Little Goffy

Is that you, Barry Prendergast?

My favourite thing about round 4 was the turnaround in the 'spread' of tackle numbers. Bad enough that our total was low, but for rounds 1 to 3 it was Cross, Jones, Spencer and fresh air. Those three between them got, literally (actually literally) half our tackles. Viney came in for round 3 that helped a little. But then, in round 4, the whole team got in on it. Opposition players, no matter who their opponent and where they were on the ground, actually had to be aware that they could be tackled. Huge difference. Without arguing the specific merits of tackle counts of a game winning stat, the fact that it went from being carried by three, to being a team effort, tells a sweet story.

It's a case for massively improving the second-tier competition. I'm not Phil Clearly, but I do believe that there should be a lot more investment put into the state-level leagues. I'm never sure exactly how to go about it, but obviously there are a lot of different issues in the existing structures in every state. Present a well thought out plan, load it with resources so nobody wants to say no, and watch the talent pool and community connections of the game thrive. With the number of entertaining, talented, and 'natural' footballers around who aren't getting a gig at AFL because they are not quite 'athletic' enough, a well-resources second tier would be a very interesting league.

Actually, Collingwood pinched it off Sydney (early 2000s) who had in turn pinched it off us, earlier. It's funny, when Sydney did it at the SCG and especially in a couple of those big games when Olympic park filled up, it was eerie and unsettling. When Collingwood do it, I just feel like telling them to shut up and stop being annoying, like people yelling int he city street outside your apartment late on a saturday night. Uncannily like that, actually.

What jury would convict? Geez, Yze Magic was a different kind of troll to what we have on here these days. Not so many snide sideways remarks, just straight up "you are full of ... and here's why" followed by incredible, sometimes outlandish theories. Someone should go back and check just in case it turned out he was right about everything.

Well. Bugger. Still, like a few others have said, better to have a clearly defined issue to overcome than a general malaise that never feels like it will end. Trengove gets a season to get his head right, get hungry for 2015, and then be the player we saw he could be in his early seasons.

How about that, after one win Jordie has become a straw man.

I'll take Dawes' modesty over the 'I'm at the top of this (very small) hill' attitude that seemed to taint a few of our 'leaders' over the years. Let's see... which other leaders have been generally modest? James McDonald. Obviously. I'd say David Neitz didn't do much more than 'required' media. You wouldn't catch Nathan Jones anywhere near a jar of Fig Jam.I like I like this modesty thing.

He does his job, Definitely not a star. Often looks a bit unco and kind of 'harassed'. But he does his job. On the one hand, there's room for improvement. On the other hand, there's room for improvement. I get that you don't rate him as a player, but seems a lot of trouble to go to, starting a thread just to insult him.

Kept churning out the 1%ers even when his other efforts were falling in a heap. Didn't drop his effort. Gotta respect that. Really pleased that he's had a bit of visible good performance. One of the better things in football, throughout the years, has been the 'ordinary' player stepping up a bit.

Meanwhile, our win over Carlton and Brisbane's capitulation to Port contribute to a feeling, just for the moment, like there are multiple other clubs who have slipped back a bit even since the start of the season, while we are gradually getting it together. Plus, Western Sydney keeping being respectable mid-table performers, making our initially awful-looking loss in the swamp look less disturbing. Not sure I've quite healed from the woulds of being smashed by West Coast, or being cut up by Riewoldt and especially Clint Jones in round 1... but the mood is definitely turning. A few of our coming games now have that little edge of unpredictability about them. Would love see us keep up the effort, steal a win against some of the up-down teams we face in the next couple of weeks. But to me it all builds up to the chance to pick off another over-rated media-loved team; killing Richmond's season in round 9!

Before this round, only Jones, Spencer and Cross averaged more than 4 or more tackles a game. This game we had 13 players lay 4 or more tackles. Huge plus for team effort and no doubting that was what got us the match. I only had radio and numbers up here in Sydney, but Jones clearly was extraordinary. Cross, Frawley, Grimes and McDonald all sounded/statted like they were making a big contribution. Duble figures 1%ers from McDonald again. I'm really pleased with Spencer's contribution. His best game to date? Competent disposal and a few marks to go with solid ruck contest and his usual steady stream of tackles. I think the big story of this game overall is how many of our weaker players were at the very least 'not liabilities'.

St Kilda completely screwed up a major relocation, moving too far south for anyone to reach, in an environment that didn't meet all their requirements and which came with all sorts of council and property developer wrangles, and which the players openly disliked. Now they are looking at a cobbled-together redevelopment of an old suburban ground in partnership with a user who will need the ground for their own, non-compatible, purposes for large chunks of the year. And apparently that's a sign that we, with our state-of-the-art football facilities located over the road from our administrative base, all in the heart of the city and in the literal shadows of the MCG, have been complacent and foolish, Sigh.

The issue is that people on here are calling for us to be the ones dumping Lovell behind play. Two threads here, mixed into one. One group of people demanding constant effort, two-way running, tackling hard and often, not shirking contests. The other group apparently will settle for a bit of sniping at players whose face or posture they don't like.

When did 'using my strengths against other's abuse' mean calling for off-the-ball fights in advance of an AFL game? Anyway, post-2004; Roughhead, Franklin, Lewis, Young, Taylor, Dew, Murphy, Ellis, Birchall, Guerra, Sewell, Rioli. It wasn't some stupid punch-on in 2004 that set the Hawks right.

I guess we just have different perspectives on using violence to mask inadequacy. I guess it has worked for you in the past?

Hmm, get in a punch-on in the second quarter, lose by 90, have three required players miss the next couple of games with suspension, when we have no depth at all to cover them. It's a plan! I feel invigorated already! Galvanised in the true 'experiment making a dead frog jerk around randomly' sense.

They would probably think 'gee, I'm so glad mental health issues are being taken seriously and held out in the open, after all those decades of trying to cope with post-traumatic stress disorder by drinking. Maybe soon I'll get the help I need to put the war behind me and begin to reconnect with my wife and children.' Also "*** those British b4stards for sending me into this ****hole with all the wrong gear, no strategy and no heavy artillery support". ANZACs were among the most routinely insubordinate troops of the entire first world war. Over day to day things, not mass desertions like the Habsburg Empire, Russian Empire/provisional government, or the French mutineers. They simply routinely said 'no' to officers with no credibility and bad plans. Because they were not 'drilled' into mindless sacrifice for a system or structure, rather they were used to small-team environments and leaders 'emerging from the group' with an established mutual trust earnt over time. Speaking quite seriously, I imagine that if you told an ANZAC soldier to risk their life by ignoring a critical illness for the sake of the entertainment of some guy who gets cranky on internet forums, they'd tell you to **** off.

We'll all be rooned.

Third row of the crowd... is that where you're typing from champ?

Seems likely. Stupidity, alcohol, ego. The supidity and ego seem evident, I'm presuming the alcohol was a part once the fdsg gfershnk nerrrmaa writing skills crept in. In support of 'angrydee' - may I suggest that 'angrydemons' have a name change to something more appropriate. Sookydemons? Tantrumdemons? Iusuallygetmywaybyheadbuttingdoorsdemons?

Bizarre that this still gets talked about as some kind of cultural moment. All summed up by the commentator at the 10.15 mark of the video posted above. "I just think they've lost the plot at the moment, the Hawks. they've tried to unsettle the Bombers, it hasn't worked, and basically, they're not up to it." I prefer what Geelong did to Hawthorn in 'retaliation' for the Grand Final upset. That, that is tough. I want that. Give me four years of never losing to Carlton, you can keep your gutless sniping and hair pulling (actual hair pulling, I mean, seriously?).

Or maybe it cost them another one either side of what they got? I'm not arguing that Cousins should have walked away from football, obviously the circumstances and personal issues are very different. But I'll take 'facing the problem and setting out to do the right thing for the player's well-being' well ahead of 'pretend nothing is wrong, let it run and hope not too many of our players get hospitalised with overdoses'.

On a scale from - 'How Mitch Clark and the Melbourne Football Club handled his mental health issues' to 'How Ben Cousins and West Coast handled his mental health issues' I'm really glad, for club and player, that we've gone down the quiet, health-first, approach. It may seem a spurious comparison but if Mitch had chosen to continue in the AFL environment there's a real chance that as everything else fails to bring him joy he would set out on the all-too-common spiral of increasingly desperate 'self-medication'. A special management plan also known as 'The Echuca approach'.

This event is really helping to clarify a few things about Demonland. Yep, some people wind eachother up too much, keep getting in petty slanging matches. But their heart is in the right place when it comes to the important stuff. Then there are people like hero1 (who has been banned permanently courtesy of comments in this thread) who are just downright inhuman. And just a little closer to civilization are comments like this. I'll credit C&B with at least having no idea what he's talking about, but this stuff is far from helpful. Clinical Depression is not 'struggling emotionally'. It is waking up with suicidal thoughts and going to sleep with suicidal thoughts, no matter how 'good' your day has been. It is every taste of joy being turned to ash in your mouth and no sense of hope that it will ever improve. The longer it goes the worse it gets, because every day reinforces the sense that nothing you do, no amount of effort, no achievement, can make any difference to how you feel. Critically, it comes with a terrible and relentless feeling of guilt that you 'should' be happy. Hating yourself for not being happy after all your closest people have made effort and sacrifices to try to 'cheer you up'. That's where attitudes like C&B's come in. "Why are you doing this to me, Mitch?" "Come on, we've all been sad, it's time to stop failing and be a winner" "I've supported you and now you're letting me down all over again" "You're just being weak, why do you have to be such a loser" So helpful. "Your lung collapsed? Come one, you said you'd go swimming with me!"