Lucifers Hero

A reminder that while the maximums on lists are: 38 for seniors (currently 33, assuming reports that Jordon has been delisted/rookied are correct) 6 for A rookies (currently 4, assuming reports that Jordon has been delisted/rookied are correct) 2 for B rookies (currently 1) The overall total cannot exceed 44. The minimum for seniors list is 36 so we must add at least 3 from the draft/DFA's Edit: I will update the 'Contracts' thread when the Jordon move is confirmed by the club.

'Not Retained' refers to Rookies, 'Delisted' refers to senior list players.

Frawley on his move to the saints. a-few-beers-with-roughy-then-frawley-became-a-saint Its rather odd that he has had all these years to think about life after footy but didn't seem to have something to get involved in. Thought this was a nice touch: "(Danny would) probably come in and give me a headlock and a punch in the arm and say 'You've got a big name to live up to, don't stuff it up'."

Will be a real loss. Development of our players to be their best is our next step to being successful. Hopefully we can get someone with a strong development background rather than a newbie who needs to develop himself and his program. We don't have time for another coach who needs training wheels.

Max is being quite honest. I doubt many would disagree with this comment: “When we do flash back to 2018 and see a Prelim Final, but nothing else either before it or after it, you almost see that little dynasty as a fail". He is virtually saying 2018 was an aberration. Following on from his comment a month or two ago that 2019 was 'a fail', I'm not sure it is fair to describe his comments as 'fluff pieces'.

It would be fair to assume we traded out our 2021, 1st round pick to help get high up the order this year. I have a theory about our pick swapping and what now look like limited options to get into the top 10 - 12 (which go out to 14 - 16 after affiliated picks). My theory is that we (and few other clubs) did not expect so much draft power in a few hands: Ess and GWS. I doubt anyone would have predicted that Ess would end up with 6, 7 and 8, thinking that one of them would have gone for Dunkley. Or prediced that GWS would prise picks 13, 15 and 20 from Geelong (to add to their pick 10). Even fewer would have predicted both outcomes. Ess and GWS will dictate the draft order of the top 20 picks. If my theory is correct we have been snookered by circumstances. Maybe we swapped our 2021, 1st too early. It would come in mighty handy for pick swaps in the coming weeks. That power Ess and GWS hold and that lots of clubs are vying for the high draft picks they will be very 'expensive' and we may just not have the currency to go further up the order.

I wondered about that strategy. And like you I hope such shortsightedness is not the case. fwiw, if we are relying on 3 or 4 newly drafted 18 year olds (in practice 2nd round picks) to succeed in 2021, it is starting to feel all a bit too desperate. The chances of them getting games (even if we happen to swap some picks for one higher) I reckon this years draftees will come in less developed for not having played much in 2020 so will need a bit more development and time especially those from Victoria. New draftees won't materially affect 2021 results. imv we either have the list to succeed already or we won't succeed.

trades-analysis "Melbourne (38) was one of the rare teams trying to trade into this year’s draft, rather than trading into 2021 for bid-matching or pure talent purposes. Simon Goodwin’s team clearly feels there’s talent to be gained this year, sending out all four of their future picks, including being the only team to trade away their 2021 first-round pick. In the process they landed selections 18 and 19, along with 28 and 50, which will either allow them to again package up picks to move even higher, or simply take four quality kids. There’s a risk to this, because the 2020 draft crop is as unknown a group as we’ve had in recent years - given the inability of most to play under-18s footy this year - but if they trust their recruiters, this could be a defining month for the Demons". Do we know something other clubs don't? Certainly JT is one to trust as he has runs on the board. But, given the talent in next years draft (as signalled by clubs wanting to trade into 2021) are we playing 'russian roulette' trying to cherry pick this year's talents with picks that will be mid 20's plus or mid to late teens (if we can engineer a trade up for such a pick). While we have been successful trading picks to go up the draft order we haven't got as high as we would like in the last two years. I recall mention on DL that we tried to trade up in 2018 to get Zac Butters and in 2019 to get Mitch Georgiades but we didn't get high enough (or able to split a high pick). I guess that is the risk of regularly trading out future 1st round picks and then miss targetted players. I wonder who we really want this year? Hopefully we can get him.

Has a comparison being made by the saints of Frawley vs the Mac bros? I doubt it. They will get Frawley for 'chips', excuse the pun. That comparison of the saints view of 'value' seems a bit of a cheap shot.

No, a club cannot exceed 44. But it seems the AFL is not beyond changing the rules in these weird times. They are Rookie drafts. A club can keep a rookie spot free or create one by retiring/LT injury list a player from their senior list and promoting an existing rookie. rookie-draft-details NAB AFL Mid-Season Rookie Draft The AFL today proposed an alternative model to the NAB AFL Mid-Season Rookie Draft for 2021 that would allow Clubs to fill vacant list spots or replace inactive players on a monthly basis. Details of that proposal are as follows: Between the end of the SSP and prior to Round One, undrafted and other eligible players can opt into being upgraded to an AFL list during the 2021 Toyota AFL Premiership Season. Clubs can then nominate to upgrade a previously undrafted or eligible player to their respective Rookie List at three different periods throughout the 2021 season (eg. following Round Four, Round Eight, and Round 12). In the instance that the same player is nominated by two or more Clubs, the player will go to the team lower on the ladder under a rolling process (eg. if a Club selects a player, that Club goes to the back of the line). The AFL informed Clubs it would discuss this model further with both AFL and State League Clubs over the next month with the view to finalising whether it is introduced in the 2021 Toyota AFL Premiership Season. So players can nominate their cub just like a DFA. As a lot of players will go undrafted this year some gems are bound to be available. As an aside, if we have managed our sal cap well which so far looks like we have, I don't see a need to move senior list players to rookie list and prevent us from participating in the PSSP or mid season drafts of which there are 3. Some would say a player that goes from senior to rookie list could be promoted back to the senior list when the mid season drafts arrive. But do we really want to mess with a players standing. We have a history of treating our players with respect. Moving them around like chess pieces wouldn't be the go I don't think.

A max of 6 (A+B) rookies is based on a max list of 44 and filling the 4 senior vacancies we have which gives 38 senior players. Of course we may not fill all 4 senior list spots and then there are any number of combinations of senior, A or B players to reach 44. My initial point was the club has maxed the rookies in recent years so saving on the sal cap. It is not a new strategy for mfc. As I noted I have little doubt the club will leave a rookie (A type) spot (or two) for the PSSP or next year's mid season draft.

I have updated my earlier post for senior list size. The 6 rookies allowed is the total of A and B types. As long as we have Bradtke we can't have 6 A rookie spots.

Yes. mfc has been doing this for several years. 6 rookies in 2020, a sal cap saving of $480k The minimum senior list is 37 36 maximum is 38. We have 34 senior players so we must add at least 2 to the senior list as draftees or DFA's. The advantage of keeping a rookie spot (or two) vacant is that we can add players as part of the PSSP or the 2021 quarterly mid-season drafts. Clubs that max out their rookie list won't be able to, without a LT injury or retirement. There may well be some gems among the draftees that don't get drafted due to small list sizes and list capacity reached. We have 2 rookie list vacancies so well placed to pick up a gem or two. I think our list management is going along nicely.

A little clarification. Clubs have until Monday Nov 30 to delist players. Then clubs can add players as DFA's until Wednesday Dec 2.

Correct. Pick #50 is now 'live'. @spirit of norm smithAs KK's retirement is before final list lodgement, he will come off our lists altogether. Similar to Stevens at Geelong. On KK, the club gave him a second chance and every chance to continue his career. A shame it worked out as it did but he has made a good decision. Good Luck to him for the next stage of his life. EDit: kolodjashnij-retires-from-football He seems to be doing well: Pleasingly, Kolodjashnij has overcome his concussion issues and is in a good space. He is now running his own business with his brother Jake, focussing on natural insect repellent. “I am back in a pretty good place now – I am exercising and feeling good physically and mentally,” Kolodjashnij said.

Thank you. Yes. 38 on the list. 34 + 3'A' + 1'B' as you describe. Gives us 4 senior list vacancies and 2 Rookie vacancies. Chart updated for KK's retirement: 4 senior vacancies and 4 draft picks. We may use pick #50, afterall.

Being talked about as a draft bolter archie-perkins-hawthorn-essendon Pies would probably be keen to get him so the jockeying for draft position of those teams will be interesting. Likened to Petracca and touted as a top 10 pick going-places-the-powerful-x-factor Out of reach for us.

Burgess is listed as speaking at the club Forum on Dec 10 so if he is to go it isn't imminent. Clearly Crows want him. They have just recruited Tim Parham (physio) from Arsenal who would have worked there with Burgess for a short while. Apparently, Nicks and Burgess worked at Port at the same time. The closed SA border would not have helped with personal contact with his kids. I'd say the writing is on the wall - just a matter of when. Hopefully after our pre-season is over giving us some time to find a replacement.

Of course clubs have been surveying delisted players for weeks. That is different than what you posted earlier saying a DFA would be locked in before contracting 5 players.

Umm, not sure why you quoted my post which was positive and supportive of Oscar and continuation of his footy career.. For the record I agree with your comments.

Why? The DFA selection period hasn't opened yet. It opens on Thursday. We will only know of DFA's successfully pursued later in the week (or when their is another DFA selection period). Lockhart deserves his promotion. There are other ways to create list spots if that is your reason for not promoting him.

Oscar discussed as one of the 10 best DFA's available: best-delisted-free-agents "A victim of Melbourne’s aggressive recruiting in defence. Just 24 and has a stack of potential if he can put it all together. Managed 60 games from 2016-18 but just 19 since with the arrivals of Steven May and Jake Lever. Again, looks a great option for a side like the Western Bulldogs, who are looking to add more defensive support. However a side like Carlton or even Gold Coast could be just as appropriate. He could play a role at the Suns like that of Rory Thompson, who continues to battle injury in his bid to return to the elite level". Feeling more optimistic for him. I'm a bit surprised Sydney aren't mentioned. Hope he gets another gig.

I interpreted the 2 year guaranteed offer as coming straight onto the list rather than a 'lets see how you go' offer. May have misinterpreted the guarantee. I guess a player could be guaranteed 2 years on the rookie list but there would be a bit of a difference in pay.

It won't be while McLachlan and Goyer are at the helm. They don't want blood on their hands to be part of their legacy.

The Cedric Cox noted above pursuit suggests we are using a list spot for a DFA leaving 2 spots available after Lockhart's promotion. This strengths my hunch we will take 2 new draftees and we will convert our 4 picks (18, 19, 28 and 50) into the best two we can get. Otherwise 28 and 50 are wasted.