binman

It fits our form line for the fourth year in a row. When I first started discussing load management in 2021 it's fair to say I copped a fair bit. What's crazy is ive copped it every year since - so much so that I barely raise it anymore because I can't be bothered getting pilloried. (It's ironic actually because many of the posters lampooning and shutting down such conversations complain any criticisms of the club they make are policed and shut down - cue the face palm and vomit emojis) Crazy because you would have to actively ignore the evidence to be so wilfully ignorant. I recall mutiple posters, even in the face of iffrefutable evidence, say they won't believe loading happens (which morphed for many into, maybe a factor but.....) until a coach or ex player comes out and says it happens. Ok, well it's starting now to be discussed by such people. Good to hear Cameron Ling come out and discuss it. Del Santo alluded to it on the ABC in the early part of the season, saying it's all about playing your best footy in August and using the tapering for the olympics as an ananlogy Hopefully next season the discussion about high performance programs and load management can move from being a 'dirty word', or a running Demonland joke, to a nuanced discussion that factors in load management into the analysis of our performances. And as I've noted it might also open up discussions like the different high performance philosophies (manage and rotate, no rotation, squads, play through niggles etc) and an analysis of our high performance program. One benefit would be less of the hair on fire, the sky is falling, play the kids, we are a joke, sack goody, it's all about 2025 etc etc that dominates Demonland for a couple of months in the middle of every season. I mean, sure I skew positive, but some of the takes on where we were at coming into the bye, and even after our WIN against the Roos, have already proved to be utterly ridiculous - even if we don’t go on to push for a flag. Silly, vibes based, emotive stuff - but barely commented on, let alone anyone getting called on it Yet I make any reference to the impact of load management on performances like our last game against freo, and i'm ridiculed, with the subtext being, please no mote talk about loading - effectively shutting the conversation down.

Aka Skinner- Bell.

Disagree. Smash them off the park with high intensity pressure and contest. Do what we did against the bombers after the first quarter and: really press up on them to deny them time and space work super hard to cover their switches to make sure they can't play on and have to hold it up anticipate their handball chains and press up hard on likely receivers and smash them suffocate and discombobulate them Force turnovers and make them pay Easy week on the track into the Giants game and go again.

It's not really a theory as such.

As a generalisation, the form of teams in the weeks leading into their bye, and in the one or two weeks after their bye should be ignored. As a footy punter it is a treacherous period and I tread warily. But it does throw up some real value as many punters think of form in terms of week to week performances or blocks of 2 games. So port are great value against the Dogs because in their previous 2 games they got absolutely thrashed by the lions and scrapped in against the saints. And so are terrific value at the line at home against the dogs, who had been in good form. Port thrash the dogs and so people jump off the dogs and they are therefore great value at the line against the blues. But we are now passed that phase and form is now more trustworthy. The way to think about this game is not how we played last time we met the dockers but what our best football looks like versus their best football. The same can be applied to all matches from here on in. The first 6-7 rounds give the best guide, injuries notwithstanding. As I've noted, I don't bet on dees games, but if I did I would launched into us at the line against the bombers because our best football is better than that of the bombers.

And backing up week after week as a big marking target at AFL level.

The sad thing is I'm pretty confident there was almost exactly the same post in the DL game day thread.

Agree we got away with a couple in tge first. I'd be ropeable if I was a bombers fan with that non mark straight in front. A mark every day of tge week. It was crucial too because they were on top and really needed to take advantage of the momentum when they had it. Game would have looked different if they had a 3 goal lead at quarter time instead of one point.

Yes we had Omac and some other guns, but it is patently absurd to suggest out 2019 list was the best in the AFL. I don't mean to knock these blokes but we had the following fringe players in and round our best 22: Vanderburg, Weed, Jay Kennedy Harris, Hore, Oskar Baker, Corey Wagner, Jay Lockhadrt, Frosty, Billy Stretch - not mention players like Kade Kolodjashnij and Aaron Nietschke who couldn't get on the park) for the sake of argument lets say you are right. You may also recall that we had a horror run with injury in 2019 and went into full experimental mode early on - playing Fritter at half and developing the Goodwin contest territory game for example. But for the sake of argument lets run with your opinion we had the best list for five seasons (i'm assuming your posting history reflects this opinion). Strength of the list is absolutely a key factor in the chances of winning a flag. But injury and luck are arguably even more important. Given that, every single club would take one flag from five. Anyway cranky, i'm really not sure why I'm bothering responding to your silliness. I will go back to just reading your random troll bites and having a quiet chuckle. Keep doing you.

Some clubs absolutely do exactly that ie manage players, particularly older players - Geelong being the best example. The cats have done so in earnest since their premiership season. All their older players are rotated and managed. Burgess and Griffith seemingly have a different philosophy, and play the same core of players through the fatigue. Though goody did mention a few weeks ago they planned to rest maxy if they were in a position to do so. Funnily enough the decision had been taken out of their hands. It's worth noting that even if they did manage a senior player tbat player would still have to a full match load on top of normal training to ensure they maintained the right levels.

For sure, partic goals from turnover I'm not so sure we did run out of gas. Well maybe a bit (though not the to the same degree as against tjhe liuns and roos) - which i think we just have to accept with such a young team. And i was amazed the so called experts didn't point out that we were off a six day break to their 8 - Melk sure did in a post match interview when asked about recovering from his first game back after 12 months. I reckon we lost momentum with those two quick goals and couldn't get it back. The umpiring handed the bombers that momentum. I was quietly pleased we didn't give up any more goals.

I saw the ground ball stat and refected on your point about going from losing the differential to winning it in the last few weeks. In 2021-23 ground ball gets were one of key indicators. Seemed to be less significant in a transition game as were winning games early this season despite handily losing ground ball. Contest is key to both methods, and we really dialled up our attack on the ball. It looked liked our best contest footy of 2021-23, but much better on transition 2024 style. That's the hybrid goody is trying to develop I reckon ie a blend of the territory and transition games. I heard goody say the youth of the team is a factor in terms of how they want to play. Which makes sense given even with no gus or smithy we still have a core of excellent senior players who are strong in the contest and hard at. But also have young players like Mcvee, Windsor, Kolt, Bowey and AMW with good wheels we want out in space (though fortunately all are had at in the contest too). That said, even with the hybrid model being perhaps less contest heavy games are still super taxing. Particularly for the young blokes. Must be some challenge to get the program right.

I edited my original post. My first draft was little less diplomatic.

Not bad. I could recycle all my pet hates and bad jokes.

Not your best work cranky. I mean, not even I thought we had the best list six years ago! Stick to the surreally ridiculous. A question. Do YOU think we have had the best list in the last 4-6 years?

Really, playing one down at stoppages has only been made possible by having generational players in maxy, tracc, clarry and jack. And as you've noted the clever tactic of having a high half forward, usually nibbla sitting of the contest. I reckon Jones, who played in that system, meant even numbers not an extra. Again, what drives me nuts is their lack of explanation about the impacts of that decision. For one thing, we use the spare created by playing one down at stoppages behind the ball in an intercepting role. Which would help explain why we didn't do that well in terms intercept and intercept marks differentials, basically breaking even whereas in past seasons we routinely smashed teams for intercepts, particularly intercept marks.

Jones said we were doing so on the coverage. Maybe he meant an extra in the sense we are normally one down? That's to say even numbers. He also said the high half forwards were pushing up to to stoppages too. It drives me nuts they don't show graphics with the set ups and all ground structure. The coverage of afl feels as if it hasn't improved or changed in 20 years. That used to he true of cricket, but coverage of cricket is brilliant now with fantastic use of special comments graphics and video. It's adds so much to my understanding of a game I love and know well.

I'll steal that!

Watching the case game, I thought don't sleep on Benny Brown. Looked in good nick and did some nice thing's.

Agree, and goody said as much ie next week is a different challenge. I'm not arguing we should stick with jvr, roo and turner - though I suspect we will - just suggesting goody implied that we have good reason to. That said, before this game i said i totally got the logic of going with jvr, petts and disco. And i see the logic in doing so again. Yes they have two excellent rucks, but if they run with roo against Darcy roo can exploit Darcy's lack of pace and run off him hard. And whilst petts can't cover Jackson's leap, petts had the strength to match him at around the ground stoppages. Disco too. Having just watched the Casey game I really can't see Fullarton offering anything more in the ruck than petty, and certainly less in around the ground marking and up forward. Ditto Verrell.

Agree. The bombers were pretty impressive. The scoreline flattered us a bit, as evidenced by the x score - 71.3 dees to 75.5 bombres Shows how important accuracy is. McKay was terrific, as was ridley. Their defence has improved out of sight, though still give up too many slingshot goals. Caldwell looks a player. Ditto martin. We did a good job negating merrett, but he is a total gun. Skinner was schooled by a kid, mcvee. And did some really selfish things. Must be a very frustrating player to have in your team. I reckon they went too tall on a wet night, as evidenced by subbing 2MP. Don's def tracking in the right direction. But here's a couple of things to consider in terms of where the dons are at compared to the dees. Take draper and merret out of last night's side, and how would they have gone (we had our two best players out, a ruck and a mid - maxy and tracc)? Caddy was the youngest player on the field. We had the next 7 youngest. The bombers had 3 players with 50 games or under. We had 7.

It's remarkable really. We win a flag and then out in straight sets x 2 and people call for goody's head. Do people really not understand how difficult winning a flag is? Or how difficult it is to finish top 4? I mean, surely of any group of fans dees fans understand these things? Sure we went out in 2 in 2022. But we finished top 4 in 2022 - the year after winning the flag. Ask dogs, cats and pies fans how easy it is to back up after winning a flag. We made top 4 again in 2023 - without a forward line. We are currently in the 8, still an outside chance of top 4. This despite losing 2 best 22, senior players prior to the season starting. And not having another in melk available till round 16 and losing our equal best player in tracc. And having lever and salo out for big blocks of time. And as a result having to field a team more akin to a team in the third year of a rebuild than a contender. What exactly do people expect?

With all sincerity, I love it cranky. I really value consistency.

Picket, to be honest you are coming off as not having a great grasp on what might drive selection in modern footy. I think it is reasonable to assume goody selection is largely driven by picking a team he thinks gives us the best possible chance of winning that game (I say largely because a factor sometimes might be an eye to getting a player ready for finals - so, an eye to winning future games). If goody is picking petts at this point in the season, in a critical 8 point game, it is reasonable to assume he did so because he believed it would help us win. Petty is clearly playing a role, and doing what is asked of him. He is a work horse who gets to contests and provides a down the line marking option. In case you haven't noticed goody has ALWAYS had a player playing such a role in his teams. BBB and Tmac are two such examples. It is a critical part of his structure and method - not least because it gives maxy a chop out from being smashed in such aeriel pack contests all game. And have a listen to goody's answer to another inane question about our forward line. Asked about the forward line mix working in the last 2-3 weeks, implying something radical had changed, he, politely, pointed out that the only change to that mix has been melk and that petts, jvr and disco have played together for most of the season. Cohesion is critical in sport he pointed out. And that takes time he also pointed out. It takes continuity. That's exactly what they have been doing - continuity in selection and building cohesion. And we are seeing the fruits of that approach. Dropping petty does not contribute to continuity or cohesion. And brining in another kid like Jefferson does nothing to help us win, or for cohesion - or the kid's development for that matter. And seriously, do you really think Fullarton would have helped us win last night? Bloke is barely passing muster as a ruck at VFL level Despite the frankly ridiculous hand wringing on here about selection, we won the raw clearance count - which by the by is not a particularly useful stat these days as it's not a measure of impact. What is a measure of impact is scores from stoppages, which critically we won by 14 points. In fact it was arguably the deciding factor in our win given they scored 3 more points from turnover. That doesn't happen without petty. Goody deserves credit and praise not brickbats. Which is why, when responding to a question about who we might play in the ruck against freo goody visibly bristled, before noting the option he ran with this week clearly JUST WORKED, implying the obvious- why would we change something that literally just proved successful?

We did. But equally if weren't so accurate we would have list more percentage- and might well have lost the game. The bombers were pretty impressive I thought. The scoreline flattered us a bit, as evidenced by the x score - 71.3 dees to 75.5 bombres