Slartibartfast

Jack it's sad you equate this to winning and losing. It's about peoples health and it's about their reliance on professional advice in a professional environment in a group situation. I'm surprised you can't see the difference but we can just differ. I don't think like you.

And he should never set foot in a medical surgery again. I might add, that's the view of many many medical professionals as well.

The solution is not punishment of innocent kids, it's regulating those in charge of them.

Well others can rejoice in the punishment of players if it happens and when the first one is diagnosed with cancer they can say "at least he was punished before he went". Dramatic but that is potentially what people are arguing. It's sick. If it was your son Redleg, how would you feel if he'd been poisoned by these dopes and then was punished. Buger the law.

We need more rational thinkers and less pedants. These kids have been punished beyond imagination and now people want more. I don't get that and I don't accept the "deterrent" argument. We are entitled to rely on professional advice in a professional environment.

So when I go to the doctor for my flu shot and he gives me something else it's my fault? I don't see it your way. People rely on professional, the young footballers relied on professionals. They were duped.

I'm not interested in the "legalities" of this case. The law is usually a dope unable to cope with the unlimited number of differing situations that can occur and this is one such time. I'm very concerned about the health of the injected players. What has been done to them is just dreadful and they are the clear victims. I hope the players get off. I hope anyone involved in administering the program, those who knew about it, those who sanctioned it, those that turned a blind eye never work in football again and are named and shamed. Little and Hird should never be allowed in an AFL ground again. I can't understand those people running around wanting to see players punished for their involvement. They have had their lives put at risk by dishonest incompetent fools in whom they understandably put their trust. And yet some want to see them punished further. It's time for some perspective.

I don't know if we had any control. And I don't think we had half our team out, we had most of our forward line and reading the scores it doesn't seem like it went in there much. Even if it made the result 5 goals different it was still very poor for us. And whilst I know team have had floggings in practice matches before I can't think of a team, other than a development team, who have come from a position such as ours where the building of confidence has been one of the major, if not the major focus. I don't have the details, but who did GWS and GCS play on the weekend? And I can't image Clarkson was thrilled with his sides last practice match. It was a poor result all round and trying to paint it otherwise doesn't rub with me.

I'm not sure if you're suggesting playing the Hawks was a good idea but in hindsight it was a dreadful idea and one I never supported. One of the major focuses of the preseason would have been to rebuild confidence and belief and I reckon a 110 point drubbing/humiliation against the Hawks would have erased much of the good work that has been done. To schedule a game against the powerhouse of the competition in the last practice match where teams play their best players after a draining game in the NT against another top team was strange to say the least. Those who say we need to find out where we are at should just listen to Roos. He's knows where we're at. We would have been much better playing a good middle of the road team because the reality is they are our competition. Hawks, Geelong, Freo and the Swans are on another planet and not our competition ATM. Anyway I'm in the Goodvibe camp - I didn't see it so it didn't happen. Pity the players can't say the same.

I've also heard Salem rated ahead of Kelly from someone involved in TAC footy. rjay what is your background with junior footy? You seem to have a good handle on it.

For years now I've read that "we've failed to develop our players". I've been one that's said it. Our youth just doesn't seem to improve in our system and in fact some seem to deteriorate. I know that "development" means "improvement' and going from being a promising junior to a competent AFL player but what is the process and what does "development" entail? I fail to believe we've haven't committed the resources to player development. In Bailey's time we had Viney and Kelly O'Donnell in charge of development. In Neeld's time we had head coach, line coach and assistant line coaches. We've had player welfare managers and sports psychologists. We've had specialist running coaches and kicking coaches. We've spent the money but haven't developed our players. Why? Is there anyone on this site who has experience in "player development" that can tell me what it involves. And can you give any insight into why, despite committing the resources, we appear to have failed so badly at this aspect of football. And further, have we got it in place now? Like everyone I trust Roos knows what it looks like and how to do it but I reckon the term is thrown around without any real understanding of what is involved. I'd like to hear more from those that know.

Oh god, we'll have the reality bus next!

Thought the same thing about Chris Judd when I saw him running around in a practice match at Optus Oval in 2002.

It's all very well to get uppity about these things but the proof of the pudding is in the eating and at the moment Clark and Dawes are not even training with the main group let alone looking like playing any time soon. From the start of preseason we were told the objective was to get these guys ready for round 1. Dave Misson's reports have always said they are going "well" but the reality is they continue to be "no shows". I'm starting to think these guys are very marginal conveyances. I hope I'm wrong but the fact is the club has given us great hope over injured players who just continue to be sidelined. Clark, Dawes, Jamar, Gawn, Garland and now perhaps Hogan. You can't blame people for feeling let down and you can't blame them for questioning what is coming from the club. The reality is over preseason it feels like we've been fed bulldust.

I agree. But there are very few in the AFL that do. With the way the game is played it's no biggie. We didn't get what we expected with Watts but that doesn't mean he won't be a very good player. We'll know by the end of this year if not sooner.

How can you bag someone for their lack of height? Different sort of bag I suppose.....

Disappointingly personal.

Now there is damned with faint praise if ever I saw it!!

It's a shame Robbo is on 360. I like Whateley. but I just can't stand Robbo. Does anyone here like him? He's both dumb and inarticulate. How on earth did he get the job?

I was responding to your criticism of Watt's thighs compared to Johnson and suddenly you're talking courage and tackles. I agree on your new points, I don't see Watts as particularly brave and I don't see him as a tackling machine. But I don't judge a player on the size of his thighs. I reckon you're starting to over think things a little master, a shame, I like reading your contributions.

This game was against Box Hill and he was terrific. Hurt his back that game and didn't recapture this form. I was disappointed when he didn't get another go but Todd Viney was there for his entire time and would have had a good handle on him and been able to assess how much of his failure was due to ability/application and how much was environment. And I think his delisting has been mitigated by the recruitment of Michie and Riley particularly as they are similar ages and ability. I'll watch his progress with interest as I reckon there is a fair chance he'll get another crack.

I go to round 1 every year............................

Do you criticize Robert Murphy for the same thing?Honestly are we really reduced to comparing the size of his quads to someone with a completely different build.

Congratulations Rollo, well done.

No, I said "you have pedantry characteristics", very different. And no, I don't have aspergers.