I got so confused last night. At about 9pm I tuned into ABC for an update, and they were wrapping up from the stadium, and crossed to news, then some other program. So I thought the match had been finished. But then I find out they kept on going, and there was no commentary from the ABC (which I love listening to by the way).

Anyhoo, I'd say we're the definite losers out of that draw. Our lack of a frontline spinner = not good for Indian tours. White and Clarke didn't really bother any of the batsmen.

As for Kumble, I think he'll give it one more shot (if he can). He's a bit stubborn and probably wouldn't want to finish on a match like that.

Kumble Confident of Shoulder Recovery

This would suggest a different story...

Hodge apparently batted really well the other day for his 100. Took about 20 of the last 22 runs to just get there.

Apparently hit a six bigger than Blizzard's in the 20/20 final

Interesting re: Kumble. He bowled terrible in the test.

VICS off to a flyer and in form, 0/88 in their opening dig.

2/352, hodge on 100 , hodge should be in aus side more is a proven player at odi and test level

2/352, hodge on 100 , hodge should be in aus side more is a proven player at odi and test level

Nick Jewell 164. Not a bad start to the season indeed, by the Vics.

Clarke to Tendulkar, needing 3 to become the most prolific run scorer in the history of the game.

Has become an odd honour, but amazing and would be deserved nonetheless

Clarke to Tendulkar, needing 3 to become the most prolific run scorer in the history of the game.

Has become an odd honour, but amazing and would be deserved nonetheless

Yes great batsman, one of the best of all time, if not the best (next to the Don of course). Siddle just got him caught in slip off a great catch from Matthew Hayden for I think 88. Congrats to Tendulkar on his achievement. Congrats to Hayden on a fantastic catch, and congrats to Siddle on first Test wicket. That's a big scalp.

Bill Lawry would be over the moon as a Victorian. White gets his 1st test wicket in the 1st Test of Tendulkar, Siddle his 1st Test wicket in the 2nd Test - none other than Tendulkar. They're both Victorian to boot!!

Go Vics!

I was just reading Cricinfo, and I saw that Ganguly, who is 54 not out at the moment, was OUT (has been confirmed through replays) stumped when he was 35 off Cameron White, but the umpires didn't refer it to the 3rd umpire. How unfortunate for White, and, more importantly, for the Aussies.

I was just reading Cricinfo, and I saw that Ganguly, who is 54 not out at the moment, was OUT (has been confirmed through replays) stumped when he was 35 off Cameron White, but the umpires didn't refer it to the 3rd umpire. How unfortunate for White, and, more importantly, for the Aussies.

Huge mistake, isn't it?

India would have been 5/236 with 20 overs left in the day.

I was just reading Cricinfo, and I saw that Ganguly, who is 54 not out at the moment, was OUT (has been confirmed through replays) stumped when he was 35 off Cameron White, but the umpires didn't refer it to the 3rd umpire. How unfortunate for White, and, more importantly, for the Aussies.

and i thought they went to 3rd umpire for every run out

we are getting spanked

Huge mistake, isn't it?

India would have been 5/236 with 20 overs left in the day.

Would have completely changed the complexion of this game. Dhoni comes in at 5/236, he wouldn't feel like hitting the big shots, maybe we pick him up too, then all of a sudden that's about 160 runs off their current total. I guess Rudi would have seen his foot being behind the line, but still, he should have referred.

At 4/102, we don't even look likely of passing the follow-on target (though anythings possible with Hussey still there). If we have to follow-on, possibly by the end of today, we'll lose.

Wow. I haven't seen Australia get pummeled like this for many years. 6/150, still 319 runs behind. This innings has exposed our bowlers. India's have gotten something out of the pitch, when ours couldn't get anything.

Wow. I haven't seen Australia get pummeled like this for many years. 6/150, still 319 runs behind. This innings has exposed our bowlers. India's have gotten something out of the pitch, when ours couldn't get anything.

They have two spinners. We have none.

Its like swimming at the Olympics without goggles.

On a hiding to nothing.

Some of our batsman have not performed well at all. Lee is lacklustre.

I wish some of our batsmen would show the same application Lee does with his, but yes very uninspiring with the ball.

Just highlights the greatness of Warne and Mcgrath.

but still, he should have referred.

Absolutely. Ah well, that's cricket.

Here we go again. Sehwag seemingly edges behind, Haddin sure of it, Johnson too, yet Asad Rauf gives nothing. Radio, cricinfo and TV all suggest it was out. Now let begin the debate over TV referrals (which I believe will be present in the Australian home series).

Edit: Ha! And to add to our frustration, Siddle then gets Sehwag plumb in front, but it was a no ball.

The wheel has finally turned methinks.

Same old arrogant Aussie rubbish, trying to burst everything open losing 2.

Last over or two before tea for crying out loud, get to the break and then reassess. Two wickets in the last over. Could've been 0/50, now 2/50 off 8 overs

5/9 is woeful. Hayden's was a poor shot considering it was the last over before tea. Katich's, being the last ball before tea, was worse. Hussey's was incredibly poor, especially for someone like Hussey.

If Clarke and Haddin are still there at lunch, then maybe we're a chance (to draw).

time to pull our finger out, get rid of hayden bring in hodge, tell lee to start doing something and put symonds on the next plane here, we need help

"Hussey's was incredibly poor, especially for someone like Hussey"

Hussey did get a grubber, though.

OBSERVATION: The Aussies whilst struggling with the bat in this test - has a problem or two with the bowling. It's easy to say the two problems are no Warne and no McGrath. But the problem is there is no quality spinner to hold down one end. That and the fact the Aussies aren't working at the ball in the field between balls, the Indians are. There is no reverse swing or swing at all. The indians are just picking them off at will. Brett Lee is struggling.

First solution: - FFS Work on the ball alot more (one one side) - enable it for the quicks to get 'some' swing and uncertainty for the Indian batsman.

Second solution: - Get a quality spinner into the line-up, drop White.

Third: - Occupy the crease with the bat and FFS concentrate.

Fourth: - Don't bowl too short too often.

Fifth: - Siddle give that slower delivery the arse. They're just waiting for it.

OBSERVATION: The Aussies whilst struggling with the bat in this test - has a problem or two with the bowling. It's easy to say the two problems are no Warne and no McGrath. But the problem is there is no quality spinner to hold down one end. That and the fact the Aussies aren't working at the ball in the field between balls, the Indians are. There is no reverse swing or swing at all. The indians are just picking them off at will. Brett Lee is struggling.

He is and it is genuinely sad to see.....

I have a lot of time for Brett (I have known him a little for a while now) and it pains me to see him like this.

He is struggling terribly off the field, with a wayward wife (upset at the distance created form his job) and her current threat of her moving his child interstate to Queensland, and it is fairly obvious that this is affecting the way he is playing and his temperament. I have never seen him blow up like that in years of watching.

But to solely blame him for the troubles that we now find ourselves in is insane and a little moronic. On the sub-continent spin has always been king, and we have nothing of note at this point in time. That will change eventually, and it bares remembering that India tore Shane Warne apart in his opening games for Australia.

And to me White is unfortunately not the answer to our spin problems and actually has worse figures than Lee (I think).

But listening to Mark Waugh last night on Fox Sports he was absolutely scathing of our batting line up, not so much in the second innings (he praised Michael Clarke) say that the guys that fell yesterday should be not be held responsible for delaying the outcome which was inevitable, but in the first innings in which he said he saw as the end of the game and he was appalled that only 200'ish was scored on a relatively passive batting wicket.

A lot of work needs to be done on improving individual skills, decision making (sounding familiar in here) and off field support.

We'll just have to wait and see if the mental strength this team has shown in the past can come through.

Just my opinion !!!

OBSERVATION: The Aussies whilst struggling with the bat in this test - has a problem or two with the bowling. It's easy to say the two problems are no Warne and no McGrath. But the problem is there is no quality spinner to hold down one end. That and the fact the Aussies aren't working at the ball in the field between balls, the Indians are. There is no reverse swing or swing at all. The indians are just picking them off at will. Brett Lee is struggling.

First solution: - FFS Work on the ball alot more (one one side) - enable it for the quicks to get 'some' swing and uncertainty for the Indian batsman.

Second solution: - Get a quality spinner into the line-up, drop White.

Third: - Occupy the crease with the bat and FFS concentrate.

Fourth: - Don't bowl too short too often.

Fifth: - Siddle give that slower delivery the arse. They're just waiting for it.

You make good observations HT. However, I challenge you to name a 'quality' spinner in Australia. We don't have one. We have players like Casson, Krejza, Cullen etc. who are just average to good first class players, but who, IMO, wouldn't get close to cutting it at Test level. It is a problem that I think we will have to deal with for some time until a youngster whom we've never heard of becomes our next spinner.

In terms of pace bowling, I think I've read that we're struggling to swing the SG balls used in India (as opposed to Kookaburra here). FFS, we have Troy Cooley employed as a 'bowling coach': how didn't we prepare for bowling in Indian conditions? We absolutely have to study what the Indians do to and with the ball so that we can apply the same techniques. They're getting it to reverse within 15 overs, which is killing us.

And as for the batting: we miss Symonds, Gilchrist and Warne at 6, 7 and 8. Now we have Watson (who's had 1 good innings), Haddin (same as Watson) and White (can't bat at test level). They're just not good enough, especially when India have Ganguly, Dhoni and Harbhajan at those positions. With a better middle-lower order, the top order wouldn't feel as pressured.

He is and it is genuinely sad to see.....

I have a lot of time for Brett (I have known him a little for a while now) and it pains me to see him like this.

He is struggling terribly off the field, with a wayward wife (upset at the distance created form his job) and her current threat of her moving his child interstate to Queensland, and it is fairly obvious that this is affecting the way he is playing and his temperament. I have never seen him blow up like that in years of watching.

But to solely blame him for the troubles that we now find ourselves in is insane and a little moronic. On the sub-continent spin has always been king, and we have nothing of note at this point in time. That will change eventually, and it bares remembering that India tore Shane Warne apart in his opening games for Australia.

And to me White is unfortunately not the answer to our spin problems and actually has worse figures than Lee (I think).

But listening to Mark Waugh last night on Fox Sports he was absolutely scathing of our batting line up, not so much in the second innings (he praised Michael Clarke) say that the guys that fell yesterday should be not be held responsible for delaying the outcome which was inevitable, but in the first innings in which he said he saw as the end of the game and he was appalled that only 200'ish was scored on a relatively passive batting wicket.

A lot of work needs to be done on improving individual skills, decision making (sounding familiar in here) and off field support.

We'll just have to wait and see if the mental strength this team has shown in the past can come through.

Just my opinion !!!

Its a good opinion QueenC . Mark Waugh did have a good point with regard to the 1st innings, it was poor on that wicket for the first day's play. The key is, and the Indians are aware of this, for Zaheer Khan said it prior to the commencement of the second test, that he believed the Aussies don't have the artillery to take 20 test wickets against India. Also, that India are confident against the current Australian attack. 20 Test wickets is required to win - that along with reasonably good batting.

The hot air exchanged between Lee and Ponting is not good whichever way you look at it, regardless of how things are off-field for Lee. Having said that, I do feel for him. Might I add, I'm not in any way "solely blaming" Lee for the troubles that the Aussies now find themselves in. To do so would be insane and a little moronic, that is correct. All I stated was that he is "struggling", of which you agreed in your opening reply. It was always going to come with the retirement of legends of the game in McGrath and Warne. Arguably the best in their respective trades.

You make good observations HT. However, I challenge you to name a 'quality' spinner in Australia. We don't have one. We have players like Casson, Krejza, Cullen etc. who are just average to good first class players, but who, IMO, wouldn't get close to cutting it at Test level. It is a problem that I think we will have to deal with for some time until a youngster whom we've never heard of becomes our next spinner.

In terms of pace bowling, I think I've read that we're struggling to swing the SG balls used in India (as opposed to Kookaburra here). FFS, we have Troy Cooley employed as a 'bowling coach': how didn't we prepare for bowling in Indian conditions? We absolutely have to study what the Indians do to and with the ball so that we can apply the same techniques. They're getting it to reverse within 15 overs, which is killing us.

And as for the batting: we miss Symonds, Gilchrist and Warne at 6, 7 and 8. Now we have Watson (who's had 1 good innings), Haddin (same as Watson) and White (can't bat at test level). They're just not good enough, especially when India have Ganguly, Dhoni and Harbhajan at those positions. With a better middle-lower order, the top order wouldn't feel as pressured.

Yes, good points once more, titan. With respect to a 'quality spinner', I would put to you Bryce McGain. He would of played had he not injured himself. He is quality, but his longevity in the game is minimal. Your question in relation to "youth and longevity" in the quality spinning department....well the cupboard is bare - you're quite right.

It's rather an interesting problem we have considering Warne made so many people and kids so interested in the game of cricket. I would of thought new talent would of been coming through. The man was a freak with the ball. I wonder if we will ever see another quite like him. Our generation might of been blessed to watch such a cricketer apply his trade. Much like the generation that saw Bradman play.

Sorry HT, I do tend to get a little defensive when it comes to Brett as I sincerely like the guy......

You are right what happened on the field was not a great sight for the team, but the blame goes both ways as I don't think Ponting's communication skills are as good as they can be, especially when dealing with something like this. And frankly no matter how poor Lees figures were (and they are bad, no argument) bowling Hussey before him when the runs are flowing pretty easily already (without Lee factoring into the run rate) seems insane.

As for a "quality spinner" well as I said those aren't just going to drop from the sky (unfortunately), and maybe we need to realise that we are not going to get another Warne, he was a once in a generation type bowler, and the way I see it now we must simply work with what we have, and stop saying so-and-so is never going to be another Warne - no-one is, in fact we may never see another one in the next twenty years, if ever.

What we do have a bunch of younger prospects that have to be looked at and worked on. I didn't think Cassen was to bad in the West Indies earlier in the year, despite their pitches doing bugger all for spinners, and I was genuinely surprised that he was left out in favour of Krezja. McGain deserved the nod given his figures, but injury (and his age to a point) may have robbed him of his opportunity. I have never seen White as the answer, which is pretty unfortunate since he could have been a genuine all-rounder if his bowling was more of a threat than it is.

I think the reality is we are all going to have to come to terms with the rough ride we have in front of us, as the national team goes through a massive re-shape and rebuilds itself. You don't lose what we have lost and will continue to lose in the next year or so and simply bounce. It was a tough match in Mohali and one that plenty can be learned from and improved on and hopefully we will see that improvement in the next test.

But I wouldn't be making knee jerk changes to the team, they just need to do everything better!!!

You are right what happened on the field was not a great sight for the team, but the blame goes both ways as I don't think Ponting's communication skills are as good as they can be, especially when dealing with something like this. And frankly no matter how poor Lees figures were (and they are bad, no argument) bowling Hussey before him when the runs are flowing pretty easily already (without Lee factoring into the run rate) seems insane.

I have to agree about Ponting. I don't think he is a great communicator, mainly because he hasn't had to communicate negative things in his tenure as skipper. I think he is a bit arrogant and stubborn at times, which impacts on his ability to both bat and captain.

I have never seen White as the answer, which is pretty unfortunate since he could have been a genuine all-rounder if his bowling was more of a threat than it is.

Which is quite sad because White's bowling was better than his batting in Mohali. I'd be happier with White if he could score some damn runs.