Macca

Yep 'dof' , you'd reckon all the listed players from 2012 would know exactly where they stand now . Witnessing 15 of their teammates being 'moved' off the list has got to be a eye-opener for many of them . The new arrivals to a large extent won't know any different so the adjustment for them shouldn't be a factor . Has there ever been a club go from one coach to another where the coaches in question are such polar opposites ? It's any wonder so many didn't cut the mustard . Paul Roos said it best when he talked about the first 3 to 4 years of a draftee being the most important years . He talked about how any coach can have a huge effect on a draftees development and how after that initial period of years it's difficult to change a player . We witnessed a bit of that this year in my opinion . If all our players are prepared to work as a team and be selfless and have strong disciplines then we'll improve out of sight (of course nowadays it's called a 'buy in' or being on 'the same page' )

More a 'what' than a 'who' Would like to see the whole team display a 'Never say die' attitude in every game . A 'Never give in' stance doesn't take skill or any god given talent . It's a mindset which all our players can display . The players have got to want to be successful and a hatred of losing should be shared right across the board . If we do that, there will be plenty of excitement .

A bit from Jack Dee

OneHD are only showing 2 games (live) in week 15 due to their coverage of the swimming and golf . For those with cable, there are some excellent match-ups ...as DemonDave made mention, there's some great games on offer this week . Season definers abound!! FRI, DEC 14 12.20 PM Cincinnati at Philadelphia ESPN MON, DEC 17 5.00 AM Green Bay at Chicago Fox3 8.05 AM Detroit at Arizona OneHD 8.25 AM Pittsburgh at Dallas Fox3 12.20 PM San Francisco at New England ESPN & OneHD TUE, DEC 18 12.30 PM NY Jets at Tennessee ESPN For all other games you can go to this site

Seems the MVP debate is on in earnest at the moment . It might be out of Peyton and Peterson . Brady would have to be a big chance after today . He really is silk . Had a listen to a bit New England radio today and the consensus there is that Tom doesn't get enough of the individual plaudits . Of course they're a bit biased, but some good points were made . One point being that Belichick takes away some of the limelight and vice-versa . Think Peyton has won 4 MVP's whilst Brady has won twice . The Adrian Peterson story is hard to top though . He could break the all time record for the most yards in a season . This, after coming back from a torn ACL . Eric Dickerson holds the record with 2,105 . AP currently has 1600 with 3 games to go . Here are the passing stats and the RB and WR stats can be found here and here .

Another classic from Dave Brubeck ... his music will always live on .

Quite a number on this thread had wins in week 14 - Giants, Jets, Rams, Eagles, Broncos, Vikings, Redskins, 49ers, Seahawks and my Packers (after a very slow start) all got up . KC let 'pantaloons' down but all up, that's not a bad return for us success starved Demons . Fairly sure we've got a Texans fan here as well . Looking forward to tomorrow's game - both teams have a lot to play for ... Anyway, here is the playoff picture after today .

Count me in .

Yep , that NFC wild-card race is on for young and old . Big win for the Vikings 'cfh' - I was barracking for your blokes (this week anyway!!) Tampa losing will hurt them and you could nearly rule them out now . The Bears might be in trouble if Cutler misses a game or 2 (they reckon he'll play next week vs the Packers but it is a neck injury .... ) How bad are Arizona ? Seattle are a sneaky chance to win the NFC West but they'd need a couple of things to happen . That game vs San Francisco could decide things . The Rams aren't going away either . Let's hope that RG3 comes up ok for next week - it's been such a great story so far . Dallas kept their hopes alive with a come from behind win and the Giants had a reasonably comfortable victory . The Eagles finally get a 'W' and with it , virtually ending the Bucs season . Pittsburgh lose again and they're a serious chance of missing the playoffs . They visit Dallas next week then face a possible season definer at home vs the Bengals . The Colts just keep marching along - Luck is very good in the 'Big' moments . So many teams are a chance this year and tomorrow's game between Houston and New England should be a beauty . Denver will be interested onlookers . In other stunning news - the Jets are a game back from a playoff spot - whooda thunk-it !! (though I think the Steelers win the tie-break over them) . The Jets last 3 games are - @ Tennessee , vs San Diego and @ Buffalo .

One of Robbie's trademark 'plays' was to go up at the back of a pack , get his fist to the ball and in the next instance be running on to grab the ball, dodge and weave, take a bounce or 2 and kick a goal . He did this countless times and it was always mesmerising and thrilling to watch . He was a star

Some junk mail pamphlets ?

Yeah, not sure what to make of those James Frawley 'protein balls' either ! Ridiculous concoction if you ask me ... who could possibly eat the ghastly items ?! If he wants to rediscover his dash out of defence he should steer clear of those monstrosities .

Just had another look at 'The Pelican Brief' again after all these years . Might have a re-look at some of the other films based on John Grisham's novels . Here's the IMDb links for some of the better adaptations ... The Firm , The Pelican Brief , The Client , The Rainmaker and Runaway Jury .

I like my magazine and if they stop producing it I will 'microwave' my membership Next thing we won't get an actual membership card - they'll scan one of our eyes so we can get in ...that will cut costs ! Magazines just aren't the same online . There's no sense of ownership . You've gotta have quality magazines on the coffee table for guests to peruse - GQ, Vanity Fair, Esquire, Heartbeat ...

Well you're right, Manning won't be around forever but the mentality is a little different over there . It's often about the 'Right now' and I tend to agree with this type of thinking (sometimes) . Teams that are continually building for the future often end up perpetually building . The reality is that the Broncos are a legitimate contender now and good on 'em . Elway knows what he wants and he's not mucking around . If you can somehow snag that 2 seed and play your 1st playoff game in the 2nd week then you're a real show . Houston will probably get the 1 seed but they're not guaranteed a win straight off in the playoffs . Especially if they have to play New England . Huge home field advantage at Denver (as you well know) . Good solid win yesterday btw - that's 8 in a row .

The Manchester Derby (just after Sunday midnight) is the obvious game of the round in Matchweek 16 . Everton at home against Spurs will hold a lot of interest as well as the mighty Hammers vs Liverpool . All 3 games are on late Sunday / early Monday morning . Arsenal vs West Brom on Sunday morning (2am) is another good match-up . Here's the current Table and for a short video 'Predictor' of the Manchester Derby you can visit this link (the video may take about 20-30 seconds to load)

You've gotta be happy with Peyton, Cards . 2 seed is up for grabs ...

Yeah , should be a ripper games for your blokes against the Ravens . It's good that it's on 'free to air' for those who haven't got foxtel . I'll definitely be tuning in . Baltimore have won 5 games by 3 points or less this season so it could be another close one . Thought I'd bump up the games as they're on the previous page ... FRI, DEC 07 12.20 PM Denver(9-3) at Oakland (3-9) OneHD & ESPN MON, DEC 10 5.00 AM Baltimore (9-3) at Washington (6-6) OneHD 5.00 AM Dallas (6-6) at Cincinnati (7-5) Fox3 8.25 AM New Orleans (5-7) at NY Giants (7-5) OneHD 8.25 AM Arizona (4-8) at Seattle (7-5) Fox3 12.20 PM Detroit (4-8) at Green Bay (8-4) OneHD & ESPN TUE, DEC 11 12.30 PM Houston (11-1) at New England (9-3) ESPN * For all other games you can visit this link

Good set of match-ups for week 14 on the box . Not too many teams represented from this thread but some good games nonetheless ... FRI, DEC 07 12.20 PM Denver(9-3) at Oakland (3-9) OneHD & ESPN MON, DEC 10 5.00 AM Baltimore (9-3) at Washington (6-6) OneHD 5.00 AM Dallas (6-6) at Cincinnati (7-5) Fox3 8.25 AM New Orleans (5-7) at NY Giants (7-5) OneHD 8.25 AM Arizona (4-8) at Seattle (7-5) Fox3 12.20 PM Detroit (4-8) at Green Bay (8-4) OneHD & ESPN TUE, DEC 11 12.30 PM Houston (11-1) at New England (9-3) ESPN For all other games you can visit this link

Yep , you are right 'OD', they can come out with the 'Bringing the game into disrepute' angle but it's my view that there will need to be an 'Explanation' to go with it . That's where it would get very murky . Even if they don't have an explanation the media and the general public will ask why . It stands to reason . Example - 'The AFL' - "We hereby charge the MFC with bringing the game into disrepute and they will therefore lose 'such and such' draft picks in 'such and such' drafts . 'Media and the general public' - "How did they bring the game into disrepute, AFL ?" 'AFL' - "They played certain players in different positions , dropped veterans for young players , put certain players in for early operations etc etc." 'Media and the general public' - "Ok , so we take it that clubs are not allowed to do this in the future?" 'AFL' - "Er ..... can we start again?"

Ok, so far as I can see, we can't get done for match fixing . There aren't any bookmakers involved . There are no large amounts of money involved . There hasn't been any 'plunges' and certainly no unusual betting has occurred . There is nothing that we've done that could be constituted as match fixing . I'm talking specifically about 2009 which is where the investigation seems to be mainly focused . So .... we could only be sanctioned or incur penalties for 'Things' other than match fixing . Things like - playing certain players in different positions , giving young players more game time , putting players in for early operations so as to ensure those players can do a full pre-season , etc etc . These sort of things have been going on in all sports for a long long time . Experimentation like this is practiced by teams in contention as well . Not just in footy, in all sorts of sports . In our sport many young players have debuted in finals over the years (often replacing a veteran) . Apart from all this, there are no set rules on how much a team can experiment (in the sort of areas I've mentioned above) . If they find us guilty and we incur sanctions they are going to have to explain why we've incurred sanctions . They can't just come out with the old 'Bringing the game into disrepute' angle without a foolproof explanation . There will need to be details given and this is why I reckon the investigation has (virtually) stalled .

I'm confident that we'll escape any sort of penalty or sanctions . If that happens it then begs the question - "How and why did it take well over 4 months to come to this conclusion?" (McLean was on 'OTC' in late July IIRC) . We can only be found guilty of preparing for the next season (or seasons) . And that is not match fixing . If we do receive penalties it has to be for match fixing . What, are they going to take a draft pick off us because Paul Johnson played on Nathan Brown ? It can't stick , it just can't . I reckon what's happened is that the investigators could have closed the 'Case' a number of times but then another little 'titbit' would surface - they'd spend another week or 3 'Investigating' that until another little 'titbit' would surface . And so on and so forth . They've got nothing of any substance and their attitude might be to keep looking until they find something . Maybe the investigators haven't realised that if the smoking gun was there, they should have uncovered it by now . Maybe it's just plain stubbornness on their part . Trying (in vain) to justify their own involvement in this farce . Edit : The other thing to remember is that if we receive sanctions for reasons other than match fixing, then that will impact on what is 'Allowable' for clubs in the future (on match days) . I reckon that is where they've reached an impasse . Many of us have been focusing on what 'Other' clubs have done in the past, but it's what clubs can do in the future that's at stake here . The AFL will end up making a rod for it's own back if they're not careful . It's match fixing or nothing .

Here's one from 'Hall and Oates . This song was written about the then impending comeback of the 'Four Seasons' and in particular, Frankie Valli ... Macca's 70's 11.6

Nothing like some good old fashioned divisional rivalry hey ! All good . I can only imagine what's it's like in the States . A few of you have experienced it first hand yeah ? I've read a bit about the rivalry's but the Ravens/Steelers has to be the 'Biggie' at the moment . Packers/Bears is fierce as well . Anyway, if the Rams 'Win out' they might sneak in - ya just never know . It's not very likely but it is possible . A whole lot of other things would have to happen but I've seen loads of strange occurrences in this League over the journey . It is a huge ask (given their remaining schedule) but if the Rams can get past the Bills this week and the 'Unthinkable' happens and Arizona beat Seattle then that 6th seed is up for grabs . Arizona might need to find an 'Offence' in a hurry though ! The Packers and the Bears need to keep winning to ensure qualification and San Francisco have also got a couple of tough games to come . This QB 'switcheroo' might have it's drawbacks ! It's nowhere near done yet . The only real safe bet is Atlanta getting the no.1 seed - they're 2 and a half wins clear in the conference with 4 games to play . I can't see them slipping up . The AFC is a lot clearer, of course . Once again , here is the playoff picture . Edit : I discovered the 'Playoff Machine' on the ESPN website . It's like the AFL ladder predictor . Each time I've gone through the remaining games the Bears have ended up missing the playoffs altogether .

Ha ha ! I had a look at 'Packer Chatters' a ways back . It's really funny/strange - the same sort of threads such as 'The Good the Bad and the Ugly' , 'End of Season Changes' and the always ever present 'OK, so now what?' are there . I even had a fleeting thought of joining up . May do one day . It's uncanny how similar the threads are though . Reckon some of the under performing teams fan sites would be 'Interesting' reading . San Diego and Philadelphia for instance . Dallas would be another . Edit : Here come the Redskins ... good tough win at home and that division is right up for grabs now . RG3 is managing games very very well considering he's a rookie . On top of that, Washington lead the League in rushing yards with RB, Alfred Morris having a great rookie season as well . So many teams in the mix in the NFC . This next month is usually a great one for big clashes . A sneak peak to next week's games sees Dallas @ Cinci, the Bears @ Minnesota, the Ravens @ Washington and Houston @ New England . Here is the schedule for week 14