K), Lumumba ($450K) , Garlett ($350K) = approx $1m; Cost of new draftees: $500K. Total New Costs approx: $1.5m

Other variations: AFL allow pay't up to 105% of cap if offset in other years; sal cap will go up for 'inflation'; savings from contracted delisted players (if any)

On the basis of this 'back-of-the-envelope' calc at least $1m for an FA (front ended so that it tapers off when our young players need to be paid more)

Oh, forgot an additional cost: Big increase to N Jones when he signs new long-term contract but I would hope his is front ended into 2015.

I would have thought Tom Hawkins would be equal no 1 on that list along side Danger

Hawkins has 3 premiership medals...he may now want $$$$. Will cost Geelong a pretty penny to keep him...Tommy contract has snuck under the radar so far

In the wake of the Boyd deal every football manager in the country is redoing its sums for salary cap problems...a rude awakening for some. To some extent we are fortunate that we haven't had any stars commanding big $.

For mine, Hawkins is the one to watch!

Best guess:

Yr 1 - $1.250m

Yr 2 - $750K

Yr 3 - $750K

Yr 4 - $600K

Yr 5 - $250K

So $3.6m over 5 years. Averages @ $840K over 4 years and @ $720 over 5 years so may not be enough.

Scaling helps us and him. Pay big chunk next year before our star FA arrives then taper off for when our home grown stars need more dough

He will be almost 33 at end of year 5. He will become what we all want: a one-club player...an increasing rare breed...

Well Gill doesn't think FA is benefitting top clubs exclusively. And he has a point,,,

"I think it's also worth noting that Beams [brisbane Lions], Griffen [Greater Western Sydney], Christensen [brisbane] and Ryder [Port Adelaide] all went to clubs that were seen one-to-two years ago as totally unfashionable and not destination clubs. This is a significant point."

Thats the view from HQ. We better work fast at making ourselves a desirable club if we really want to attract players.......

He missed the point that the receiving club gets the FA for free: Sydney gave up zip for Buddy. Same for Carlton/Thomas, Hawthorn/Frawley. No draft picks no players given up! This is the problem with AFL FA. Gill just chose to conveniently overlook this fundamental flaw!

I suggest working backwards (with a bit of guesswork):

Savings: - Clark $600K

- Frawley $350K (because his contract had been front ended).

- Delisted players $1.6m (8*$200K)

- Savings from other front ended contracts eg Dawes/Trengrove but these probably offset by renewed contracts eg Dunn/McDonald

Savings of approx $2.5m

Cost of new players Frost $250K), Lumumba ($450K) , Garlett ($350K) = approx $1m; Cost of new draftees: $500K. Total New Costs approx: $1.5m

Other variations: AFL allow pay't up to 105% of cap if offset in other years; sal cap will go up for 'inflation'; savings from contracted delisted players (if any)

On the basis of this 'back-of-the-envelope' calc at least $1m for an FA (front ended so that it tapers off when our young players need to be paid more)

Oh, forgot an additional cost: Big increase to N Jones when he signs new long-term contract but I would hope his is front ended into 2015.

Hope this helps your thinking!

ps couldn't open HS article so can't comment on it

I like the James Hird impersonator with the cognac, The Leopards! We know what that means.

...you mean the cuban smoking, bejewelled sth american drug lord!!!

Of the 2015 players approx:

12 didn't play in the infamous '186' ie not scarred by that traumatic day.

13 are Roos recruits ie never 'scarrred' by Neeld or '186'

approx 6-8 had only 5 months with Neeld

Of those who endured both the186/Neeld trauma...Dunn, N Jones, Mc Donald seem to have survived ok.

So approx 30 players will be 'unscarred by the past'. Leaves about 10 'problem-children'

I tip Roos to fix the mental scars, drop the players he 'can't fix', have us playing AFL standard footy and winning this years 'winnable' games.

6-8 wins. Not fussed about ladder position.

If we don't get one in the draft I think a ruckman is needed to replace Jamar/add depth...will wait to see list of DFA's before picking a prospect

Roos' specialty...getting big men when they are ready to go but not at too high a price!

I had thought Lever but having seen Frost video I don't know if we need 2 new big defenders. Unless Lever can also play forward or pinch hit in ruck I would go another midfielder.

Every chance Petracca/Brayshaw for 2 and 3

No. Petrenko, McKernan, Lewis Johnston and Kane Lucas (yet to be delisted) are the best of them.

The main list lodgements are yet to come...those names may have lots more...just too early to talk DFA's

Right, so add to the theme. Would you take anyone as a DFA?

We wont know DFA's are until the List Lodgements are in.

If there is a delisted player, can we not take them as a DFA before the Draft or PSD or nicks? A DFA can nominate their club so if there is a delisted play we have our eye on we don't need to use a Draft or PSD pick...

...long way to go before PSD

Stkilda confirmed they had some interest in Frost if we didn't get the deal done. I feel slightly better.

It was a bluff (they want Membrey)...we fell for it!!

Based on Pick 'Cost':-

Stretch = 8 out of 10

Garlett = 7 out of 10

Mitch = 2 out of 10

Lumumba = 6 out of 10

Frost = 2 out of 10

Overall = 5 out of 10

No A or A+ player = a minus

No player traded out = a big minus

Draft, 2, 3, 43, etc etc = TBA

Now a Demon for 23

Welcolm Sam but Booooooooooooooooooo to the trade!

When is football like basketball?

When Jack W plays football...

...I hate myself for that answer because I have a lot of time for Jack...but it seemed the answer you may be fishing for...

If nothing changes after this trade period, will it affect Mahoney's job security?

Sorry to be honest, but that is one of the silliest comments of the trade period!

If we want Lever we need to get 4 plus a v good player from GWS for our 3 (+/- steak knives) otherwise Coll will probably take Lever with 5.