Jaded No More

I can understand when he struggles on someone like Campbell Brown, but he was playing on Ryan Houlihan... Ryan Houlihan! Even I could make him cry by stealing his hair straightener. Davey should have got more aggressive with him. The thing that really worries me, is the fact that he has completely stopped chasing. If he was still applying his usual pressure up forward, and only kicking 1 goal and getting a handful of touches, he could be excused. But he's playing lazy footy at the moment. For his sake, I hope he's injured.

I don't think you can classify someone as a 'troublemaker' when they make one mistake. They are only a troublemaker if they continually stuff up. Everyone deserves a second chance, if they didn't, Neita wouldn't be our captain, would he now? Voss is not a troublemaker because he got drunk and punched someone. He is human. And I agree that you need a very strong club around you to change players. Sydney did a great job with Hall, and Brisbane with Pike, but in most cases, those two would have failed at almost any other club.

All will be revealed on the flight tomorrow. Depending on which emergency travels to Brisbane, we will know whether Bruce or Carroll are in doubt. Good change. We've run out of players, and now the side can finally settle Expect Miller to start on Brown, with Newton at FF.

Considering that since 2000, we've been in the top 6 for average goals 5 times, I would suggest that no, kicking goals is not our problem. Getting our hands on the ball in the first place, is our problem! This argument is now stale and boring, I've said what I had to say, you didn't want to take any of it on board. I'm done.

I'm not really sure what your argument is. You're saying we've failed to develop key forwards, and yet we've never had a problem with kicking goals. I've highlighted that we have a fair number of key forwards in the wings, and that we've drafted mainly midfielders post 2000 because that is what we needed most. What exactly do you disagree with?

I don't call 17 games enough chances. Not when McLean and Sylvia, both drafted the same year, have played around 50. Sylvia is on 46 games and has shown very little in about 42 of them. Injuries are partly to blame, we know that, but he's been given every chance to prove himself. CJ deserves at least until year's end to prove that he too, can make it. There are about 10 players I'd get rid of before him.

You can't seriously believe that we lost the 2000 GF because we didn't have a good enough forward line. Oh dear! (For your information, we were 4th in the league for points 'For' in 2000).

I asked you before whether not winning a premiership is where our failure lies. If we won a flag in 2000 but had the exact same list today, would we be a failure? Are we talking failure to win flags, or failure to draft and develop players, because according to your last post, it's about a failure to develop key forwards. Therefore West Coast are a failure. In the last 10 years we've never once had a problem with kicking winning scores. Our forward line has always been a strength. Now Neita is close to the end, and we've got Newton, Bate, Dunn and Garland waiting in the wings. Where's the failure in that?

He is a quickly tap ruckman yes, useless footballer around the ground, but a quality ruckman he is. And you didn't answer my question about West Coast. Their forward line is shocking, to the point where Judd and Kerr having 37 possessions each is still not enough for their forwards to kick a winning score. So are they, or are they not a failure? And Robbo is a key forward. He'd be the number one forward at a number of clubs. Robbo averages more goals per game over his career than Brad Johnson, so I'm not sure exactly how you maintain that he occasionally kicks goals.

We've developed 5 ruckman. One is an AA, one went on to win a premiership, one is the number one ruckman at another club, while the other 2 are still developing. As I said before, we drafted a number of KPPs who, for some reason or another, didn't make it. A combination of talent and injuries. On the other hand, we also got Carroll off a rookie list, Miller with a pick in the 50's, Rivers is all class and was a steal, plus Newton, Bate, Dunn and Garland who are still learning. We drafted what we really needed, which at the time was mostly midfielders. The risk of failure is far greater with big men, and we're not alone in being short on KPPs. I think you'll find most clubs are too. Are West Coast a failure because they haven't found and developed a decent tall forward?

How have we wasted the last 10 years? What do you classify as wasting? If it's not winning a premiership, than nobody can disagree, but have we ever actually been good enough to win a flag? We drafted some very good players, and some KPPs which failed for one reason or another. Your argument that we don't develop players properly has no backing whatsoever, because for every player we apperantly managed poorly, I can name 3 or 4 we managed well. And for every club whos list is better than ours, there's a club with a worst list. You've carried this argument despite the fact that it completely lost all logic. Show me which club rushes their young players into the senior team, and how many of them have been successful...

Indeed. First Daniher is no good for consulting his leadership group about Aker, now Voss has no coaching skills. Aker has a shortage of brain cells, that's more to the point.

Your logical post is a disgrace. Stop it!

Dear god! Glad to hear everyone is ok. Sure gives new meaning to the saying 'love hurts'!

I think I speak for everyone when I say: we want details!

Don't underestimate Frawley. There aren't a whole lot of up and coming defenders, and if he can make his mark in the game, he could easily earn a couple of AA selections. What will he win first, B&F or AA?

He wasn't a footballer at the time of the incident. While at Brisbane, he was as outstanding off the field, as he was on it.

Already ruled himself out. He might be 'tested' until the end of the season. I rather he didn't play and got proper time to recover. It will mean Newton gets more opportunities as number one tall forward, Neita can have adequate time to get his knee right, and can play his 300th next year in our 150th year.

The man threw a punch... hang him! <_< For god's sake, are we so precious and innocent ourselves that we persecute anyone who does something stupid while drunk? Voss is a human being. He stuffed up. He is still a champion of the game, and will make an excellent coach. Ross Lyon sounds like he is falling asleep in press conferences and has the charisma of a wet towel, but has a clean record... I know who I rather be the face of Melbourne.

No he hasn't. He had last year out of footy. This year he played the first half of the season, had about 3 weeks off, and is now back playing VFL. There is nothing to say he won't be back in the seniors by the end of the year. Sylvia's OP was just as troublesome and we didn't give up on him. Moloney is only a couple of years older, and has plenty of time to get himself right. I have every confidence in him and in our medical staff. If they can manage Sylvia, they can manage Beamer.

I think we're overreacting here. Beamer was on track to make a full recovery, then injuries happened which forced him to play out full games. This has obviously set him back, however he is not on the long-term injury list, in fact, he is playing in the VFL. That says to me that while he isn't 100%, he is able to play at a reduced capacity. I don't see any reason why, with a modified pre-season, he can't get back on the field next year. We'll need to manage him in the same way we manage Sylvia, Brock and now Rivers. High rotation and the likes. Moloney is an important part of our side and he should be back to prove that next year. You doom-sayers upset me!

In: Bruce Out: Petterd If Carroll doesn't come up, bring in Garland and play him down back. Miller to play on Brown.

Because the under 25s are the best hope we've got of going anywhere. I think Bate does have some leadership skills, but you can replace him with Jones if that makes a difference. The idea is to get a leader in each part of the ground. If Green returns to the forward line, he can get the gig instead. I'm sick of having leadership groups full of players who can play, but can't lead. Is it a reputation group, or a leadership group? Honestly can't wait for a new coach to come in and make some really big changes, starting with one of our biggest weaknesses, leadership.

Has Michael Voss EVER done anything to compromise Brisbane's reputation? This incident is hardly a reason to hang him. Our own captain has done worse. I couldn't care less what he does outside of football, as long as he represents this club with respect, and as I said, he has been one of the best representatives of AFL throughout his career. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the incident occurred after he retired, did it not? If that's the reason we don't make him coach, we're a weak club that won't go anywhere. Thankfully, this incident won't even come into consideration because it has no relevance to his abilities as coach, mentor, or front man of the MFC. BTW, you can't compare punching someone who has just attacked your friend, to hanging with criminals, assaulting women, taking and possibly distributing illegal drugs and so on.

That is the most sensible answer in this thread. Neita will captain next year if he wants to, and in our 150th year, so he should. McLean, Rivers and Bate to learn off him and be ready to take over in 2009. I'd be happy if McLean was made captain next year, but only if all parties felt ready.