praha

Not technically a "key" forward. He's someone you use to build around key forwards. A good small forward is useless if you don't have a dedicated target nearby.

Wins alone though was a poor gauge this year specifically. In past seasons it was a gauge, yes, but this year it was finals. And it's not like we struggled to get there. We missed out by losing to teams below us. We are well beyond simply "improving" as a guage of success and fail. Geelong improved this year but the season was a failure. Same as GWS. We improved but the season was ultimately a failure. Finals have been a KPI for 2 seasons now.

They're mostly coming out of the Freo camp. There may be some truth it to but I dont think we'd be looking to offload Watts if Hogan was on the way out. Regardless, while I'm admittedly in the "Trade Watts" camp, if there's any inkling that Hogan won't stay long term, it would be a mistake to offload Watts unless there is talent coming directly into the forward from his trade. There's no doubt that trading Watts stands as a huge risk.

No, read my post again. I said it was the nail in the coffin. The end of the road. Not based exclusively on that game. And yes I've also called for other players to be given the boot. The fewer players still lingering from the Bailey and Neeld years, the better. It's cutting away the fat. Imo only Viney and Gawn from that group should be untouchable (Hogan too if you count him as Neeld era). The North game was really just a symbol of his career. We can expect that from Weeds because he's play 10 games. Watts has played AFL for 10 years and still puts in performances like that. And you can't deny it because he was then dropped, and it's arguably the match that sealed his fate.

Also, this: http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/teams/melbourne/paul-roos-says-every-melbourne-player-is-tradeable-as-the-demons-preseason-begins/news-story/2e9089976a1fba1f4fe8ef57ceb8ce3d

Excet Dusty came good 4 years ago. And now he's playing the best footbal of his career. How long will Watts take to play consistent football and, you know, tackle? He's coming up to his 10th season 10th!

It seems like a locker room thing. Watts has probably be at the club for too long and has found a comfort zone. His performance against North was imo the nail in the coffin. I don't think I've ever been so angry after a Melbourne match and his effort was so obviously lacking that it's difficult to defend him. Kicking winning goals on QB means jack if you can't even chase in the business end of the season with finals on the line. Let's get rid of these perennial losers, get what we can from them, and build a club filled with blokes that don't just hate to lose, but use that as drive and application to perform. I'm sure Watts hates losing but I've lost patience now. We were shown up in the last month of football and in this case I feel he can be considered part of the problem . He's a 9 year veteran of the club who is stil getting dropped. I'm so sick of this [censored].

Nature of the beast. More members, more supporters, rising costs = pricier membership

It's doing the round. Apparently he was at some function and someone asked if he'd like to stay at Melbourne and his supposed response was something along the lines of, "Bit hard when they're kicking you out the door". He's gonski.

Basketball is a good bet now, arguably better than Gaelic football for a number of reasons. Generally, anyone playing at least representative state basketball needs a relatively good basketball IQ, which is often not taught. The complexities of the sport and its plays often demand a bright player. So if you're digging into the basketball talent pool you're almost guaranteed a smart kid that is adaptable and knows how to apply complex tactics on game day. On top of that, the modern basketball game shares a demand for core strength, so the physical transition isn't as tough. Basketball is all about using your core strength to get front position and protect the ball, which is half the battle in AFL. Completely different sports yet strangely share a lot in common. Gaelic football on the other hard is an AFL-soccer hybrid that discourages physical contact and isn't anywhere near as tactical.

It's finally happening. The Toump is returning.

The problem is that our "hard" players are never of the Selwood or Dangerfield or Hodge variety. We seem to draft a whole bunch of Mitch Robinson's who seem to embrace the fact they're AFL players and that's it. Go through the motions, do what you need and get the pay check. A "hard" player is either one driven by success or driven by the symbolism attached to what it is to be recognised as a "hard" player. Moloney and Sylvia were both equally good players as they were dumb and lazy. As soon as the going actually got tough, they were ineffective. I think Melbourne supporters just hate losers. We've had a lot of those players over the years. Perennial losers who could easy notch flags at VFL level but don't have the mental capacity or drive at AFL level.

All true but doesn't really argue the point that he's worth any more than an early second round pick. I just think he's a dime a dozen midfielder and I can't imagine in a million years a team giving up their first round pick for him. As it currently stands.

His game was good at the absolute worst time, though. Proving a point in Round 2 means nothing if you can't play like a leader in the club's most important game for a decade. He and those around him let a second-string midfield control the game. He escapes criticism far too much.

If we got pick 20 for Tyson I'd throw in steak knives for the other team just out of pity.

When you need to bring in guys like Lewis, Cross, Vince to "lead", it's a massive indictment on the leadership crop and the club's own recruitment policy before then. We've basically had to recruit from outside the club to get people in to play the role Melbourne-drafted player should already be filling. We're still a long way off, and as Viney said, it's difficult to buy in when you don't feel "part" of something. That's a learning process, and it takes years.

I honestly think that trading Watts can be our "Vickery" moment. I don't think he's the kind of downhill skier you want around when you're trying to play finals. He sometimes plays like a loser and this has carried on for far too long. This is what I wanted to happen before Cox resigned with the Pies: Pick 10 and Watts to Collingwood for Pick 6 and Cox. Pick 6 to Adelaide for Lever. IMO that makes us a better team, and a raw albeit fit and strong ruckman who isn't injured every week of the year like Spencer was. He's good for a goal game, can mark the ball and is a big body. These rumours of Pick 10 and Watts for Collingwood's pick 6 just have to be overdone. We'd need a player in return for that.

I think that Goodwin had a very good year from a simple win:loss perspective, but there are a few questions there. The players we lost, the injuries and suspensions, and fixturing given. The losses were "typical Melbourne" and I think it's a lockerroom thing which is why guys like Watts, Jones need to be eventually moved on. I think this was a transitioning and learning year for him and don't be surprised if we make shock moves this offseason. Also don't be surprised if we miss the finals next year and he's under pressure. I'm not convinced. End of the day this is futile. We've been building towards "sustained success" and the club is out of excuses. Literally. No more discussion of "We've improved" or "It's a journey". It's a journey for everyone and every team. It's not unique to you. Goodwin can either pretend the past 10 years haven't happened (which he does), or he can grab it, own it, and take responsibility for turning it around. I hated him saying the drought against North didn't matter. If the club doesn't make finals next year, we're looking at another clean house and rebuild. It would he so tough to sell that. You'd be looking at another members exodus. I don't think Goodwin survives if we miss next year. I'm just worried that the wheels fall off ala 2011 and we break down. Maybe it's just me but I feel like we're on the edge: either we climb high, or we fall hard.

Not only that but of all the close games we played in, all of them except the Hawthorn loss we didn't poll any votes. How can one team get all the votes when the match is determined by less than a goal?

Why is Jack Fitzpatrick there lol

Gonna be a great game imo. Adelaide is imo the strongest Grand Final side for a long time and Richmond is at full strength and with a lot of momentum. Could go either way imo. Would not be surprised if Richmond hold on and win

Not sure if serious

I think our 2017 was Hawthorn's 2004. They won a bunch of games they shouldn't have but seemed to lose to team's at or below them on the ladder. An immaure team that was still transitioning with a "changing of the guard". I'm not convinced we'll be a finals side in 2018 especially with the likes of Watts and Jones at the forefront of what helps define the club. They're basically the Lord and Ritchie Vandenberg of this current Melbourne team. Sure they're good to have around now but you probably don't want them to be best 22 when you're on the verge of playing finals. I've said it a million times before, but we still need to make hard decisions if we truly want Viney, Oliver, Petracca and Co. to lead the new crop.

What was with so many finals being played at Waverley in the 80s? Was the ground being primed to replace the MCG?