Jaded No More

Agreed. Best football moment of 2006. I could watch the bit where he intercepted the kick, then received the ball back, 100 times. Confirmed his potential 'star status' as you say. Also, Neita's big milestones, the thrashing of Collingwood, and Bate's first goal. Lowest moment of 2006, was our second loss to Carlton, confirming we haven't really changed at all. Disgraceful! :angry:

Anyone who has lost someone they loved, would know that the pain never truely goes away. I just hope that Trisha and Troy's family take comfort in the fact that he died a happy man, and that his memory will always live on with those who were lucky enough to know him. RIP Troy.

That's the spirit!

Merry Christmas to everyone and an early Happy New Year! Enjoy the festive season, your presents, the cricket scores and the sales on Tuesday (I know I won't! ).

Man, you've really depressed me! Think I can take a sick day from work, on grounds of such horrible depression? As I said, everybody has strenghts and everybody has weaknesses. We need absolutely everything to go right for us to win the damn thing, and just because we're never the lucky ones, doesn't mean things aren't about to change.... I have hope... but I vote 'no' because I refuse to be disappointed again

It has to be Judd. I'm pretty sure that he is a robot planted on this earth to bring peace and good football skills to all. If anyone could pick up 30 possessions while simultaneously saving the world from Terrorism, it has to be him

That is an extremely negative point of view. Of the clubs you listed as 'thereabouts': - Sydney's backline is suspect, and some of their best players aren't getting any younger. They'll also need Spider to return to his best, because Jolly as a #1 ruckman is not the way to go - Adelaide have been very disappointing come finals in the past two years. They rely on some old bodies, and their forward line is a joke. They also have no ruck division in 2007 with Clarke gone and Biglands injured. - The Dogs are great to watch, but pace does not win you finals. They need to find another tall forward, perhaps Darcy but who knows what he'd be like after 2 years out injured. Their backline is very suspect. - The Saints IMHO are overrated. Their backline is a huge problem, as is their ruck division. They recruited Gardiner FFS, he isn't exactly the reliable type. They have some very classy onballers and a good forward line (light on crumbers, unless you're a Milne fan ). Their biggest problem though, is their loser mentality. They've been losers for so long, it'll take something pretty big to change that. - Freo are similar to us, they have problems with high expectations. They are mentally suspect, but they do have a very very good group of young players, headed by one of the best in Pavlich. They're a chance, but their coach is an idiot. - And finally, WC. They will be flag favourites in April, no doubt about it. They have the best midfield by a country mile, and their backline is ok. I'm still not convinced their forwards are much good, but then again they managed to outplay Sydney's backline (see first point regarding Sydney). See how easy it is to find faults? When it's your own club, it's the easiest because you're so close to the action and you know the list well. But no club is perfect, and apart from WC who have a powerhouse midfield, every list has their strengths. Having said all that, I still voted 'no' on the last question

It was a finals- like atmosphere, just pity about the crap-like opposition. We didn't lose the Freo game because Bate and Jones etc... didn't have great games (Yze, Robbo & Davey were poor too). We lost because we ran out of legs, we had two giants wasting on the bench, and we could not compete with the run of Freo on the huge Subiaco ground.

Unfair to put Robbo in the "non-finals performers", he has always been a good contributor aside from this year where he was carrying several injuries and clearly struggling. Still, I agree with your point. BBP, you say the kids won't win us a flag... who will then? It's quite obvious that the old brigade alone won't either, since we haven't won a flag in over 40 years. We can keep playing the same side every week until they retire, and I bet you we won't get near a premiership. It's time to open our eyes to the faults in the side and try to fix them with what we have. Sure, it would be nice to leave Yze out of the side because we just have to fit Judd in somewhere, but that's not realistic. If Yze gets a game in Round 1, it will be purely on reputation. I don't know about you, but I rather he is made to work for a position just like everybody else. Davey is still young, so he gets the benefit of the doubt when it comes to finals. Yze however, just does not have that luxury anymore. I am sick of him always kicking junk-time goals, or capitalising on the good work of others. It's because he is so talented, that I feel like he's cheating the side when he is being lazy. He may have more skills than some youngster, but he doesn't work nearly as hard.

That's the best mark I've seen Robbo take. The leap was huge! I remember sitting at a freezing Telstra Dome (It was Colonial back then, but still a rubbish place to watch the footy ), watching us pretty much do a number on Freo, and Robbo took the mark, knocked the guy out, and Dale Kickett (I think?) never played again. There was also a back slap from the umpire I believe, who at the time thought it was pretty spectacular.

That's a fairly small backline. Even if CJ does come along nicely in 07, I don't see him as a true defender. He's more of a HBF. He'll be far more useful creating run behind the ball, than shutting down a key opponent. Hopefully Frawley cements his place as a third tall by the end of the year. As it stands, I'd go Warnock over CJ and you can probably replace Bartram with CJ until he is fit. Then, I'm affraid someone will miss out. The rest is pretty good, although I'm fairly certain Daniher will play Miller. Just where he plays him, I don't know. Dunn has to get meaner and tougher if he wants that CHF spot.

How many of those games were spend in the backline? How much do you know about his restricted pre-season and OP? You want to talk about mistakes that are symptomatic of a player, how about Sylvia taking a speccy (that never was) and nearly killing Ferguson earlier in the year? I think we should hold onto that moment of stupidity and forever condemn him for it. He had a horrible season, I'm sure he'll tell you that himself, but every single player goes through that. Given his injuries and off-field issues, he can be forgiven. I'd like to see his stats after a full season where he is fully fit and playing where he is best suited, up forward. Dunn is an entirely different player, and odds are he'll be an entirely better one too. That's good, since they both play for our team.

That's really disappointing, but thank you for informing us. He is a really important part of the team, and we could have used his services to tag one of the Saints' midfielders. Amazing to think that a year ago he was some skinny kid nobody expected to see for a couple of seasons, and now he is so highly regarded. Furthermore, him, Jones, Sylvia Bate and Bell should all now be firmly in our best 22 and selected every week given they are fit to play. They may struggle occasionally, but it'll pay off (maybe as soon as September 2007). We really can't afford to keep holding on to players who are past it. IMO, there are only a handful of positions that will be decided during pre-season and the NAB cup. They are: - CHF/ 3rd tall (will it be Miller at CHF, will Dunn be used as a third tall, or are we going to use one of PJ/Jamar when they aren't rucking?) - Ruck (PJ or Jamar to support White, or both? Plus how much ruck time for each) - Third tall (Holland, Frawley or Warnock? Or perhaps a weekly proposition depending on who we play) - HBF (Bell, Ward, CJ, or perhaps a surprise like Petterd/ Frawley) The rest of the positions are set; including FB (Carroll), CHB (Rivers), FF (Neitz) & Rovers (McLean, Junior, Moloney, Bartram, Bate, Sylvia etc...).

Exactly right! CJ will hopefully replace Ward, with Bell on the other flank, or in the midfield (yes, I'm still flogging the "Bell to the Middle" line ). Ward is in his last year(s), if he plays 22 games, we're in trouble. Same goes for Yze. He should only play if he proves that he's changed. There are a long list of kids who deserve a game based on their efforts, and not like Yze, based on reputation. Our best 22 will change 100 times before the season starts, and throughout it. Some will surprise, some will disappoint, that's the beauty of footy. But as long as we can keep our spine healthy, we should be ok.

"I'm never going to leave Melbourne. When the time comes at the end of the year I'll sit down with the club. But footy comes first at the moment." God bless your red and blue socks. What a champ!

Welcome to Demonland flashdance36, and thank you very much for the training report. Great job!

Coach and captain are two different things. A captain needs to be comfortable with his players as much as the players need to be comfortable with him. You don't need to be friendly with your coach. In fact, it's probably better if you aren't. Of course Judd is a great player, but being a great player is not an indication that you'd make a great captain. He is clearly not the captain at WC behind closed doors.In fact, he is probably only the captain in media confrences. I agree with Hannabal (who knew the day would come ), he'd refuse the offer.

You think Melbourne players are going to take kindly to being captained by a guy they don't know? IMO, Judd is clearly not happy being captain of WC. Who says that he'll enjoy the added pressure of captaining a side he doesn't know? I don't think he'd walk into our club and be made captain. It wouldn't go down well. He needs time to get to know his teammates, and the way things are done at the club. He isn't God, he is a footballer. To turn him into some sort of super-human and demand too much of him, could have a negative affect both on him and the club. And what's wrong with Brock being Captain and Judd being VC? Is Neitz our best player? No. Was Cousins a better player than Judd? Being captain is more than being a good player. Besides, even with Judd in our side, Brock will still be firmly in our top 5.

Hey, I resent that! Two questions for you; 1- Should Judd decide to return to Victoria, what do you believe will land us the deal? (I'm talking specific players and picks) 2- Assuming we land Judd, would you make him captain the moment he walks through the door?

You make some good points, and again, I highlighted that Bruce is a very good player, but he isn't really a team player. He had an ok season in 2006, but certainly in the second half of the year his kicking was absolutely shocking, and when he wasn't assigned to a specific job (i.e.- Tarrant), he was ordinary. He also isn't the sort of player to impose himself physically on a game. I don't see him standing up to an opposition player if they snipe one of our younger players. Besides, he is one of the main offenders when it comes to disappearing when it counts. I don't remember him ever lifting us to victory. Certainly he has more influence on a game than Green or Junior do, and you could argue that given our current captain is a FF, he would have more influence than Neitz too, but you can't really compare the leadership qualities of McLean versus the leadership qualities of Bruce. One is a born leader, the other is a taught leader. I'd like for him to be more physical and more aggressive in his approach to the game. If he can do what Brad Green did in 2006, then he could possibly be considered for the job after Neitz, because he is one of our best players. But if we were to hand him the captaincy right now, I'd have my doubts. Edit: If McLean didn't miss so many games through injury in 2006, he would have easily finished top 3 in the B&F.

I agree. If he backs it up in 07, he's got the job in 08. What's the point of having 'in-between' captains, when eventually he'll get the job? It's a waste of everybody's time. Also, it's very hard to tag someone who knows how to get the pill better than you. It is far harder to tag inside midfielders, than outside. I trust he'll cope a lot better than TJ did.

I would like Neitz to stay for one more year, however if he chose to hand over the captaincy as early as next year, there are only two choices for captain IMO; Brock or Green. Firstly, Junior, while he deserves to be made a leader, is not captain material. He isn't a damaging enough player, he has been in the leadership group for 5 minutes, and he is not in the prime of his career. He had a brilliant season in 06, but in 05 he was poor and many here suggested he was finished. I'd like to see whether he can go again next year. Brucey for me is not captain material either. He didn't excel when he captained, he isn't really a team player, and to be honest, his 06 season left much to be desired given his talent. Of course this is not a reflection of him as a player. He is a very good versatile player, but he is not captain material. So that leaves 2 choices. Here are the pros and cons of either: Brad Green Pros: - Has become a valuable team player in 06, and really went when it was his turn. - Excelled as captain when given the opportunity - Can play a number of roles, hence versatile Cons: - Has only spent a year in the leadership group - Does not influence games in the way Neitz can, and is not a match winner. Brock McLean Pros: - Very very good player, who has a profound influence when he plays. - Was outstanding in the final, and brought us back from the brink of defeat - We all see his leadership qualities and agree that eventually he'll be captain Cons: - He's 20, and that is a very young age for someone to be leading a football team. Can he handle it? I have no doubt, can others follow the lead of a 20 year old? Maybe not - We still don't know what he'll be like in an official leadership role - Can he get his body 100% right going forward, and can we afford a captain who can't run out games due to injuries? There isn't an easy replacement for Neitz. McLean would be a huge risk for next year, but so would anyone else given there isn't an obvious choice. Perhaps the solution, should Neita decide to step down, is to rotate the captaincy for a year, Sydney style, and see what happens. Everyone can take a turn in leading, and Neita can guide them. Whoever is the most successful leader, then gets the gig from 2008 onwards.

Agreed. Plus, he brings some more extra pace.

I tend to agree. It will take him some time to get back to full fitness, and settle back into the side. He has had a very long layoff. However, a reduced program in the first half of the season, should hopefully see him at peak fitness come finals. This may well work in our advantage.

My question is, can he read the play? That is the number one requirement for a good defender. If he can't read the way the ball is coming in, or the way his opponent is leading to it, then it's a lost cause. We really haven't seen enough of him to make a judgement though.