grazman

Won't get to the point of Leaver going to the draft. Both clubs are actually pretty close now in terms of what they want and what's being offered. The passage of time will bring them closer tohether The irony of the situation is the comparison with Scotty Thompson. We drated him with pock 16 and thtee years later when he was homesick we got pick 12, which many of us thought eas unders considering where his talent was taking him. Adelaide used pick 14 for lLeaver, but three years later no way is pick 10 on its own enough.

No change. He's already made his decision and its unlikely to change based on the weighting of winning or losing a premiership. He's made a professional decision, based on a number of factors one of which will be increased remuneration over what he's paid at Adelaide. You aren't a footballer forever and he will make hay whilst the sun is shining.

May not have come from us though.

Garland provides depth while Joel Smith, who is a good size and can jump, develops.

It would be indeed, but if I'm the Crows recruiting manager I'd ask us to go back and have another go. I think another first round pick is more valuable than ANB, and trading the likes of a Frost/Tyson/Watts would potentially get you that.

I thought it was his left hand he lacerated and they removed some of his hamstring tendon to repair the damage... but it was a while ago now and my memory has never been that reliable.

Ahhh - I see you've fallen for the player that is a spud against every other team, but played alright against Melbourne once in their career. See Tim O'Brien.

Couldn't believe it when he missed that shot, surprising as he is a really good kick. He did have a very bad corkie so I think that kick was a bit of an anomaly.

ditto

Makes the idea of Hawthorn trading Cyril for a couple of top 20 picks (as has been suggested) to get back into the first round a bit silly then.

Not really an oversight if he thought Petracca would go number 1. What's apparent is the club rated McCartin in the top 3 talents for that draft. What Jason Taylor's order would have been is speculative.

not sure if he was rested in the last, but suspect he was as when he's on the field he's where the ball is at. Goes alright does Clarrie - Essendon can keep Parish, I like this guy.

While I know you're tongue is in you cheek Red, sadly it's there because the AFL are unlikely to do what the NRL and IOC do when it comes to cheating and that is take away the rewards for those that are exposed as breaking the rules.

Excellent recall Tim!

When was the last time we beat the reigning premiers? Was it in 1988 when we beat Carlton in the PF?

I must have missed something here... Dunn on his day* is an adequate defender, but he isn't the second coming of Anthony Ingerson that some are alluding to. He could just has easily been delisted at the same time as his fellow draftee Matthew Bate was and no one on DL would have batted an eyelid. He redeemed himself by playing his first really consistent season of football the next year and since then has failed to inspire the FD so much so that he's been dropped from the leadership group and can't get a game ahead of inexperienced defenders such as O Mac and Frost. There are also some giant leaps of faith in thinking his inclusion will stop us from being scored against - it didn't against the Saints where he was clearly one of the worst offenders in non adherence to team structures. He's probably disappointed not to be getting a senior game, but the FD would be more so. If you're going to poke the bear you'd want to have some good wheels and a bloody long stick. * They say every dog has his day, Dunn's was in 2014 when he finished 4th in the B&F, - just like Nathan Carroll and Matthew Warnock.

Yeah, nah, a short lived rule to try and prevent Matthew Lloyd from diving - don't think it worked from memory.

Has a Joel Selwood poster on his wall at home.

Sorry my bad, both would have been very handy on our list, but neither would have been what Danners had in mind. With the benefit of hindsight it is easy for us to criticise the coach for interfering, but specifying a type isn't the same as picking a name, and whatever else you can say about the process, Danners was acutely aware of the weakness inherent in our list at the time. I would think that many other coaches have done the same thing, but probably none had the misfortune of having that pick suffer as badly from injury as Luke Molan.

Dal Santo. IIRC Daniher didn't specify Molan, rather he asked CC to draft the 'toughest' kid in the draft, which CC assessed to be Molan.

LOL -The same response I get from my colleagues when I start talking footy to them. The crux of the argument is when you look at Roos' trading history players like Jolly, Richards, Shaw and McGlynn at the time were never perceived to be as good as they turned out to be. Mumford and JPK maybe were, but weren't considered big fish. Only Davis was (but there were issues and he basically walked out on the Pies) Of the others not a lot was given up and not a lot lost by their trading. Roos is in an unusual situation at Melbourne where we need to turn over and trade out significantly more than he ever had to at the Swans. For those waiting to land the big fish... like most fishing stories it will probably be the case of the one that got away "just as I was about to reel him in...". These deals are much harder to complete and can end badly (See Swans trading history post Roos for evidence)

If the proposed deals come about in essence we gain Jake Melksham, Essendon's third round pick (currently 40) and Ben Kennedy for the loss of Jimmy Toumpas and our second pick (currently pick 24). There's no real feeling on what we might get for Howe. I know many are feeling underwhelmed at the prospect of picking up either of the two players mentioned, but this is Paul Roos recruiting 101. During his time at Sydney Roos continually traded out mid-range picks for the under-rated, unappreciated talent from other clubs. I doubt that he did this on his own (unless he has some supernatural prescient powers or crystal ball in his locker), its far more likely this was a result of the FD sitting down and addressing list needs with what they could get to develop the list (see below for a potted history). Goodwin apparently rates Melksham and Taylor apparently rates Kennedy so I dare say that Roos is happy to back his team in if that's their view. The net result is we downgrade a pick in a weakish draft by 16 spots (maybe we miss a player we were targetting for, or maybe we end up with the same player anyway) and a player that isn't currently and may never be in our best 22 for two players we think will be. This is more than we collectively paid for Mitchie (pick 54), Riley (delisted) and Newton (delisted). Given that it's the same people in the FD I think it's also reasonable to assume the expectations would be for a greater output from both compared to the previous trio given we're prepared to play slightly more. Sam Frost is another classic example where we gained a player and two picks (ANB-40 and O Mac-53) for a second round pick (23 Patrick Mckenna GWS who may yet go on to be a brownlow medallist along with Josh Kelly). Lumumba for Clark was more a like for like swap (player who needed to move) rather than a typical Roos trading pattern. So Roos' trading history in brief: Started coaching mid 2002 (replaced Eade) to the end of 2010. 2002 traded in Nick Davis for pick 21 (Bo Nixon) Nixon went on to play 4 games (3 for the Pies and 1 for Hawthorn) while Nick Davis was a premiership hero (without him they arguably wouldnt have made the GF) for the Swans, played 97 games. Win/Lose deal. 2003 traded out Scott Stevens to Adelaide (119 games) for picks 29 Tim Schmidt (17 games) and pick 45 Amon Buchanan (116 games) was a premiership player. Win/Win deal. 2004 traded in Darren Jolly for Pick 15 (Lynden Dunn - 161 games) we made out like bandits and Jolly (118 games) was instrumental in Roos game plan that won them a premiership the following year. Win/Win deal. 2005 traded in Ted Richards (220 games) for picks 19 + 50 (Courtney Dempsey - 119 games and Sam Lonergan 79 games). Essendon got two handy but inconsistent players and Sydney got the cornerstone of their defence for the next decade. Win/Lose deal. 2006 traded in Peter Everitt for Pick 33 (Jarryd Morton). Morton played 22 games for Hawthorn (including probably his best against Melbourne) and Everitt another 39 for the Swans including finals- filled a need for the Swans. Lose/Lose deal. 2007 traded in Henry Playfair for pick 44 (Scott Simpson) Playfair only managed 16 games for the Swans before injury ended his career, Simpson didnt play a game for the Cats.Lose/Lose deal. 2008 traded in Rhys Shaw for pick 46 (Luke Rounds) Shaw played 143 games for the Swans and Rounds played 6 for the Pies. Win/Lose deal. 2009 The biggest trading period at his time at the club. Traded in Mark Seaby 18 games and pick 55 (Trent Dennis-Lane 19 games) for picks 22 (Gorrick Weedon 1 game for the Eagles) and pick 118 (not used); Lose/Lose traded in Mumford for pick 28 (Mitch Duncan 111 games and counting), Win/Win also traded in JPK and McGlynn for Amon Buchanan pick 46 (Ben Stratton 92 games) and pick 70 (Rookie upgrade) Win/Lose. The motherlode of trading. Overall as a package if the Swans hadn't had to cash in Mumford for TPP room for Tippet/Buddy this would be arguably one of the best trade periods by any club in terms of adding ready to go players even with Seaby as a bust. 2010 was Roos last year at the Swans, Longmire had pretty much taken over and was calling the shots on their list. This was the first time in Roos time at the club that they were inactive at the trade table. Roos' Win/Lose deals established his reputation, but there were some win/win and lose/lose trades in that bunch, but the end result is that rarely, if ever, (although these are very much subjective assessments) were the Swans on the wrong side of the ledger. My rather long winded and elaborated point is Roos has runs on the board, I'll trust in his track record.

The four year deal is the carrot needed for him to change clubs... the rest is just a subjective assessment of how we rate the player.

or PTSD - negligence in regard to their duty of care.

Interesting watching the Brownlow coverage last night. They interviewed a bunch of people including Nat Fyfe's neighbour growing up - Cale Morton. What stood out is that they singled out Fyfe's competitiveness. Morton was the more highly touted junior, but arguably Fyfe was the kid prepared to crawl over broken glass to taste success. Fyfe has a Brownlow and Morton is no longer on an AFL list. I think the club is now onto this.