P-man

It's a pity the names of voters aren't public. Given CS frequents here I'd be interested in seeing how he rates himself. I think nutbean summed it up. He's been a mixed bag. He deserves alot of credit for overseeing getting us out of debt, despite Jimmy's role. However he has also overseen what has been one of the worst period's in the club's history, from all angles, culminating in what we're currently seeing. I'm also not as big a fan of him introducing things under the guise of heritage and tradition. The blazers, the bugler, even that stupid dinky collar...I'd be more than happy to see all of these binned and never spoken of again.

Bail looks to have filled out a bit more. Pedro is effing solid. Good get.

I am wary of showing any allegiance to Eddie. Unblemished history of doing things in his own club's interest. His comments, while flattering, still infer that the club took advantage of the system to gain a priority pick. He's essentially saying, "sure, they're guilty, but can ya blame em?" I doubt Vlad would look kindly on such a defence.

Yep, I'd be more than happy to see those responsible, if found guilty, to cop the whack.

Moloney has done an almost perfect job of ruining any sense of legacy with the MFC. A VC who always professed to bleed red and blue, and i have nothing but contempt for him now. Just a self-interested, bullying boofhead.

Okay cool, I just think we need to steer away from, "if the players weren't told to lose, we didn't tank". It's a little broader than that.

rp - if it can be proven that the intent of actions taken by the coaches was to lose a game of football, how would that not meet a legal definition of tanking? Irrespective of whether the instruction was to the players directly, actions taken outside of that with respect to player selection, player positioning, gameday tactics etc could still make the club culpable. For me it comes down to intent, and whether that can be proven.

We're an entrenched bottom four side that pulls Port-like crowds. Claiming the draw as a form of punishment for perceived actions still being investigated? It's a stretch, to say the least.

Agreed. People need to chill the f*** out. This state of hysteria is being assisted by naysayers and routine club bashers. The fire may have been lit but Rome hasn't burned to the ground yet,

This is what stuck out to me also, the inference being that for the first three quarters at least, the players themselves were not trying to win the match. Whether under instruction or not, this is placing blame on the players, in addition to coaches and administrators. Accusations of experimentation and questionable positional changes is one thing, but implying players did not give their all on a footy field is as offensive as it gets. Caro's entire reputation (what is left of it) hinges on how this pans out.

Weedon can play. He'd be first choice. No-one rates Bower? Showed enough last year to warrant a chance at another club. He copped a hammering from Carlton fans so could just fall into the category of needing a fresh start.

Adam Cooper is clearly a Carlton fan. What a ridiculous representation.

With a "zip it" motion over his thin dry lips. Damn you, now I've got it too.

Hate to say it but there would be many thinking if we just lost Pick 4, we'd be getting off lightly. Assuming that there is factual evidence in existence, I second WYL's view on this. Anyone proven to have been directly associated needs to walk.

haha..kudos. A laugh is much needed at times like this.

If this vault garbage turns out to be true then you can't say we don't deserve punishment. To have a big round table on how to lose games is beyond belief in the stupidity and integrity stakes..

Apparently stated on 3AW that Pick 4 will be taken off us? Taken with a grain of salt at this stage but worrying times.

That's the bit that gets me about the article. It seems too weird and sinister to be true.

It hurts that little bit more that the individual in question is a complete plod like Brickhead McLean, who was so incensed by playing for a tanking team that he signed up with Carlton.

hm, definitely picking up steam now. Thanks for the memories Barry. What a fine legacy.

It comes down to motive. It's fine to not have winning as the main priority, but If "experimentation" is done with the clear aim of losing AFL matches, as opposed to testing players in different positions for the purpose of development, these are two very different scenarios. If the former can be proven, it is what the media have dubbed to be "tanking", surely. I can't see how it can be argued otherwise. It's not so clear cut that only directing players to lose is tanking.

I think GWS quite clearly falls into the first category Paul alluded to: "Legitimately using the above strategies to set the players and team up for the following year, trying out new roles etc in anticipation of drafting, building a better team etc..."

stu, whether or not people are over it, it was a tipping point that led to a coach losing his job and essentially a new era of the club beginning. It was a major event, hence the emphasis placed upon it.

I wouldn't be so flippant about the potential "whack". It could bring this club to its knees. For good.

Isn't the issue here, at least from the AFL's perspective, that of draft tampering? So whether or not players were instructed to lose, if the so called "experimentation" was done with the aim of losing, it's irrelevant what name you place upon it. You've taken the action to improve your position in the draft. That said, the two issues raised previously ring very true: 1. The AFL put this system in place and have willingly turned a blind eye to previous transgressions. The appropriate action would be to fix the damn system. 2. To make an example of the MFC and NOT take action against Carlton, Collingwood, and arguably Richmond, Hawthorn (the list goes on) would be a gross injustice and downright stupid. I'd also add that whilst Vlad has denied tanking takes place, recently he has qualified those comments by saying if there is evidence to the contrary it should be looked at and dealt with. Let's not assume he is in our corner. The AFL will however need to tread very carefully if penalties are going to be imposed. If we are stripped of picks at the next draft I expect the club to react swiftly and emphatically.