binman

Ummn, by the logic of the post that was quoted no victory through year is worth dlddliesquat. Hard to acrue sufficient points to make the finals without the occasional win

My favourite player.

Probably strike twice

Not reliant on bont and mcrae? You're kidding aren't you?

His mentor must be Gary Lyon.

See, there's the problem. Peeps should have been buying their healing crystals months ago. So much complacency.

Exactly. No changes to our basic game plan or structure. Perhaps just a couple of tactical tweaks against whoever we play in finals. For example if we play Cats week one, instead of sending may to Hawkins, put Petty on him and get him to play like Taylor did last week - ie sit off him and don't engage in a wrestling match, zone off, run of him when possible etc. Or against the dogs tag Mcrae rather than Libba. And i suspect they will introduce the occasional subtle tactical tweak and set plays in terms of our ball movement. I think we saw a couple of those last week. For example May went down the middle a couple of times from the kick out - on one occasion hitting Spargo, who was all by himself, perhaps because the Suns, for good reason, were all covering the left wing. And i wonder if there is some set plays they are introducing, like the 45 degree kick from Viney the week before last to the a player in the corridor 20 metres out from goal. They all might well have been working on different tricks to win some more clean clearance all year in training and unveil a couple coming into the finals, or in the finals.

ATAGI played no role in creating fear. ATAGI did not vacillate. They adjusted their advice based on evidence as it came to hand. And from the beginning made it clear their position was informed by the risk environment vis a vis the number of people infected by covid. The scapegoating of ATAGI has been shameful.

Ok. Still confused. So, do you think ATAGI has been one of those culprits demonising AZ?

Sorry Lh, I'm not sure what your point is. Are you arguing ATAGI did install completely unnecessary fear in the community by demonising AstraZeneca? If so, let's agree to disagree and move on.

I agree with this. Our poor kicking skills will be exacerbated by the rain, just as they were in the wet against the dogs. For this reason, it was a good move to bring Melksham in. And Bowey helps the kicking cause too. Conversely their better kicking skills will come to the fore. Helps that Ryan is out though as he is one of the bets kicks in the AFL. However they rely heavily on a chip and mark tempo model, which is much harder to implement in the wet as it is harder to mark the ball - and harder still if we are constantly up in their grill with intensity and pressure. And they way they score is built around their three talls inside 50 taking contested marks or marks on the lead. Even in the dry they would struggle to take marks inside 50 with our defensive system. In wet it will be all but impossible. And even with Ryan and Shuey (who also out) in the team they are not brilliant at winning ground balls inside 50. But as you say its all about the pressure we apply.

This is a narrative everyone should push back on. ATAGI was created by the federal government to provide health advice to government. Of course their advice is purely from a health perspective. That is their area of expertise and their terms of refence set by the government. The government choose to accept the ATAGI advice. Or not. In making that decision they should consider a range of factors (and get expert advice as required) - human behavior, economic implications, impact on their plan for the vaccine roll, sociological behavior, messaging etc etc It is not ATAGI who have installed completely unnecessary fear in the community by demonising AstraZeneca. The members of ATAGI must be livid that they have been thrown under the bus. The real question who is pushing this false narrative and who benefits from the scapegoating of ATAGI?

I read that as the Lambada version. That does sound fun actually. Though given the Lamada is a two person dance (originating in Brazil) it would be hard to maintain appropriate social distance. Perhaps that makes it super transmissible. And epsilon just sounds cool.

Those losses to teams outside the 8 are really starting to haunt us.

Sorry, LF that simply is not true. Hindsight was not required, nor was a crystal ball Anyone with access to the internet knew what was coming well ahead of May. April/May was the PEAK of Delta in India. It has been been there since October 2020 and began to surge out of control at the beginning of March 2021. So its impact, and the risk it posed, was clear at a minimum five months ago. Five months. Why didn't they accelerate the quarantine roll out then? It took the current crisis in NSW for them to find some urgency. But lets say the federal government only became aware of the impending tsunami in May. It is now August. And it was only a few days ago that they advised a sharp, fast lock down is the best approach to manage delta. A full month after NSW failed to lock down immediately, when all available evidence suggested they simply had to. The lack of federal advice or pressure to lock down hard and fast gave NSW cover to delay their lockdown. And no one could now argue that decision was the wrong one. The horse has now bolted. And here we are.

I'm trying very hard sticking to the rules in this thread and not making political posts. But can I just say this post, which makes a lot of excellent and very valid points does not, in my view, show the other side of the story. These points are the story. And all relate to political failings of one sort or another. Which is not to under sell the incredible complexity of the issues. Mistakes are inevitable in a crisis such as this. And state governments, including in Victoria, have made their share of errors that have contributed to the situation we are in. As have individuals of course. But the fact remains that the federal government is responsible for both the root cause of the issues we face and the solutions to those issues - the quarantine and vaccination programs. One of the key failings relates to this point: 'Delta mutation: Its arrival and age group targets surprised everyone. It made early vaccination plans to do older folks first somewhat redundant. Younger folk needs have increased demand.' This is not the case. And the federal government should not get away with their messaging it is. The delta is a game changer narrative needs to be challenged All the talk of following the expert advice rings hollow. For one thing, epidemiologists warned at the start of the pandemic of the risk of mutating strains that are more contagious. It is how viruses work. We should have been prepared for the inevitability of a variant like delta. For example by making sure our quarantine system was robust (we had Howard Springs as perfect model to replicate) and making sure the vaccination program was fit for purpose to respond to such an inevitability Secondly, the delta variant first emerged in India in OCTOBER last year. The danger it represented was apparent by the end of last year and it peaked in May of this year. The horror it wrought was there for the whole world to see. So it arrival, impact, infectiousness and impact on younger people was anything but a surprise. Australia has a big Indian community. Australians were coming home from India. It was always coming here. We had advance warning of a tsunami coming towards us. And seemingly made no attempt to prepare for it. This is not an attempt at political point scoring. We live in a democracy and i fully respect that collectively we elected the current federal government to lead us. I support good public policy. I want my federal government to implement good policy. I want my federal government to succeed. And they are best placed to do so by reviewing any failings and addressing them. I don't see much evince that this is happening.

Or even petty. As you say Taylor didn't engage Hawkins in any strength battles. Which was smart. And I thought a big factor in them hanging on in the last is Taylor ran off Hawkins at every opportunity. Meant they got the ball moving quickly, stopped the cats setting up a wall to trap inside 50 and got important territory. The key of course is pressure, or else Hawkins gets the delivery he wants/needs. If we bring that petty can play Hawkins the same way as Taylor

Don't get me wrong Hawkins is a really good player and has had just about his nest season this year. The best set shot for goal in the AFL. But I've always thought he is overrated. When he is getting beaten his body language is appalling. Throws up his hands if teamates kick poorly to him. And like many cats, whinges to the umpires. All on display last night. But my main knock on him is he is too one dimensional. He gets up the ground a bit more than he used to, but really still plays like an old school full forward. Yes he gets tbe occasional goal from an inside 50 ruck contest but in the main he needs a leading lane or a clean one on one contest to kick goals. The big issue is that if teams take these options away he not only doesn't kick goals, he offers bugger all else. The giants got back hard to block leading lanes but crucially did not allow the cats to transition quickly after intercepting half back. And they didn't allow them to chip it around and xontrol the temp until they could execute a set play where they switch and orchestrate a pass to a leading Hawkins. This was a function of their pressure. And the cats not applying enough pressure (which means they get fewer intercept marks in their back half). And for the same reason tbey didn't give Hawkins many one on one opportunities. And in particular the ones he always wants/needs/is looking for - a one on one wrestle, which he wins with his strength. And whe did have one, the pressure the giants were applying on the last kick inside 50 meant it wasn't kicked perfectly to his advantage. So he couldn't wrestle Taylor. When he did get a one in on one, Taylor read it brilliantly and reacted so much more quickly than Hawkins, who looked flat footed. He looks a gun Taylor. Clean hands, reads it well, reacts quickly and decisively and makes good decisions. I think petty has those traits to, and is also a gun.

Good teams don't get beaten by the giants. Apparently.

I'm double AZ dosed. But keen to try the full range of options.

I was very much joking. I had already entered the first stage of grief

I thought this thread was talking about the dees and our fortunes. Did demonland crash? I didn't realize. At all.

Bollocks

Exactly. Both with perfect turf, with proper drainage. And let's not over egg the pudding on the importance of training on a ground with the exact dimensions of the g. Let's consider the winners of the last 5 flags. Tigers x 3. Dogs. Eagles. I assume the Eagles have a g size training ground (though not sure), but the tigers and dogs don't. Not even close. Punt road and written oval are probably no bigger that goshs is currently.

Pre season is the time to experiment. Three weeks out from a finals campaign is not. If we beat West Coast, we will have beaten every team in the top 8. So we know we have a game plan, systems, set up and structure that works against the best teams, and therefore in finals. Why on earth would they want to change any part of tjhat system tat this satge of the season? And i don't understand what the issue is with predictability, or why we would want to charge players role to be less predictable. I suspect we will introduce some minor tactical tweaks and set plays in the finals to create some new looks or disrupt opposition planning. But given their focus on the importance of each player playing their assigned role, and how hard player must work to make their role second nature, i can't see the logic of changing anyone's role at this stage of the season