grazman

Just in case you missed it.... clubs now free to trade future draft picks. http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-commission-trading-future-draft-picks-20150728-gimgzk.html Interesting to see how clubs may assess what that future pick may actually be worth. Might also help if the club doesn't want to offer up two early picks in the same draft.

It’s not a pretty look is it, but like you say all we want for Christmas is a bloody premiership. The issue for mine around Roo’s game plan that is often overlooked is that it was built on playing games at the SCG, not MCG. It’s little wonder that a lot of our players are feeling the pinch in terms of fitness. It’s not a huge concern to be honest as I think Roos is concentrating on reestablishing culture and the basics of what is needed to be successful. Be that as it may I think being able to play the stoppage game going forward is prudent in terms of where the game is going and I think it’s far from a forgone conclusion that Goodwin will be a Roos clone, but will undoubtedly benefit from his tutelage in some aspects and develop his own style having at least started to address the issues in place. I think he will be more attacking, but it’s a work in progress – neither Geelong or Hawthorn established their dominance overnight. I know you and others may have significant issues around the succession plan and Roo’s nomination of his own successor and due process. This isn’t the way it’s usually done in the industry, most of the time it’s a head in the basket and ‘next’… I can only speculate that Peter Jackson was comfortable with the process and that Roos himself knows the sorts of traits that are needed in replacing him. I’d see the way Carlton are going about it as industry standard for replacing a coach you’ve just rissoled, a better approach is a succession plan where the incumbent can do a proper ‘handover’. I think a lot of work still needs to be done with the umpires, clearly Roos is frustrated with the ‘interpretation’ of rules. Simply penalising the last man holding the ball when they haven’t been given a chance to dispose of the ball when the music stops (Vince penalised while bending over to pick the ball up at the same time he was being tackled) is also not a good look for the game.

Oh dear...I know boats. Supporters can have all the opinions they want in the world, but I will walk away from this club when it starts taking strategic direction from the masses.

Disagree completely Budge. Why would we be starting again fresh with Goodwin? This is about a succession plan (something the MFC has little experience with), but the transition will have already started and be complete by the end of next year. Goodwin will be taking over the reins more and more as next year roles on - Roos will simply be sitting in the back of the box as Coaching director by Rd 23 2016.

Buckley was caught out badly by Robbo last night. Set him up big time when Robbo declared that Darcy Moore reminded him of Jeff Heyward - then pushed Buckley whether he'd seen Jeff Heyward play (He's the fictional FF in David Williamson's 'The Club') Buckley said he'd seen him play - when Robbo asked when, Buckley replied from an old highlights reel... whoops. I can take Robbo or leave him, but Buckley was certainly left red faced last night.

They're probably about 18 months ahead of us in terms of recruiting/development. (taking a blue skies approach)

Agree, how many times do you see the younger players on the list to look up and see their team mates in the wrong positions? How many times do you see a Melbourne player spoil their own team mate by competing for the same ball or standing too close? How many times do you see them fail to block or shepherd? How many times do you see senior players torch the ball or ignore the first option? There's still a lot of work to be done.

What do supporters really expect? I expected to win about 8-9 matches this year. We probably won't, but that doesn't mean that my expectations were realistic or that 8-9 wins is actually an accurate measure of whether we're fixing the issues that need to be fixed or a reflection of whether we're any closer to premiership glory.

Do you think stoppages might become more of the norm next year BB if the AFL scrap the sub and cap the interchange at 80-100?

The angst is understandable, same issues we've seen for so long. Roos has gone from hero to zero in the space of half a season because expectations were for more. More, wins, more effort, more hope that we're heading towards PremiershipNirvana only to be left constantly disappointed. Trying to be rational and logical about why we should continue to invest our emotional capital into the club is hard to do because perception is reality and the process of kudos transference means we all feel diminished by such performances and perhaps slightly soiled by the last ten years. Rather than throw the baby out with the metaphorical bathwater though it's important to put some perspective around where we're at.* - Regardless what we think of the game plan or the list he inherited at the Swans from Eade or the merit of the premiership win - Roos arrival at Melbourne has managed to buy the club a state of grace in terms of rebuilding that his successor would not necessarily have had from the media or supporters. Whether another coach could have achieved more is both speculative and irrelevant. - The fact that the same issues are recurring at an unsuccessful club (old dogs, new tricks) and we point to clubs that have gone past us with successful cultures (Port and Saints -maybe not premierships, but sustained time at the top and minimal time at the bottom in the last ten years ) should not be surprising (Why aren't supporters comparing us to Essendon or Carlton?). Changing culture is both difficult and lengthy - we've started (again) to address the issue but we've still got a lot further to go regardless of how impatient we are as supporters. Did we really know what we were celebrating when Jordan McMahon kicked 'that' goal? (Anyone that thinks yelling and screaming at the players and talking tough will fix the issue, clearly hasn't a clue) - Irregardless of whether we think Roos is the right coach or not and regardless of win loss ratios the succession plan is already in place that will if nothing else ensure continuity in terms of the familiarity and processes with the list and the work that needs to be done. - Both our player development and our recruitment are now light years ahead of where we've come from and perhaps atm that's more perception than reality, but judging by comments on the benefit of playing first year players like Brayshaw, Hogan, Stretch, ANB, vandenBerg and Harmes compared to the whipping boys that DL consensus doesn't want to ever see in Melbourne colours again, most would concur. Hardly a surprise that when the first year players are drop off in the second half of the year - similar to last year - so does the team. *I don't think this makes me a Pollyanna, but clearly some supporters won't want to hear anything except fire and brimstone, plague and famine.

Did anyone see any improvement in five years under Barassi?

I hadn't seen that before - and maybe they did prioritise him, certainly there's not much to separate Shiel and Treloar in terms of performance. Whether a player is elite or not is subjective.

You should look up the Institute of Public Affairs. Abbott comes out and openly declares that we can't trust the courts to get it right in relation to National Security (in regards to citizenship) which by extension means that we can trust politicians. - Unbelievable for someone that has a law degree (where's the separation of powers here) - he's just parroting the master I guess. Howard knew he was on a political winner with National Security because the best health and education policies in the world won't get you votes -fear gets you votes - so now Labor have to fall into line or face a similar dilemma.

You are a better man than me Gunga Din. I've done the drive far too many times, flying when you factor in both cost and time for me is a far better option now ( and while its all dual carriageway now, the Hume highway at night with all those B doubles is a frightening prospect). Mind you if time wasn't an issue I'd take a couple of days to drive back and stop off at Beechworth on the way home just to go to the bakery...Mmmm pastry!

Agree, Treloar has given no indication that he's not happy at GWS, but clearly he's going to get more money from a Victorian club and GWS's priorities were to resign Shiel, Congilio and Hoskin-Elliott and offer something up to get their two academy players so you do wonder whether the sort of money/terms that's been touted is slightly above the odds. He's had a very good year at the Giants though, very consistent, but like Chaser has pointed out its his defensive running and probably lack of X factor means he'll be a very good midfielder, but probably not elite. You can't trade for everyone so you have to prioritise. We need another contested ball winner and speedy, goal kicking outside midfielder with X factor. So looking at whose available according to the rumour mill, I'd be chasing Prestia ahead of Treloar and gunning for Motlop as well.

Back in the day when they televised the twos on tele in the Army Reserve cup Melbourne featured quite regularly and we had a good young up and coming team featuring the likes of Newport, Yeates, and the Fidges. John couldn't quite crack it in the seniors and when the Bears kicked off he headed north, but i remember John with that big barrel chest playing at CHF in our reserve premiership against the Blues- where if memory serves me correctly he was actually knocked out. After AFL he went to the SANFL and had a successful career there. EDIT: He used to wear number 44 - surprising what you can remember after all these years.

It was John who played for the Bears not Ted. I'll always remember Ted's last game for Melbourne in 88. 'Pants' Millane deliberately trod on Teddy's hand and Teddy went whack and KO'd him and we ran away with the game. Millane stayed on the bench for the rest of the game seeing stars. Cost Ted 6 weeks, but was beautiful to watch

How much better does our side look without Watson? Marsh is a better bowling option and a more imposing batsman. (Watson LBW is just so predictable). It looks like they might try another slow/low deck for Edgbaston according to SKW and so may bring in a wrist spinner for Ali who is in the side more to stiffen up the tail than as a genuine spinning option. Once again winning the toss might decide the outcome of the match. Good to see Johnson in the wickets though - England are obviously very worried about his pace.

Unless of course he was talking about targeting 2016 FAs a la Dangerfield last year.

With the top end of the draft being loaded with talls and their need to replace Dixon, I'll take a wild stab in the dark and say our first pick. - although they would also need to replace Dion and Bennell who will be moved on as well. We'd need to throw in some loose change as well. I wonder what Rocket's opinion of Dawes was when he was at the pies?

Until about five weeks ago I would have agreed with most of that, but I can now see what Roos sees in Watts. There was never any doubt as to his footy 'smarts' and he has a Mark Waugh laconic style approach to the game, but his lack of intensity was so frustrating. In his last five weeks however, he has been very solid and its worth remembering he has only now played as many games of football as many of this years U18s will have when they get drafted. I now think he can actually reach that mythical potential many of us were envisaging when he was drafted. I'm torn with Col, the key question if he left like Chippa would we get something better in return- and I'm not convinced we would. I think many on here underestimate just how tough Col is - he doesn't shirk an issue and he has an essential component for key defenders - he's quick, not the best reader of the play, but like Tommy Mac he has seriously good wheels when he takes off. It think he deserves another contract unless we were going to get another 1st round pick as compo...highly unlikely. I think most agree that Howe is gone and I'd put both Dawes and Toumpas on the table as well as Grimes (pains me to say it, but such is football). Tommy Mac and Frost have the speed, height and athleticism (Dawes has height - negated by his physical inability to get two feet off the ground at the same time and endurance - but that's it) to play both forward and back (but both need a couple of summers kicking at goal) to give us the flexibility.

Agree with pretty much everything you've written BB, but just two observations (and again I put a 48 hour moratorium on visiting DL after the loss), I wonder if there's any consideration to playing the Darwin match leading into the bye rather than the week after - certainly we seemed a little fresher this year compared to previous years, but I still think it would be the optimal time to play that game if we have to. Secondly there was an air of inevitability about the result - not so much deja vu, as symptomatic of continuing problems of our culture/list. Essendon are truly shite at the minute and we played ourselves out of the game - mentally we just aren't switched on for long enough.

Well the market will dictate, but that sounds about right in terms of picks, but knowing Roos it will more likely be another player.

Curnow? Been injured, but definitely has the size.

Toump probably won't influence the end result and will play to maximise his trade value at the end of the year. It wasn't a mistake to draft him, but it will be to keep him while he still has some value. I agree that Brayshaw will be rested. VanDENBERG straight back in would be a big call, but if it's wet I can see Reilly and Mitchie/Newton being called in to give us more grunt around the stoppages.