Little Goffy

As for connections, aren't they much the same? There are an awful lot of shadows, nooks and crannies around [censored] stadium. Their real malaise only kicked in AFTER the win over the Saints, oddly enough. The loss to the almost as troubled, but at least fighting, Brisbane is the only game since then that they've been within 12 goals of their opponent. Carlton have had the eagles, bombers and magpies, each of which is hard to rate at the moment but I think your point stands that they haven't played any truly 'deadly' teams yet. Speaking of which, I expect to be at the Swans/Carlton game up here at the SCG next weekend. And I'll say this honestly; it could be 186 territory. Kennedy, Parker, Hanneberry, Mitchell and Jack will obliterate Carlton in the clearances and none of them ever, ever stop. The Blues have nobody at all who can match up on either of Franklin or Tippet while Carlton's forward line will be well covered by the low-key but effective Sydney defenders. Going in without hope, with the club bitterly at war with itself and a coach clearly on the edge of resigning/being sacked, against an opponent on a small ground with a meaningful home-ground advantage, a parochial crowd and something to prove after recently letting a game unexpectedly slip... ugly ugly stuff.

Carlton's problems are pretty easy to trace. Currently, their number one player on this year's AFL rankings is Eddie Betts, who has 26 goals to his name. Jeff Garlett is our own current leading goalkicker with 15. Jarrad Waite continues to be Jarrad Waite, but for all the brain fades he still has 13 goals from 6 games. Best I can figure, they were all moved on because of 'consistency' issues. But Carlton did that without actually having a replacement plan. Levi Casboult, Tom Bell, Lachie Henderson and Troy Mezel might become a very potent forward line in time, but every one of them would still have had a spot on the field even if the whole lot of Betts, Garlett and Waite were still there. So much of the talk from disappointed Carlton fans mentions the division between; - Ratten saying 'our list is limited, we shouldn't sacrifice everything for the top 4, nor do we have the strength to push through a total rebuild without imploding; we should keep patiently developing the team even if it means lurking mid-table for a few more years'. - Malthouse saying 'I am the greatest coach ever and Daisy will come too and he is awesome, with me Carlton can make it to top-4 within a couple of years are really make a tilt for a premiership... oops... ok, dump everything, I'll need about 8 years.' And the board liked what they heard from Malthouse. This also relates to why Carlton may have been given so many friday night games. Not so long ago their forward line was an exciting party for the spectators of BOTH sides, and you could never quite predict how a game would turn out. We all know that TV executives and AFL House are generally at least a year or two behind reality. Also, the Carlton board have connections, y'know.

Unless someone is going to suggest we keep a rookie list spot open for him, I think it might be time to close the thread. Nothing new, informative or even constructive coming out anymore.

Wow, I didn't know Coniglio was coming out of contract. I thought Western Sydney would be making him top priority. Get get get get get that kid. Would not blink at using our first pick. He would slot in immediately as our equal-best midfielder at least, and his all-round ability would bring our midfield very quickly to a more complete unit. It would be enough for me to feel much more confident about our 2016 midfield, without needing to expect miracles of Brayshaw, Petracca, Stretch etc...

We'll never know who really was to 'blame' for Melbourne falling in such an appalling malaise in the late 2000s. The club was simply so bitterly divided that nothing worked, nothing could be achieved. Most of all, everyone wanted a seat at every table and there was as much second guessing, foot-dragging and side agendas at the Melbourne Football Club around 2010 as the French Army in 1940. I gave Schwab a lot, a LOT, of benefit of the doubt for a very long time, and the circumstances were all kinds of messed up. But as CEO of the Demons he failed. Carlton... well, Steven Trigg is fighting his own internal war of attrition, and I'm not sure I like any of the sides. It will be fascinating to see how that club copes with the renewed prospect of sustained failure.

I'm ok with zones as long as our zone is 'Melbourne'. Hey, I'd even accept the other Vic clubs retaining zones in the areas they are named for, as a concession to them. Daft idea, some kind of nostalgic blindness.

What a great first post, and what a lot of information and insight actually shared! If I was speculating, I'd imagine some of the theory is that we are trying to build up long-term fitness and strength and actually sacrificing some performance in the short term (read - whole seasons!) to get the 'kids' up to speed. This goes to the whole issue of not having enough list depth. Ideally we'd have different groups of intensity. -Kids being developed physically to the point they need to reach, and learning their craft in the slightly less maniacally fit VFL, where week-by-week fatigue is not so horrible. -Peak 'bodies' that are storming along, and even if they are doing the same loads as the kids, are now developed enough to not be constantly worn down by it so much. -Veterans who are somewhat 'managed' in their training loads and games compared to the others, partly because their consistency is established and they are so familiar with pushing themselves on gameday and self-managing their recovery routines. One interesting side note - Dom Tyson played his best football right at the end of last season. His last 4 rounds or so were stellar. So he started well, slumped a bit mid-season, then finished well. I'd be intrigued to put all the pieces of that puzzle together. Could Tyson's season have been defined by initial enthusiasm, then weariness, then a final burst once the end was in sight? Let's face it, the seasons are long and cold for a Melbourne midfielder lately.

Earl Hood, I think Hogan2014 is making the perfectly valid point that in the modern game the appropriate path to success is to concentrate on the players you don't have rather than spending all your time being anxious about the ones you do. Or something.

It is a tough choice. Try to 'manage expectations' while keeping open talk to a minimum and focusing on internal conversations. OR Try to respect and engage with the beleaugered supporters by being as transparent and informative as possible. Philosophically I am always, always in favour of greater transparency. That applies to everything from Ballarat Catholic Schools to Free Trade Agreements, and indeed, to football clubs.

Chuck him in the centre clearances and tell him it is his last chance to show he actually wants to be an AFL footballer. Nowhere to hide.

Viney and Jetta were crucial losses for us, given that they offer a tougher edge that so many of our players lack. Remember that after the Richmond win the talk was about everyone's surprise at Melbourne 'out-muscling and out-working' an opponent. People joking about how they had to read that twice. Somewhere in this team, the toughness does exist and the effort can be made. But we also all know that too many players just don't see the point once they feel like a loss is inevitable anyway. We need to beat a few comparable teams to ourselves, and at some point sneak an unexpected win or two, if we are going to restore enough confidence to the players to get them out of the celler-dweller state of mind.

Dawes is in the team to provide continuity after the loss of Brad Miller. 'Something kind of like a CHF but without great nous, and making little contribution to actually attacking'. With Dawes, he is great at climbing 3/4 of the way up a ladder, but struggles to go any further.

I'm living in Sydney now, and got to see the Bulldogs cut open Sydney with a daring attack strategy relying on a lot of speed and hard running. And they out-worked Sydney to make it happen. Sydney! While I highly respect our actual defenders, I think the overall team defensive effort is dangerously vulnerable. It does not have either the speed or the hard running to get back to cover the Dogs counterattacks. We're more chance against the Pies than the Bulldogs. But, in the end, it'll all swing on whether the players actually come out to play properly.

Who was the media buffoon who said that 'social media' and supporter forums were the problem? Got his email so we can all forward the article to him. He is, after all, the only person who might learn anything new from it.

He's 27 years old, and since he was a teenager he's been told better times, indeed, 'glorious' times, were just around the corner. He's borne the brunt of the club's failures for year after year, often being the defender who has to cover a mismatched opponent because we didn't have the right players available, and facing down who knows how many 100pt losses that could hardly be his fault but which he was always 'on camera' for. His only direct colleague in his role throughout that time has left, to go to the very same opponent that was smashing him that day. His other mates through that time are either sinking to the end of their careers in the VFL or have gone to other clubs. His closest mentors throughout his career are dead. He was one of our best on the day, one of the few who actually didn't drop his head. I'm fine with him being visibly upset at making a clanger (or even moreso, having a clanger kind of imposed upon him by circumstance). Honestly, I think I'd be even happier to see Garland celebrating a win in a final than I would be for Nathan Jones.

Rectal thread.

Plays all game, or at least tries all game. Deserves to be on the field, but it is definitely a problem that he is appearing in our best.

Ok, what is going on? Grimes keeps Clint Jones to 15 touches and gets 31, but he is a wash-out? Gawn had 11 marks, an astonishing 5 contested, but he can't hold a grab. He accumulated 19 disposals but doesn't involve himself? Starting to think that forum posts about our players at Casey are not entirely without prejudice.

Well said Praha. Footballers can let social media wash off them with a simple recognition that 'those people are irrelevant tossers'. But the steady stream of media, from the highest profile to the lowest, making grand write-off pronouncements for the sake of sounding superior... it is harder to toss that away when it does a week-long media cycle and everyone you know is seeing it on the back page of their paper. Shocking thing is, you'd barely know the difference between the media's steady stream of 'this guy is no good' and 'this guy is a future star' hyperbole, and some of the Casey Scorpions game threads on here. Again, the standard case study of gobshite media, Damian Barrett - how many of his 'sliding doors' items each week are a cheap shot at someone already down, or just winding up speculation about contracts?

If we beat hawthorn tomorrow... I'll start looking forward to the rematch in the finals. And more practically, I'll finish those things I've been procrastinating about for almost as long as the Demons haven't beaten Hawthorn!

The nosy vicar Damien Barrett used his trite 'sliding doors' space on AFL.com to tell the Dogs they should never let a player with three knee injuries take the field again. Neale Daniher took to the field, was excellent, then went on to prove himself to be a resilient and effective coach at one of the most complex and disorganised clubs in the game. The exact opposite of 'walk away from anything difficult' Barrett. And now he stands up for himself and other sufferers of motor-neuron disease, still with the same positive attitude calling for practical help and work to overcome the problem, not for pity and some disingenuous 'compassionate exile' from society. As others have said, the voice might tremble but the fine man is still there.

Question; is Billy Stretch fast enough to play a run-with role on the likes of Bradley Hill or Isaac Smith? Speed/evasiveness from several Hawks is the big thing I am worried about for this game. Oh, Neville, Neville, save us, we need you!

Yeah, I think missing Jetta and Viney in particular will hurt us given the need to created contested situations and not let Hawthorn move freely. Isn't it fascinating to see people basically abandoning the club to sulk for a week because a few players they've decided they don't like are getting a game? Seems like a few people here see themselves as the stars of the club...

Despite having many more total possessions, Hawthorn were only even with Western Sydney on contested possessions. Lewis and Hodge were 1 & 2 for effective disposals at Hawthorn, and 2 & 3 for contested possessions. (behind only Wonky Will Langford). In fact, 1/3rd of Hawthorn's contested possessions against Western Sydney were through just 3 players; Langford, Breust and Mitchell. Langford butchers the ball routinely and grotesquely, meaning that at the moment the 'effective contested possessions' job actually falls to just Breust and Mitchell. Bradley Hill (20 disposals, 90% eff, but just 2 contested), Hartung, Duryea, Suckling and Birchall rely on getting loose, and provided a huge share of the drive out of defensive 50 and into the forward 50. I'm beginning to see the logic in Michie, Bail, Grimes and M. Jones. If we can force Hawthorn's 'smooth' midfielders to do everything in a contested situation, without the steady veterans to take charge and control the game, they might just bollocks it all up.

Oh good. Women's football may not get much of the funding, but apparently they can still get just as much of the bureaucratic martinets. Ahh, 'martinet'. There's a word that could be wheeled out a bit more in the world today.