Jaded No More

I don't think we'll elevate anyone at the moment. We could have already done that given that Garland is on the LTI, so clearly nobody is ready/required. McKenzie would however be my pick of the rookies, and he may well be promoted and given his opportunity to play AFL later on in the year.

You are kidding yourself if you don't think that Bruce shopped himself around 3 years ago. And Green did exactly the same thing, as did Robbo. I have no problem with that, because they are all entitled to look out for themselves and their future, and it takes nothing away for their loyalty to the club. For what it's worth, Travis was probably the most loyal to the MFC over the years off the field, but this did not reflect in his on-field efforts. But football is a business, and just as players are allowed to sniff around for the best deal, it is the club's right, if not duty, to look at trading players who they feel are worth more to other clubs. 3 years ago, Bruce would have got us a top 20 pick. That's potentially 12 years of great service versus 4 good to average seasons from someone who is not going to be around when we're ready to challenge. Now obviously 3 years ago, the club was not rebuilding, and did not have the vision to execute this move, however they should have been more realistic about where we stood as a list. As it was, we traded for the likes of Pickett because we believed we had a good enough list to challenge. We obviously had no idea what the hell we were on about. That is not Bruce's fault. At the end of the day, he is in decline and at 30 that is acceptable. I don't really get why every other player can cop criticism, but we are not allowed to ever say a negative word about Bruce. The facts are, that his decision making is poor, and that while statistically his disposal is up to standard, when you watch him play you realise how many of his handballs and kicks put teammates under pressure and lead to turnovers. At 30, he is never going to improve on this, and he seems to be one of a few players who is struggling to adapt to Bailey's game plan, which would explain why he is spending a lot more time in defence than usual. He is a year by year proposition, and the fact that this year's draft is not as deep as last year's, means he is more than likely going to stay on for at least another year. But he won't be a regular senior player in 2010 IMO.

Hasn't lost any of his magic. Still needs to work on his defensive pressure, but isn't it great to have a forward who will mark anything that goes near him and kick them too. Welcome back Robbo, we've missed you!

That's because, at 30, he is never going to improve. He's only likely to decline further. Besides, there are numerous threads on here which focus on Bate, Sylvia, PJ, Newton, not to mention the amount of posts made regarding the disposal of Bartram, Miller, McLean etc... He is not the only player who cops criticism, but at 30, and being our vice-captain, we would be silly to ignore his rapid decline. By the way, every single B&F player has declined at some stage. That is the natural progression of football players, regardless of how many awards they have won. If it wasn't, they'd play until they were dead.

While the junk-food eating isn't a massive worry, I'm sure that if you looked hard enough you'll find numerous photographic evidence of some of our players drinking excessively, and yes, even smoking. That is a much bigger worry, and still, it happens all the time at all football clubs.

But didn't you like how, when we played one-on-one in the first quarter we actually broke even with them?! We choked up their options when clearing the ball out of the backline and forced them to kick to one-on-one contests. By the way, don't kid yourself, Ablett was down on form yesterday because he was carrying a groin injury, not because we successfully shut him down. Oh and go refer to my post from last week and quote me saying that we should leave Ablett on his own in the centre square and let him do what he wants ... that was the stupidest line-up at a first bounce that you are ever likely to see! P.S.- Ablett may have 'struggled' (I wish all our players struggled like he does), but that still left Bartel and Chapman to do as they please. You cannot shut down their midfield, but as Bailey said before the game, the key is not to stop them getting the ball, it's to stop them from having options to kick to... which we did really well in the first quarter in particular.

Given that we weren't brave enough to trade him at his peak, he is now worth virtually nothing on the open market. I'm not sure whether or not his contract is out at the end of this year, but if it is, he should certainly be a year by year proposition. While he is versatile, and he can run all day, he just does not do enough damage on the ground. His disposal and particularly his decision making is now too poor to ignore. Might get one more year out of him, but personally it would be a shame if we kept playing him out of obligation, while he wasn't preforming, and we end up missing a young kid who might take his place instead and be around when we're ready to challenge. Bailey doesn't strike me as the type to let players cruise along on reputation or history. Hopefully that means that Bruce will be made accountable for his poor skills sooner rather than later. By the way, this is in no way a reflection on Bruce as a hard-working player. I think he gives his all most weeks, he runs all day and can generally play anywhere on the ground. He has been a good player for us over the years, especially given he was such a late draft pick. However, his time is nearing the end very very quickly, not because his body is not willing, but because his skills are declining fast. This is actually the opposite of what is happening with Junior, who I think is struggling with his body (he seems to have lost a lot of pace, which he didn't have a huge amount of to begin with) while his skills remain on par.

The video doesn't do it justice, because it doesn't show the contest in its entirety. Watts actually won the ball out of the ruck before picking it up off the deck. And while it may have been a bit of a fluke goal, the beauty of it is that he has the agility to switch sides quickly, that he is able to kick off both sides without hesitation, and that he has a good sense of where to go in the contest. He's a bit special!

Spot on. Davey's smother was brave, and inspirational. Bruce giving away silly free kicks was not. Neither was his disposal or decision making, which has let him down time and time again. While I appreciate how hard Bruce works in general play, and the fact that he hasn't lost any of his aerobic capacity, he needs to be made responsible for his awful disposal. Also, yesterday he went half-hearted into a number of tackles that he should have nailed. Yes he may be our Vice Captain, but at the moment he is struggling to influence the contest and he needs to be made accountable for that. I know they won't drop him, like they won't drop Junior, but they should. Nobody should be given a free ride.

Pies > [censored]

Would be great if he could become an 'Adam Hunter' type, but drop the Adam Hunter bit And his goal kicking ability can't be worse than that of Bate, Miller or Newton. Besides, I don't see any evidence to support that his footskills are poor. He hit Robbo on the chest, under pressure, with the outside of the boot. If playing him as a forward means he gets to keep his spot in the team, and we don't have to debate which one of Rivers/Garland/Warnock/Frawley/Martin should miss out (when all are fit obviously), then that's what we should do.

Well clearly nobody valued Bell's ability to win the contested ball yesterday with Casey. At the end of the day, Bell needs to prove himself so that we know whether or not he is worth keeping on the list at the end of the year. He has had a good pre-season and showed plenty as a midfielder. Had he not broken his thumb he would have been a certainty to play Round 1. No he isn't the greatest footballer going around, but he goes in hard, is a superb tackler, has a bit of pace to burn and his disposal is generally good. That IMO puts his ahead of Dunn for example, who too often just doesn't go in hard enough... the one quality that you cannot forgive a footballer for. If Grimes was fit, I'd play him ahead of Bell, if Bail was ready, I'd play him ahead of Bell too. But Dunn needs to go back to Casey and prove that he isn't scared of getting hurt. Bell seems the logical replacement (given the others aren't fit, and Valenti won't be promoted). So it's not changes for the sake of changes IMO. Aussie may not deserve a game on the strength of his performance on Saturday, but he definitely deserves a game on the back of his pre-season and efforts last year. Just as we can't judge Newton on one good VFL performance, we can't judge Aussie on one poor VFL performance. We know he can perform at the highest level, so just play him.

Had an absolute stinker, no doubt. But people on here were talking him up as if he was the next Ablett. He has barely played at this level, and at junior level was mostly played as a small forward. So he is not only adapting to the speed of the game, he is also adapting to playing a new position. And you're right. He is a lot better than what he showed today, which is why there is no need to panic and call for his head. For a player to be able to find the ball, and run to the right position, is half the battle. A lot of his ideas today were good, but the execution sucked badly.

I see now that Yze_Magic is on one of his regular holidays, you're desperately trying to find another target (preferably one that is not of the view that Bruce is god's gift to football) Unlucky for you, I'm not gonna bother feeding your cravings for an argument. We all have our thoughts on players. Joeboy does a great job each week with his 3 word analysis. Not because he is always right, but because his opinions stimulate conversation. That is the point of the thread, and why it has become a weekly post-game tradition on Demonland. For some reason he didn't like me disagreeing with him (or couldn't see how what I said contradicted his thoughts ), but that is of little relevance to you or your agenda.

If only eating junk food was the worst thing they did....

I did. Bell I thought was fairly good, and I did mention that Aussie had a poor game, but he's had a great pre-season and we need him out there. So many times today the ball hit the deck and Geelong ran away with it. The pressure in the forward line when Robbo and Bate are in there, is terrible. Robbo, at 30, is never gonna change. Bate should, but probably won't. Aussie's pressure is something we sorely lack at the moment. To be fair, Valenti was better than Bell, but won't be promoted at this stage. Grimes is clearly not fit, and while I'd like to see Bail debut, he probably needs a bit more game time with Casey. Newton does not deserve a game on the back of one performance. Especially given how terrible he's been at AFL level this year. As for Dunn, he pulled out too many times today. At least with Bell I know he'll throw himself head-first into every single contest.

Today was Maric's 6th AFL game. That is all. Edit: damn you 45, beat me to it!

I don't remember Bailey ever bringing in a player and dropping them immediately the following week. He always gives players at least 2 games in a row, so Maric is safe. I think the expectations on Maric built up on Demonland were a bit ridiculous to be honest. He has played less than a handful of games, and while his kicking is meant to be his strength, better more experienced players often lose their brain in the heat of the contest. He'll get better the longer he plays. Just needs to find a feel for the speed of the game. He did seem overly keen to handball or kick to the next contest, when in reality he should have taken a breath and looked around for a better option.

Out: Bate, Dunn In: Aussie , Bell Aussie didn't have a great game with Casey, but he is a proven performer (as proven as they can be when they've played one season) and we're crying out for crumbers. If Martin plays up forward again, we really don't need either Bate or Dunn running around like a pair of headless chooks. Bate has to go back and work on his marking, kicking and most of all ability to pick the ball up off the ground. Please Bater, learn to bend over. Bell adds another strong body to the midfield, and gives us the ability to push him down back and possibly play Ricky or Bennell on the wing. I would bring in Whelan too, but feel he needs another game with Casey. We can't afford for him to break down within the first quarter.

I want to know what the deal with Brock is. Is he carrying a foot injury? Some of his kicks don't connect properly with the ball, which is something that has never been an issue for him. With about 10 minutes to go, he came off the ground and was filthy (at himself I assume). He swore and threw his hands up, before sitting down on the bench. He seems very frustrated, like he knows what he wants to do, but simply can't do it. Agree 100% with your assessments. I jumped for joy when Martin was pushed forward, and within a few minutes he was on the end of a great goal assist. He gave off another to Miller as well. Definitely an experiment worth persisting with. Maric must have been nervous or overawed by the speed of the game. He has played less than 5 games. His disposal was horrendous, but he gets to the right spots constantly and can certainly find the ball, which is very encouraging. Little things today, like not running deeper before attempting to kick the goal, just showed to me that he is [censored] himself out there still. Needs 4-5 good solid game time before we start judging his disposal. He was afterall drafted as an elite kick. Doubt that has changed. As for Bruce and Bate... the less said the better. At least we can trust that Bate will get dropped if he doesn't perform. Bruce's position in the team seems as secure as ever, which is frustrating.

Didn't realise we're not allowed to disagree with you. Also I notice many people use more than 3 words to elaborate on your posts. This is what the 3 word analysis thread usually turns into, in-depth player discussion. Oh and am I supposed to care whether or not you respect my opinion, because I didn't get the memo

Disagree with a lot of those today... Bartram - poor skills, great endeavor Bate - terrible again Bennell - quiet game, great skills Bruce - terrible skills, poor judgment Davey - continues to shine Dunn - ruins anything he does well, with a chain of horrible actions Frawley - brilliant Johnson - better than last week, but still not enough Jones - take the first option! Maric - can get the ball, but can't kick?? McDonald - tired Martin - great up forward McLean - frustrated and frustrating (was I the only one who saw him swear angrily when he came off the ground towards the end of the match?) Meesen - provides an actual contest Miller - worked hard as always Moloney - great tackling game Morton - future superstar Petterd - better out of defence Rivers - disappointing Robertson - good to have him back Sylvia - 2 good minutes a game is not enough Colin! Warnock - stuck to task

The brawl was top of the news on Ch.7! Get a life Channel 7, people are dying from Swine Flu and your top story involves Ben Cousins icing it up (his knee that is! ), and some "massive" brawl that took place in a VFL match? If you had shown Jack's 3 magnificent goals, it would have been news worthy, but otherwise, a ridiculous non-story to start the news with!

Awesome? He did get really tired in the last, which is understandable given he hasn't played a full game at any sort of really intense environment in about 8 months. Needs plenty more games to get the fitness into him. Playing on the wing as well, he got tired because he was running from one contest to the next. Great user of the ball, oozes class and very very intelligent. Probably won't play permanent CHF (too good to rot in the square) until he puts on another 5-6kgs.

Ball spilled from a pack, he picked it up, ran around one way, then decided stuff it so turned the other way, and kicked it across the body from near the boundary, from about 40m out. The ball split the middle. Good stuff.