Dr. Gonzo

What are you talking about? I've seen or heard no evidence of a personal grudge. What do you mean by "Jones ratted him out"? Do you think Goodwin has acted unilaterally on this? It seems like your letting your emotions cloud your reason.

Doesn't answer the question. At all.

It's not about his relationships with the players it's about the example he sets for them if he is allowed to continuously get away with failing to meet club standards. Do you expect the players to have no accountability for their actions to the club? What kind of precedent and example does that set? Where does it lead? To players cancelling training sessions because they're not up to it? To players deciding not to follow rehab programs? To players not pushing themselves to excel in their profession and take the MFC to that elusive 13th flag? I think we're a bit scarred after Neeld/Schwab reign of terror and quite frankly who wouldn't be. But there was a litany of stuffups that went on throughout their regime dating to before Neeld was even hired. Roos hired Goodwin, tutored him, went through the transition process. Viney, Taylor, Mahoney have runs on the board, don't they deserve our support in this until proven otherwise? Oliver spoke highly of McCartney last night in getting the best out of himself this year and giving him the kick he needed. I'm willing to support this mob until they prove otherwise. What other choice do I have? Cancel my membership in protest? The decisions been made and the proof of the pudding will be in the eating. This current admin and FD should not be crucified for the sins of their predecessors.

The one question I can't get my head around is if Watts is as good and important to the team and club culture as people are asserting why would the club be kicking him out? Why would the club deliberately sabotage itself and weaken itself in its pursuit of success? With regards to the "Jack didn't know" I find this incredibly hard to believe. Yeah maybe he didn't know the extent but how could he not know the possibility? He would've had constant feedback from coaches and leadership group throughout the year and I find it hard to believe he wouldn't have been made aware at his exit interview that the had clear issues that he had failed to address. So far we've only heard second /third hand reports of his interpretation of what he was told and when. Often people receive critical feedback or are told of potential changes but are either oblivious or in denial about it. We weren't in the room so we can't say what was and wasn't said. At the end of the day it doesn't really matter, even if not ideal, because the crux of the matter is the club has their reasons for moving Jack on which, as above, no has been able to articulate what they might be if they refute everything that has come out of the club over the last week or so.

No one has said he has poor relationships with anyone, players, leadership group or coaches.

I wouldn't want to speculate. Forgive me if I don't blindly believe every anonymous comment.

His first half wasn't great though to be fair

How do you know what was discussed between Watts and the coaches throughout the year?

Based on what?

- Progress over the past 2 years where he regressed back to old habits of an unprofessional to his training and preparation - He had a hamstring injury, not like he was coming back from a knee reco give me a spell. So he needed 6 weeks in the reserves to regain fitness before being able to return to the seniors? From a 3 week injury? This is just utter rubbish. And if a full time professional AFL player who has been in the system 9 years and has barely had any prolonged length of time out injured hasn't built up enough of a tank to cope with 4 weeks out with a hammy and needs another month to regain fitness in the reserves then that proves the point being made by the FD in regards to his approach to his training and his profession. - When has he won a game off his own boot? He kicked the matchwinners against the Pies and last year against the Suns but I wouldn't say he won those games off his own boot. Didn't even poll in Queens Bday game, Petracca got the votes from memory - Is he taking a stab at McCartney here? A guy who he helped bring in to the club? - Why does he think Goodwin may have changed his views? Obviously something has happened in the interim, since he left the club - I would be astonished if Watts wasn't given a heads up that a trade could be an option. Not saying it didn't happen but we are taking Roos' version of what Watts presumably told him here. Perhaps when "exploring options" was raised in his exit interview he was oblivious to what it meant? - Poor if it came from his manager, he should've been notified by the club and the discussion should've been had so he was under no illusions why the club was taking this path.

Agreed on all counts

I had the same impression although its hard to know whether its due to being uncomfortable in front of a room of people or if he's always like that. It's hard to imagine he's like that in a room of 20-odd players pre-game etc but you never know. When he started talking about Apollo 11 I was thinking "where is he going with this? He's lost me" not necessarily because of what he was saying but the way he was delivering it.

Still only 24 as well - I reckon he still has some improvement in him.

For 9 more days

Ernie, there's the "unknown" element as well - what he does when he's not on the field. The coaches and Leadership Group know this us supporters don't other than the snippets we hear here and there.

I thought by 2011 people would've figured out what kind of player he was. He was never gonna be the spearhead he was touted as.

Do we have cap issues? Watts is contracted for 2 more years, so if we have to wear a couple of hundred K per year for the next 2 years should be irrelevant to the young guys coming out of contract in 2019 and beyond.

Honestly, I think it will come down more to who pays his salary than squabbling over pick 25 vs pick 40.

I've amended the post, I hope this makes the context clearer.

Should we get Garry Lyon and Chris Connolly back? They love the club, bleed red and blue.

I think you misunderstood the context of my post. Completely.

They're professionals, that's like saying in 1982 "what would Sheedy care about Essendon, he's an old Tiger from way back" Why should Peter Jackson get involved in list management decisions? Stop the "scattergun" of blame and look at the root cause, the common denominator.

Agreed, I think the Leadership Group are determined to get success, look at Jones and Viney's speeches last night. I like Jack Watts as a person and when he's "on" - I wish it didn't come to this.

Well it will depend on how it plays out. Say Watts nominates one club it makes it trickier for us. However most clubs these days are pretty good when it comes to the trade table (except apparently Essendon and the Crows) and won't try and stiff us cos they know next time if the shoes on the other foot we will reciprocate. I can't see us getting lower than a 3rd rounder for him. Put it this way, we would be pretty stupid to tell him to look at his options, send him around Australia looking at different clubs, talking to different clubs, nominating a club - and then we say, sorry we're not willing to send you there because we want a better draft pick. At the end of the day I think we'll take what we can get but we'll be hoping for a pick in the 20s.

But he won't ever be that player at Melbourne. That's the problem I think.