Rhino Richards

I dont dismiss the debt. I understand it and I know what it means. It was an important issue to address. You clearly dont and seek to put an emphasis or a view on it that detaches from reality. The Club certainly isnt any more open about itself since this administration came in. We as a group were kept horribly in the dark in the week leading up to 186 and we were left in the dark in the weeks after it. The debt reduction has been and gone. The backbone of the Club should be an effective business model which we is sustainable and an on field team that is successful. We are not there yet. And as the high jump bar for running a football club gets higher and higher we are not that far away from financial difficulties. Schwab must be waiting for you to handle him first WYL. ....Soften him up a little...

No one is saying that it was not good business. Why do you go on about it? Repaying the debt does not necessarily involve members more beyond a personal disposition of each member. All you are doing is asking (eg begging) to put more money in above and beyond yor membership dues without receiving any guarantees in return. I feel no more involved in the Club from having contributed to the debt eradication. Well Geelong's outcome too was good business. Its merely an issue of the process as you have pointed out. Well you can ask Greg Denham when you give him your 8 cylinders or whatever.

It was a tin shake whatever you want to call it. And its your call if you would have contributed or not on the semantics of "begging" It was a relentless process. And no one was questioning whether it needed to be done but merely see it for what it was.

You missed the point. he was not saying that its not good for the Club but the Club did go begging members who were generous enough to pay off the debt. If we concde Melbourne tanked then MFC are not a serious club. Its naive to think that the process to play for draft picks was the decision of the coach alone. Absolutely dreamtime. Schwab, Stynes and the Board were part of that. And I agree that we did it at the time. Hell that would have Denham seriously quaking in his boots. Given you spent so long with journalists, did they ever tell you war stories of confrontations with nutcases in the general community. I am sure Denham wont intimidate you especially if you have his address and appear on his doorstep. He realise that you sure are one tough cookie. Keep punching legend. I struggle to see how Bailey could have been relaxed at MFC with so many knives drawn at his back. I dont think the words were well chosen by Jimmy but i am sure there is nothing malicious.

Corrected, the years blur after a while.....

I think you are flossing things to suit your argument. The process did not specifically focus on individual players. Bailey was announced as MFC coach on 31 August 2007. http://www.afl.com.a...08&newsId=50195 Clearly the interview process had commenced from when Daniher was sacked at the end of Rd 13. Clearly there needed to be long term recovery of the side but it was Bailey's presentation and plan that was voted by the Board. Bailey was there to implement the plan. In addition to that, Bailey took action on TJ and Carroll re culture and jettisoned McLean at first opportunity when his contract was up. He deserves the credit for the staged retirement of a number of senior players who thought they could give more but were not part of the future. What game plan would have worked successfully with ageing players who could not compete offensively and defensively and when you have kids. Could you come up with a plan to make the players older and more experienced as well as fitter? We were never reaistically going to be seriously challenging in 2011. And given the injury list we had during the season all the best laid plans would have gone to waste. Rpfc is not congratulated but reasonably evaluating the contributions of Bailey. Sheedy is doing the exact opposite to what he did in his final 5 -6 years at Essendon. So he does have a track record and it is pertinent to an assessment of what he would bring to MFC if he were to be coach from 2007 onwards. GWS is a completely different situation to MFC. Its not a rebuild. Its a start up with generous early draft picks. Its obvious what needs to be done. Its a blind Freddy situation. Sheedy at MFC would not have had the patience or time to have rebuilt to where we needed to be. His history of swapping picks for stop gaps would have compromised the pool. But you are right he is a good marketeer. But he should not be so easily discounted as a Coach Kevin Sheedy is doing in Sydney exactly what he was hired to do, and the AFL would be very happy with his performance. He has the AFL public hanging on his every word, he is making news, and with the manufactured rivalries will get people to the games next year. Allen, Silvagni and Williams will take care of the list and the development, Sheedy will get the headlines. Possibly but there start to date has been poor. And they have an ordinary and expensive list of AFL seasoned footballers. If anything their window will be later than MFCs

I am more worried about people who get riled by Denham comments rather than the bile that Denham has to say.

I am wondering how you determined "Other wise Sheedy might have been better." If the future is bleak and you believe we cant be worse off than we are currently in 2011 then you will be in your element.

And the position is not any different from what I expected. At the end of 2007 our list was a train wreck that was always going to take 5 years to address. We have blooded one of the youngest lists around. I am actually excited by the young players we have and who is coming through. And yes they will have to come through to make the next steps. The next 3 years have nothing to add on the Bailey outcome. He ran the risk of seeking to play a modern game style that was too much for under developed and inexperienced team. History has shown that it takes normally at least 7 years to put together a flag team. I cant think of a bigger rebuild than what MFC has done. The next 3 years may say something about how good a recruiter Prendegast is. Why would Sheedy have been better? What other options were there to do with our train wreck list at the end of 2007 and what sort of future would we have been looking at with Sheedy's habit of recycling often hack players. That was not course of action to repair the list.

My understanding was that Bailey in his presentation to the Board stated that the list had to completely rebulit and culture elements like Travis had to go. Bailey was clear what had to be done. It was hardly down to a Board directive if Bailey had put this as his pitch for the job. He was honest to his intention. I further understand that Sheedy was cast out of the process after the first interview because he could articulate anything about the MFC list in the interview process other than "I am Kevin Sheedy and you either want me or you dont". I cant see how MFC could have gone further with Sheedy and glad they didn't.

Believe it or not, the expansion of the game is dependent on providing sufficient TV content to sustain the massive TV rights that is the financial lifeblood of the AFL and every club in it. Without the largesse from the TV rights, clubs like Melbourne would not financially exist. You are right about the gap between rich and poor and its critical that MFC develop a successful business model within the pre eminent football code in Australia. I cant understand all the desire for GWS or GC to fail. Its in everyone's interest including MFC that the AFL is a profitable viable sporting competition. The AFL needs to make headway in NSW to further entrench the code. Too many are being washed aside from the early waves to miss the bigger picture.

I must have been looking at a different player. Over his career he kicked 35.31. i dont believe his kicking was atrocious. Its was inconsistent. I saw him play at Sandy and Casey where in swirling conditions was kicking goals on the angle from the 50 metre arc. And had he addressed the issue you pointed out, it still would not have saved his career. He was pick 46 in 2004 and recruited as an underage punt. You must be massively disappointed with so many MFC footballers that dont go on with it. There is nothing unusual about Newton's career. Anyway this is Wonna's thread. Good luck Aussie.

I just checked the records and Aust played Pakistan at home after the 1981 ashes in Oct-Dec 1981. Wellham did not play in the first test but played the next 2 tests and you're right he never lived up to the day at the Oval. He may well have been injured for the first test but I cannot recall.

And I did say "last rookied". Its good you did some research neverthe less. The issue with retention of Newton was the forward ruck and he was a cheap option where we had few. Its not just an issue of applying hindsight that he is not up to it. As Old has mentioned Martin, Langford, Mahony and Kruger thats the options. And each were further way than Juice from playing. Its not a matter of good and bad drafts.

Newton was last rookied in 2009 with the view to being insurance as the "forward/2nd ruck" role. I am sure you can do the research to work out who was still available at the low levels of the rookie list to ascertain who could have immediately filled that role. I am sure we missed out on a real gem. The bottom line is that Newton has not deserved the hyped up hand wringing and derogatory references from posters over a number of years on this site.

Ok thanks. He was a NSW Captain at the time and not the most popular cricketer going around. I think he got dropped for the next season after scoring a ton in the last test of the Ashes series. Funny I didnt realise he came back and played another 5 tests over 5 years.

I'd be disappointed if we didnt pick up better players. With Wonna's flaky commitment atm, I would not bother rookieing him. Sad finish to an AFL opportunity. Hope he finds peace up home.

What I suggested reflected the greyness of the issue not the black and white that you are naively claming. But thanks for bravado and typos. Well done on missing the point. I never besmirched Todd at all. In a nutshell. But its benefit will be wasted where it is needed most.

I didnt realise Newton held back each of the above players. Shame on him. Would you like to list out all the rookies that dont make it over the same period? Its a far longer list. The issue was Newton was taking a rookie position in his last 2 years. His spot on the list was taking (I think Old 55 had it) about No 70 in the rookie draft that year. A devastating loss whoever that young gun is..

You are kidding. The space on our list is a rookie spot. Keep sweating the very small stuff. Indeed.

Hell, Dirk Wellham must have been hated given he never played a Test again after an away series Ashes century. I am not sure either Katich or Clarke's blotters are unmarked but one is the incumbent Test Captain starting to get some form and just winning a series in Sri Lanka. The other is 36yo, bitter and not making runs....

With some players that could be the case in question. I think this is more a situation where Col was just being.......Col.

Thought the same thing. Expect reports that certain players are "training the house down"

Todd was an assistant coach at Adelaide. He was enticed to MFC and then a month later blow me down we signed his son. Of course there not connected. Do you know what Viney is on to determine his salary is "fair"? The slap at Gleeson is unnecessary. While the AFL has ruled on the Scully matter, its a fine line with Viney. Despite the bleating, the questions should be rightly asked.

Yikes! Victoria 317/7 (49/49 ov) New South Wales 323/3 (40.4/49 ov) Wow! Victoria batted well after a difficult start and 774 radio had them a shoo in with that score. Ouch. Smith 29yo and built like a brick fortress hits 12 sixes. Katich 13 and he may want to make his bat talk louder than his mouth.