This is the team of mostly current players that i think could really challange in the next 4 or so years

please note that i am trying my hardest not to do anything unrealistic (such as kerr/cousings/r warnock) and that i am not putting robbo, jmac, bruce, wheatley, green or whelan in, who i dont think will be there in 4 or so years

I am making this because I am sick of people/posters from everywhere saying that melbourne still need to make radical changes with a mediocre young list at best

FB: James Frawley, Stefin Martin, Mathew Warnock

HF: Colin Garland, Jarad Rivers, Kyle Cheney/Tom McNamara

C: Aaron Davey, Cale Morton, Simon Buckley/Jack Grimes

HF: Austin Wonna, Jack Watts, Colin Sylvia

FF: Addam Marric, Brad Miller, Mathew Bate

Foll: Paul Johnson, Brock Mclean, Nathan Jones

Bench: Jack Spencer, Brent Moloney, Ricky Pettard, Chris Johnson

apologies/emergencies to newton, valenti, bell, meesen etc

This is the team of mostly current players that i think could really challange in the next 4 or so years

please note that i am trying my hardest not to do anything unrealistic (such as kerr/cousings/r warnock) and that i am not putting robbo, jmac, bruce, wheatley, green or whelan in, who i dont think will be there in 4 or so years

I am making this because I am sick of people/posters from everywhere saying that melbourne still need to make radical changes with a mediocre young list at best

FB: James Frawley, Stefin Martin, Mathew Warnock

HF: Colin Garland, Jarad Rivers, Kyle Cheney/Tom McNamara

C: Aaron Davey, Cale Morton, Simon Buckley/Jack Grimes

HF: Austin Wonna, Jack Watts, Colin Sylvia

FF: Addam Marric, Brad Miller, Mathew Bate

Foll: Paul Johnson, Brock Mclean, Nathan Jones

Bench: Jack Spencer, Brent Moloney, Ricky Pettard, Chris Johnson

apologies/emergencies to newton, valenti, bell, meesen etc

This is potentially one of the greatest Melbourne sides ever assembled. It is also potentially one of the worst. It is all about potential.

One proven midfielder in Mclean, a capable forward in Miller, an injury prone backman in Rivers and a classy, speedy yet injury prone matchwinner in Davey.

The rest have either shown glimpses of promise and are largely unproven. Some of these will turn out to be good players, maybe one or two will be very good and many will make up the numbers or not make it at all.

I agree that this has the potential to be a "nucleus" but there is a huge amount of development to go. That is reliant on coaching and development but mostly on the individual players.

IMO opinion, (watts excluded) only Davey (on his day), Buckley and possibly Garland have what it takes to be top liners although everyone will have different ideas.

Nevertheless Nugget I admire your optimism and I hope you are right.

I think you've pretty much summed up what is WRONG with the list as it currently sits. There are holes all over the place there.

Backline: Garland has given us all cause for genuine celebration, but other than that the rest are largely unproven. Frawley has question marks galore, Martin has played a handful of good games only, Rivers is all class but has a body that runs like a Morris Minor, Warnock has played 1 ok season (so has Carroll, and look how popular he is) and he's in his mid-twenties (less upside). Cheney and McNamara look like they have the gift, but neither has so much as played a game yet. Just because you have potential... The league is chockablock full of rookies with potential that were let go. If 3 of those "maybe" players became 100-150 game players I'd be thrilled. What I'm trying to say is we don't look like we have a backline that will one day resemble Adelaide, or Geelong's... That's 1/7

Centre: Davey has done little to prove he can handle the midfield for 22 rounds. He's in his mid twenties now. He's a proven forward, yes, but we can't afford to play him there right now. Looks to have perhaps lost a yard too, maybe due to repeated hammies. Morton looks the goods, and there's no reason to sneer at Buckley or Grimes... 3/4 I'll give you that.

Forward: Sylvia is a good player, I doubt he'll ever be great. Wonna is in all our hearts, but I don't think he'll scale great heights. Miller is hardworking, but no star. Marric looks like a Rolls Royce so far, and Bate is a very, very good player. When he gets older he'll be like Lucas, only.... you know... good. Watts, if he comes, will be given absolutely every opportunity. So that's 3/6 for mine.

Foll: Johnson is going to be the best backup ruckman in the game when he gets into his twenties. Could come close to a Bluey. But he's not a starting ruckman and it's unlikely he'll be the starting ruckman in an MFC premiership. Brock's would get a game at Geelong. Jones will be the next JMac at best. I'd say that's 1, maybe 1.5/3.

Bench: Spencer? Who? Do you remember Neaves? He got an extension, people thought he'd be a certainty to debut, but he's now long-gone. Moloney is another mid who could be a leader, but his body just aint there, Petterd shines, and CJ has lifted his reputation 10-fold.... for me that's 2/4...

So altogether, out of that 22, I reckon that's 10 I have faith in. Add Valenti (harsh he missed out) to that and that's half a team. And sides don't win premierships with 22 players. They use closer to 30 year-round...

So my problem with your contention is that the side you represent there is a long way off being good enough, even in the future. In fact, when we do inevitably rise again, I just can't see many of those names being a part of it.

I do reckon we have cause to be excited though. We have 3 more picks inside the first 3 rounds this year, plus some good-uns next year.

The big problem with 'land and 'ology, and MFC fandom in the greater sense is that we're not even seeing our future finals side in its embryonic stages yet. We still have 1, maybe 2 drafts left 'til we have our core group of names, and that's not even including how long it'll take to blood a new starting ruckman, and KP forwards.

When we have those NAMES, plus their faces and footy form to look at things will pick up at MFC. At such a pace we haven't seen in years, perhaps at all since our last flag.

I thought that Lynden Dunn was impressive in his shutdown roles this year and I'd like the Dee's to perservre(sp?) with him to see if he could turn into a Cameron Ling type player although I sometimes feel he would be more suited to a KP. He is a great finisher especially on the run from 50 out.

The reason why we'v done so badly last year or 2 and will continue next year is because our 24yr and older players never turned into the players we hoped they would be. We all hoped Bruce, Green, Johnstone and even White and Yze would become stars.

None of them could ever for more than a very breif period of time be counted in the top 20-30 players in the afl. At this point in time, we would struggle to find a player in the top 60 players in the afl.

Every top club who has ever had a premiership has developed players who are in the top few players in the afl. These stars were crucial to premiership and the lack of a 'star' player in what left us 5th-8th position from 2004-2007, instead of 1st-4th.

If we are going to vie for a premiership then we must find a player who develops into a star.

That is why last draft, this years draft and next years draft are so hugely important to our future. One of these players needs to develop themselves in the op echolon of players in the afl.

2006-

Pettard, Frawley, Garland

2007-

Morton, Grimes, Maric and Martin

2008-

Pick 1, pick 17, pick 19

2009- probably...

pick 1, pick 2 and pick 18.

That's 13 players. All highly talented, all highly rated and most of them top 20 draft picks! Not all 13 of them need to become superstars, only 1 or 2. If this happens, the other 11 will be great players and go along for the ride.

Add to those 13 players guys like N.Jones, M.Bate, A.Davey, C.Johnson, J.Rivers, S.Buckley, M.Warnock etc and we will have a list that could POTENTIALLY make top 4.

It's about time MFC learned how to turn a player into a superstar. If one of our players develops like this, in 4 years we could pushing for a tilt at the flag. If all those 13 guyz mentioned become solid, o.k. players (ala Johnstone, Green, Bruce, Wheatley) then we are destined for more pain.

From current team 25 and under only, we need to get about three, quality players on each broad category.

tall backs from: Rivers, Garland, Warnock, Frawley, Martin.

small/medium backs from: Petterd, Grimes, Bell, Bartram.

'Inside' midfield from: Mclean, Jones, Moloney, Dunn (tagging)

'outside' midfield from: Morton, C. Johnson, Buckley,

Small Forwards from: Davey, Maric, Wonaeamirri, Sylvia (rotating midfield)

Tall Forwards: Miller, Bate, Newton, P. Johnson (rotating ruck)

Ruck: Jamar (rotating forward) ... ...

The trouble with making any kind of predicition is that Melbourne easily led the competition for number of games played this season by players who had less than 10 games experience.

We also, once again, had all sorts of horrible injury disruptions, including young players who we are still waiting to get a clear picture of.

For the next couple of years at least some of Green, Bruce, Whelan, Wheatley and McDonald will be around to help things along.

But there is clearly a need for a first rate ruckman, a first rate full-forward who can kick bags of goals, and a pile of skill across the board.

I think we can make it, if this draft and next years give us two high quality players each, we've got a bit of a team going on.

couldnt really argue with much of this tbh

sylvinator... That's what I was getting at regarding all the upcoming drafts, though I will point out 2 things wrong...

1: It's Petterd, not Pettard...

2: I highly doubt we'll get 1 AND 2 next season.

I think the basic premise of the thread was "we are not as crap as we may fear."

On that I agree, our talent is young. And with young talent, it is all potential.

But with Buckley, Jones, Batram, McLean, Bate, Miller, Frawley, Morton, PJ, Sylvia, Dunn, Petterd, Grimes, CJ, Maric, Garland, Bell, Moloney, Rivers, Newton, Martin, Davey, Warnock, Wonaeamirri, Jamar, and Valenti all 25 or younger at the start of next season, and all showing varying levels of potential I don't despair like some.

Add 3 more players (hopefully 4 with a trade) from this draft in the top 20 and possibly McNamara, Cheney, and Spencer, and you have 32 players that have may have a very bright future.

Turn 60 - 70 percent of them into good players and you'll have a very competitive team.

From current team 25 and under only, we need to get about three, quality players on each broad category.

tall backs from: Rivers, Garland, Warnock, Frawley, Martin.

small/medium backs from: Petterd, Grimes, Bell, Bartram.

'Inside' midfield from: Mclean, Jones, Moloney, Dunn (tagging)

'outside' midfield from: Morton, C. Johnson, Buckley,

Small Forwards from: Davey, Maric, Wonaeamirri, Sylvia (rotating midfield)

Tall Forwards: Miller, Bate, Newton, P. Johnson (rotating ruck)

Ruck: Jamar (rotating forward) ... ...

Tall Backs: look promising all of a sudden. Warnock/Martin to take oppositions 'monster' forwards, Garland is important as he can play small or tall. Hopefully allows Rivers to play on 3rd tall, allowing him to zone off and do what he does best. Jury still out on Frawley.

Small/Medium Backs: Petterd and Grimes have promise, but Bell and Bartram went backwards in 2008.

Inside Mids: McLean, Jones, and Moloney should be reliable if they stay fit. Still unsure on Dunn.

Outside Mids: I think Morton will be a tall wingman with a huge engine who will be hard to match up on. CJ and Buckley, also look very promising

Small Forwards: Davey needs to refind his spark, atm he is useful, but not the matchwinner he used to be. Wona and Maric look good. While Sylvia may not turn out to be the superstar we hoped he might, he is still definitely in our best 22, playing as a roaming HFF.

Tall Forwards: Miller is a tryer and is handy, but nothing more. Bate will play further up ground and wont kick bags. Newton looked shite this year, so not expecting much, but hoping to be pleasantly surprised.

Ruck: PJ will ruck and be dangerous around the ground. Jamar is still useless.

For me, the blokes who have shown they have a future (Rivers, Moloney injuries permitting):

FB: Rivers Warnock ????

HB: Grimes Garland Petterd

C: Morton Jones C.Johnson

HF: Sylvia ???? Bate

FF: Davey ???? Maric

R: P.Johnson McLean Buckley

INT: ????(2nd Ruck) Wonaemirri Moloney Martin

For me, the blokes who have shown they have a future (Rivers, Moloney injuries permitting):

FB: Rivers Warnock ????

HB: Grimes Garland Petterd

C: Morton Jones C.Johnson

HF: Sylvia ???? Bate

FF: Davey ???? Maric

R: P.Johnson McLean Buckley

INT: ????(2nd Ruck) Wonaemirri Moloney Martin

FB:Petterd Warnock Rivers

HB: Buckley Martin Frawley

C: Morton Mclean Grimes

HF: RECRUIT RECRUIT Bate

FF: Davey Miller Maric

R: RECRUIT RECRUIT RECRUIT

INT: Wonaemirri Sylvia PJohnson RECRUIT

EM: Jones Moloney Dunn RECRUIT

RECRUIT includes players such as Cheney and McNamara who may or may not come along

It also relies on injured players coming good and some development time.

FB:Petterd Warnock Rivers

HB: Buckley Martin Frawley

C: Morton Mclean Grimes

HF: RECRUIT RECRUIT Bate

FF: Davey Miller Maric

R: RECRUIT RECRUIT RECRUIT

INT: Wonaemirri Sylvia PJohnson RECRUIT

EM: Jones Moloney Dunn RECRUIT

RECRUIT includes players such as Cheney and McNamara who may or may not come along

It also relies on injured players coming good and some development time.

I agree with most of it, but where's Garland? I also think the team has to plan the furure without Rivers and if he makes it back in any real way it will be a bonus. I agree that our deficiencies in the forward line are matched by our on ball deficiencies but I hope that Jones can make it.

I agree with most of it, but where's Garland? I also think the team has to plan the furure without Rivers and if he makes it back in any real way it will be a bonus. I agree that our deficiencies in the forward line are matched by our on ball deficiencies but I hope that Jones can make it.

Plan the future without Rivers? You've got to be kidding?

Why?

If he ever plays more than a dozen games in a year maybe then factor him in

Why?

If he ever plays more than a dozen games in a year maybe then factor him in

Because he is a required player Eastie. When out, Bailey can still tweak the structure as he see's fit. When fit and firing he reads the play better than most and is a very handy acquisition and can help Bailey re-structure. As dandeeman says it would be a bonus upon return. But you don't necessarily have to totally disregard Rivers and plan without him at present. With Rivers in you could try Garland up forward for example, just one of several options Bailey might have in store.

Hey Roost it!

i dont know how many games you watched this year mate but C Johnson is in our best 22 and by this time next year assuming he is injury free he will go close to winning the B & F

he has the best skills on our list and for a 6 week period (beofre getting injured) averaged 28 disposals!!

he will be a diamond in the rough next yr... guaranteed

It is not known whether Rivers will ever be fully fit..... You cannot create a side around a bloke who is our new 4-2-6

Hey Roost it!

i dont know how many games you watched this year mate but C Johnson is in our best 22 and by this time next year assuming he is injury free he will go close to winning the B & F

he has the best skills on our list and for a 6 week period (beofre getting injured) averaged 28 disposals!!

he will be a diamond in the rough next yr... guaranteed

I hope so.....

His old man is a top bloke and deserves to be proud of his son when he wears the Red 'n Blue..... This year he would've had some nice "fuzzy" moments....

Hopefully CJ can keep improving..... Would hate to see him traded to a WA side and shine in 2009-10 That would really pi$$ me off!!

(CJ) - he has the best skills on our list and for a 6 week period (beofre getting injured) averaged 28 disposals!!

he will be a diamond in the rough next yr... guaranteed

Best skills in general on the list? Better than Morton or McLean? I doubt it.

FB: James Frawley, Stefin Martin, Mathew Warnock

HF: Colin Garland, Jarad Rivers, Kyle Cheney/Tom McNamara

C: Aaron Davey, Cale Morton, Simon Buckley/Jack Grimes

HF: Austin Wonna, Jack Watts, Colin Sylvia

FF: Addam Marric, Brad Miller, Mathew Bate

Foll: Paul Johnson, Brock Mclean, Nathan Jones

Bench: Jack Spencer, Brent Moloney, Ricky Pettard, Chris Johnson

apologies/emergencies to newton, valenti, bell, meesen etc

im worried!!