praha

I like the idea of Tyson playing deep.

Harmes Oliver and Bradshaw are leading this club atm. Guys like Jones and Lewis need to stand up. Last week they were pathetic and Jones has a lot of ground to make up to break the perennial loser tag.

Will have a firm eye on Jones today.

Either we turn the corner today, or fulfil yet another prophecy of disappointment. Just can't see it happening unfortunately. Sorry fam.

I have said something similar on here before. Our membership is thereabouts with the Bulldogs (2016 flag), Saints ([censored] now but consistent finalists to start the decade), and North (never bottom out, played finals consistently including Prelims and overachieving many years). That we have 45k+ members is a damn testament to our resilience and commitment to the club considering the [censored] we have gone through. It is tough going however, and our growth is minimal year-on-year. IMO, round 23 and missing finals last year cost us 10k members. I really try to not care but I always get sucked in. After the Richmond game this year I skipped the Essendon game but then got back on the bandwagon. It was the first time I had willingly skipped a game I could attend in more than a decade. All other Melbourne games I had missed, I missed because I literally couldn't attend for one reason or another. I then got back on the bandwagon. After the St Kilda loss, I was close to the edge but stuck around. The Geelong game really ticked me off, and I switched off for most of the Adelaide game. After last week, I reacted badly and booked tickets to see Mission Impossible tomorrow. I now intend to write off the money I spent on the ticket to instead go to the pub and watch a game I'm confident we'll lose. I swear following this team is like heroin. I've never taken heroin but I hear that after the initial high, you keep chasing that one awesome high, and constantly find yourself disappointed (and with less money than what you started with). I was 20 when we last played and won a final. I'd never had a full time job, was earning about $100 a week and spent my free time playing PlayStation 2. I'm now in a managerial role, have a mortgage, am married, own a car, have travelled the world (3 times), started a business, sold a business, seen two siblings and three cousins get married, became an uncle once, twice, and for a third time, completed a degree, a post-grad diploma, and a masters. Also, John Howard was Prime Minister. IMO I'd rather not remember when we last played finals, then remember. I am essentially paying $600 years to remember.

Worth discussing come end of round 23. Still 2 rounds to play. I dismiss claims we are weak or soft. IMO it is part leadership (or lack thereof), part coaching, and part lack of big game experience. No amount of personal reflection and mental analysis will change that. Also consider that, aside from the Hawthorn-Richmond games in Rounds 4 and 5, respectively, we have come up against top 8 sides having played lower-placed/poor sides for multiple weeks. IMO this makes it difficult to establish good habits and to play at a consistently high level, a problem for a young side that is not used to the pressure. How can they know of what it takes to play at a consistent high level when they can play in second gear one week and win by 90 points, and then face a tough side? We're talking about a team led by a brigade that has never played finals, nor played in such high-pressure contests consistently. I don't think we will beat WC but I think that coming into the match having just played Sydney is a good thing. There is a consistent quality of opponent over three weeks, and so, really, this is the best three-game period you could ask for coming into the finals: get that big scalp, and anything is possible. It's perfect timing. We will win one of the next two. I hope it's this week.

Just imagine if, in round 23, our 160th celebration and "Members Appreciation round", during which we will be wearing a guernsey with members names on it, we lose against GWS, after losing to WC, and miss finals. Not sure who is in charge in their PR department, nor who is there to assess brand risk, but it was a terrible oversight to schedule that initiative in for round 23. Our onfield capitulations are one thing. Sometimes I am rather astonished at how dense the club's marketing and media department can be. (for the record though I think they do a wonderful job most of the time, but this was a bad idea).

time left?

In umps defense, Tigers have played lazy all night, and the umpires are penalising them for it.

Every year it's next year. Missing finals would be underperforming.

This is defeatist and imo part of the problem. I highly doubt Goodwin thinks the expectations are irrational. Making finals is completely in line with where the team should be at this point. Yes we're not "there" as far as being a top side yet. But undoubtedly we should be playing finals. I really hope the approach at the club isn't, "Well we're just not there yet. Next year it is!" I don't accept the "we're just not ready yet" to simply play finals excuse, because it bypasses criticism and blankets KPIs. They are ready. The mental hurdle for them imo is actually believing -- knowing -- that. I'm not an expert. I just have high expectations because, believe it or not with all of my negativity, I genuinely believe in the team. And I think a lot here do. And it annoys me when people say we're not ready for finals. We are, and we should be. No team in the history of the game takes this long to be "ready" for finals. It's unheard of. How do you overcome a mental hurdle without...actually overcoming it? You can only learn to overcome it by actually overcoming it. It's not like mathematics. No one gifts you a solution or a process for you to decipher. You need to take ownership yourself and find a way to do it. You're ready when you want to be. Experience doesn't dictate readiness. You can either hit the jackpot like Geelong or Hawthorn did in the 2000s, or you can take ownership of your opportunities and hit them off the park. Seriously, saying "they're not ready yet" is the Demonland equivalent of Nathan Jones walking off the ground with his head down. Which is basically the symbol of the club for the past decade. It's a loser mentality.

We're well on our way to our best ever underperforming season, that's for sure.

Been the story all week. Everyone is saying once we turn the corner and get a scalp, we'll be right up there. Believe it when I see it.

I think WC may struggle to contain the smalls give their tall defenders,hence why Spargo is still playing.

In Melksham,Weeds,Hibberd,Kent Out Hogan,Pederson,Hunt,Garlett

Well if we're going for a like for like with Hogan out, then yes. 20 metres behind the opposition at every opportunity.

Not if WC match the offer, which they likely would unless it's a North offer for $50 million and an island in the Caribbean.

Gen Y here with a 21st century maths education. Can you explain what the [censored] that means? lol

To be frank I think they're going to give us a good old fashion football lesson. I think the pressure and skepticism is too much for this team. They looked mentally drained after the weekend. Happy to be proven wrong.

We need to turn the corner. Worst thing for this team's development atm would be to lose both and miss finals. Missing finals last year is imo what puts us in this situation again. Without breaking through the pressure and playing finals, they don't know of the actual level required to reach there. It's a chicken egg scenario: you can't know what it takes to make finals without actually making it. But how can you make it if you don't know how? If we miss again I suspect Goodwin to go back to the drawing board and do a mini rebuild aka Richmond at the end of 2016. That may well mean hard decisions and a Deledio-type trade of a/some favourite sons. Stats are quantifiable and accurate. We are not a 100% chance to make finals. We are a 95% chance based on our performance and statistics. The 5% is an outlier and may be immeasurable in some capacity.

Weirdly, i saw two people going to work this morning wearing a Demons scarf AND beanie.

Not sure this is a reflection of gameplan but agree that under pressure we spray and our skills drop off considerably. I mentioned that earlier and two posters put words in my mouth by saying I was attacking the gameplan. All teams' skills drop under pressure but it is the capacity to be accountable defensively that is key. Sydney of 2005 were an awful kicking sider and not especially skilled, but they were accountable. 120 uncontested possession differential on the weekend against a team 2 down suggests we were shockingly unaccountable and lazy.

Good question. I didn't say it was the fault of the gameplay or coach

How do you know?

True but it's also a reflection of the better team. They couldn't miss. We did. Sydney matched and better us for intensity, pace and spacing all game. They were down 2 players and that is imo a better metric of how we played than our inaccuracy.