Demonland

If your mate is going then we'd love a photo of the great man.

It's legit - http://anzcham.com/anz_events/afl-grand-final-manila-2017/

Should the Dees be taking a serious look at any of these guys? 2017's remaining free agents http://www.afl.com.au/news/2017-09-05/full-list-of-2017s-remaining-free-agents Adelaide Andy Otten Brisbane Lions Claye Beams Ryan Harwood Tom Rockliff Carlton Kade Simpson Simon White Collingwood Tyson Goldsack Lachlan Keeffe Ben Sinclair Josh Thomas Essendon Heath Hocking Ben Howlett Fremantle Hayden Ballantyne Zac Clarke Michael Johnson Nick Suban Geelong Josh Cowan Daniel Menzel Steven Motlop Hawthorn Taylor Duryea Melbourne Jake Spencer Jack Trengove North Melbourne Scott Thompson Port Adelaide Jackson Trengove West Coast Mark LeCras Eric Mackenzie

Thank you. It's nice to hear feedback. I think we'll do a show after the Trade and Draft Period. Depending on how busy the Dees are during the trade period we might even do a separate show for each. Then we'll be back sometime in the pre-season.

The defining act of the VFL qualifying final between the Casey Demons and Williamstown at Burbank Oval may well have been the toss of the coin before the start of the game. Point Gellibrand has a reputation for strong winds and when Seagull skipper Ben Jolley won the toss, he elected to kick against the end that looked to be favoured by a breeze that was likely to be tricky for a visiting team with limited local knowledge ... and so it turned out. The first goal of the game went to Williamstown's Adam Marcon only a few minutes into the game and, for the next fifteen minutes, the visitors were all at sea as the Seagulls dominated the ruck duels and defended brilliantly into the cross breeze that barely favoured the Demons. The Casey boys eventually broke through for a goal to Tom Bugg to briefly take the lead by the narrowest of margins but they were set back by the ears with two quick goals from the opposition. A chain of handballs ending with a goal to Ed Morris left them five points down at the first break but they were clearly in trouble as the wind was stiffening to the advantage of Williamstown's end by the start of the second term. To make matters worse for the Demons, James Munro was off the ground with a back injury and was not destined to reappear. Munro has produced some great stopping efforts in past games and his presence would have been handy against the likes of former St Kilda listed players in Sippos and Dunnell who kicked ended up scoring nine goals between them for the day. A determined Williamstown was into overdrive from the start of the second term. Its players attacked the ball, kicked long and scored seven unanswered goals in the span of twenty minutes to have Casey reeling and in arrears by 49 points To their credit, the Demons lifted late in the term to dig in and kick two goals from Bayley Fritsch and Corey Maynard but they still looking decidedly sick as they faced a six goal deficit at half time. The Demons came out of the sheds after the break and with a howling wind at their backs, the goal kicking prowess of left footer Fritsch and Angus Scott and the strong play of Angus Brayshaw and Corey Maynard allowed them to peg the lead back to a solitary point at the end of the third quarter. Things got even better when Scott's snap early in the last found its mark and the Demons had completed a magnificent turnaround with nine unanswered goals to take a five point lead. This raised visions of their recent come-from-behind win against a strong wind at Sandringham but this time, a dominant Williamstown ruckman in Meese and some goal kicking heroics from a couple of former Saints and some dubious decisions in the ruck allowed the home side take advantage of the conditions with another long string of unanswered goals that saw them into a preliminary final in a fortnight's time. The wiry Fritsch's performances throughout the season and particularly in recent weeks should have him high up in the thoughts of the AFL recruiters. Brayshaw and Billy Stretch were the best of the Demon listed players and were well backed up by Ben Kennedy, the ever-reliable Jack Trengove and defenders Declan Keilty (who also had a stint up forward) and Josh Wagner. Casey live to fight again in next week's semi final against Richmond to be played at Port Melbourne but will have to do better to remain in the premiership hunt. Peter Jackson VFL 2017 Casey Demons 2.2.14 4.3.27 10.6.66 11.7.73 Williamstown 3.1.19 10.3.63 10.7.67 18.10.118 Goals Casey Demons Fritsch 4 Scott 3 Bugg Kennedy Maynard Morris Williamstown Siposs 5 Dunell 4 Meese Schultz 2 Bewley Cavarra Cordy Marcon Masters Best Casey Demons Fritsch Brayshaw Keilty Maynard Stretch Scott Williamstown Siposs Schultz Meese Myers Dunell Currie Statistics Angus Brayshaw 19 kicks 17 handballs 36 disposals 4 marks 6 tackles 125 dream team points Tomas Bugg 1 goal 7 kicks 8 handballs 15 disposals 7 tackles 66 dream team points Liam Hulett 3 kicks 1 handballs 4 disposals 4 tackles 25 dream team points Dion Johnstone 1 behind 8 kicks 8 handballs 16 disposals 3 marks 3 tackles 59 dream team points Declan Keilty 5 kicks 4 handballs 9 disposals 3 marks 1 tackle 37 dream team points Ben Kennedy 1 goal 12 kicks 7 handballs 19 disposals 5 tackles 79 dream team points Jay Kennedy-Harris 6 kicks 8 handballs 14 disposals 4 marks 7 tackles 71 dream team points Mitch King 2 kicks 7 handballs 9 disposals 1 mark 3 tackles 18 hit outs 45 dream team points Corey Maynard 1 goal 13 kicks 10 handballs 23 disposals 3 marks 8 tackles 104 dream team points Jake Spencer 2 kicks 4 handballs 6 disposals 1 mark 4 tackles 28 hit outs 56 dream team points Billy Stretch 18 kicks 11handballs 29 disposals 4 marks 4 tackles 105 dream team points Jack Trengove 9 kicks 2 handballs 11 disposals 5 marks 3 tackles 58 dream team points Josh Wagner 11 kicks 12 handballs 23 disposals 3 marks 7 tackles 89 dream team points Sam Weideman 1 behind 2 kicks 4 handballs 6 disposals 3 marks 1 tackles 28 dream team points The Development League team overcame a spirited Port Melbourne to win its semi final and will play off in the competition's last grand final in a fortnight's time.. AFL Vic Development League 2017 Casey Demons 2.2.14 4.6.30 5.11.41 9.14.68 Port Melbourne 1.2.8 3.5.23 4.8.32 5.13.43 Goals Casey Demons Vander Haar 3 Gardiner 2 Baker Cottee Cox Freeman Port Melbourne Wooffindin 2 Gleeson Hogan Michael Best Casey Demons Dwyer Dam Johnston Gordon Byers Vander Haar Cox Port Melbourne Gordon Waddell Wooffindin Iaccarino Cunningham Dove

ARGUING THE TOSS by KC from Casey The defining act of the VFL qualifying final between the Casey Demons and Williamstown at Burbank Oval may well have been the toss of the coin before the start of the game. Point Gellibrand has a reputation for strong winds and when Seagull skipper Ben Jolley won the toss, he elected to kick against the end that looked to be favoured by a breeze that was likely to be tricky for a visiting team with limited local knowledge ... and so it turned out. The first goal of the game went to Williamstown's Adam Marcon only a few minutes into the game and, for the next fifteen minutes, the visitors were all at sea as the Seagulls dominated the ruck duels and defended brilliantly into the cross breeze that barely favoured the Demons. The Casey boys eventually broke through for a goal to Tom Bugg to briefly take the lead by the narrowest of margins but they were set back by the ears with two quick goals from the opposition. A chain of handballs ending with a goal to Ed Morris left them five points down at the first break but they were clearly in trouble as the wind was stiffening to the advantage of Williamstown's end by the start of the second term. To make matters worse for the Demons, James Munro was off the ground with a back injury and was not destined to reappear. Munro has produced some great stopping efforts in past games and his presence would have been handy against the likes of former St Kilda listed players in Sippos and Dunnell who kicked ended up scoring nine goals between them for the day. A determined Williamstown was into overdrive from the start of the second term. Its players attacked the ball, kicked long and scored seven unanswered goals in the span of twenty minutes to have Casey reeling and in arrears by 49 points To their credit, the Demons lifted late in the term to dig in and kick two goals from Bayley Fritsch and Corey Maynard but they still looking decidedly sick as they faced a six goal deficit at half time. The Demons came out of the sheds after the break and with a howling wind at their backs, the goal kicking prowess of left footer Fritsch and Angus Scott and the strong play of Angus Brayshaw and Corey Maynard allowed them to peg the lead back to a solitary point at the end of the third quarter. Things got even better when Scott's snap early in the last found its mark and the Demons had completed a magnificent turnaround with nine unanswered goals to take a five point lead. This raised visions of their recent come-from-behind win against a strong wind at Sandringham but this time, a dominant Williamstown ruckman in Meese and some goal kicking heroics from a couple of former Saints and some dubious decisions in the ruck allowed the home side take advantage of the conditions with another long string of unanswered goals that saw them into a preliminary final in a fortnight's time. The wiry Fritsch's performances throughout the season and particularly in recent weeks should have him high up in the thoughts of the AFL recruiters. Brayshaw and Billy Stretch were the best of the Demon listed players and were well backed up by Ben Kennedy, the ever-reliable Jack Trengove and defenders Declan Keilty (who also had a stint up forward) and Josh Wagner. Casey live to fight again in next week's semi final against Richmond to be played at Port Melbourne but will have to do better to remain in the premiership hunt. Peter Jackson VFL 2017 Casey Demons 2.2.14 4.3.27 10.6.66 11.7.73 Williamstown 3.1.19 10.3.63 10.7.67 18.10.118 Goals Casey Demons Fritsch 4 Scott 3 Bugg Kennedy Maynard Morris Williamstown Siposs 5 Dunell 4 Meese Schultz 2 Bewley Cavarra Cordy Marcon Masters Best Casey Demons Fritsch Brayshaw Keilty Maynard Stretch Scott Williamstown Siposs Schultz Meese Myers Dunell Currie Statistics Angus Brayshaw 19 kicks 17 handballs 36 disposals 4 marks 6 tackles 125 dream team points Tomas Bugg 1 goal 7 kicks 8 handballs 15 disposals 7 tackles 66 dream team points Liam Hulett 3 kicks 1 handballs 4 disposals 4 tackles 25 dream team points Dion Johnstone 1 behind 8 kicks 8 handballs 16 disposals 3 marks 3 tackles 59 dream team points Declan Keilty 5 kicks 4 handballs 9 disposals 3 marks 1 tackle 37 dream team points Ben Kennedy 1 goal 12 kicks 7 handballs 19 disposals 5 tackles 79 dream team points Jay Kennedy-Harris 6 kicks 8 handballs 14 disposals 4 marks 7 tackles 71 dream team points Mitch King 2 kicks 7 handballs 9 disposals 1 mark 3 tackles 18 hit outs 45 dream team points Corey Maynard 1 goal 13 kicks 10 handballs 23 disposals 3 marks 8 tackles 104 dream team points Jake Spencer 2 kicks 4 handballs 6 disposals 1 mark 4 tackles 28 hit outs 56 dream team points Billy Stretch 18 kicks 11handballs 29 disposals 4 marks 4 tackles 105 dream team points Jack Trengove 9 kicks 2 handballs 11 disposals 5 marks 3 tackles 58 dream team points Josh Wagner 11 kicks 12 handballs 23 disposals 3 marks 7 tackles 89 dream team points Sam Weideman 1 behind 2 kicks 4 handballs 6 disposals 3 marks 1 tackles 28 dream team points The Development League team overcame a spirited Port Melbourne to win its semi final and will play off in the competition's last grand final in a fortnight's time.. AFL Vic Development League 2017 Casey Demons 2.2.14 4.6.30 5.11.41 9.14.68 Port Melbourne 1.2.8 3.5.23 4.8.32 5.13.43 Goals Casey Demons Vander Haar 3 Gardiner 2 Baker Cottee Cox Freeman Port Melbourne Wooffindin 2 Gleeson Hogan Michael Best Casey Demons Dwyer Dam Johnston Gordon Byers Vander Haar Cox Port Melbourne Gordon Waddell Wooffindin Iaccarino Cunningham Dove

INDICATIVE DRAFT ORDER (after the home and away season) ROUND ONE 1. Brisbane Lions 2. Gold Coast 3. Carlton 4. North Melbourne 5. Fremantle 6. Collingwood 7. St Kilda (received from Hawthorn) 8. St Kilda 9. Western Bulldogs 10. Melbourne 11. West Coast 12. Essendon 13. Sydney 14. Brisbane Lions (received from Port Adelaide) 15. Richmond 16. Richmond (received from Geelong, via Carlton and GWS on-trades) 17. Adelaide ROUND TWO 18. Brisbane Lions 19. Gold Coast 20. Geelong (received from Carlton) 21. North Melbourne 22. Gold Coast (received from Fremantle) 23. Greater Western Sydney (received from Collingwood) 24. Gold Coast (received from Hawthorn) 25. Greater Western Sydney (received from St Kilda) 26. Western Bulldogs 27. Melbourne 28. West Coast 29. Essendon 30. Sydney 31. Port Adelaide 32. Hawthorn (received from GWS, via Carlton on-trade) 33. Gold Coast (received from Richmond) 34. Geelong 35. Adelaide ROUND THREE 36. Collingwood (received from the Brisbane Lions) 37. Gold Coast 38. Carlton 39. Western Bulldogs (received from North Melbourne) 40. Fremantle 41. Brisbane Lions (received from Collingwood) 42. Hawthorn 43. St Kilda 44. North Melbourne (received from Western Bulldogs) 45. Melbourne 46. West Coast 47. Essendon 48. Sydney 49. Port Adelaide 50. Richmond (received from Greater Western Sydney) 51. Richmond 52. Geelong 53. Adelaide ROUND FOUR 54. Collingwood (received from the Brisbane Lions) 55. Fremantle (received from Gold Coast) 56. Carlton 57. St Kilda (received from North Melbourne, via Western Bulldogs on-trade) 58. Fremantle 59. Collingwood 60. Hawthorn 61. St Kilda 62. North Melbourne (received from Western Bulldogs) 63. Greater Western Sydney* (original pick No.15 slides down after 1000-point penalty) 64. Melbourne 65. West Coast 66. Essendon 67. Sydney 68. Port Adelaide 69. Greater Western Sydney 70. Richmond 71. Geelong 72. Adelaide * The Giants will lose their first pick as a result of the 1000-point penalty placed on them due to the Lachie Whitfield affair. PICKS ACQUIRED FROM LAST TRADE AND DRAFT PERIOD Future Picks (2017 AFL National Draft) St Kilda has Hawks' 1st round pick Carlton has Geelong's 1st round pick Brisbane has Port Adelaide's 1st round pick GWS has St Kilda's 2nd round pick Gold Coast has Richmond's 2nd round pick Geelong has Carlton's 2nd round pick

These are the indicative dates for trades, drafts and free agency for 2017. Tuesday October 3 – Friday October 6 – NAB AFL Draft Combine Friday October 6 - NAB AFL restricted free agency offer and unrestricted free agency period begins Monday October 9, 9am* - NAB AFL Trade Period begins Saturday October 14 - South Australian Draft Combine Sunday October 15, 5pm - Close of NAB AFL restricted free agency offer and unrestricted free agency period Sunday October 15 - West Australian Draft Combine Wednesday October 18 - NAB AFL restricted free agency matching offer three-day period ends Thursday October 19, 2pm – NAB AFL Trade Period closes Wednesday November 1 - NAB AFL delisted player free agency period (1) begins Wednesday November 8 - NAB AFL delisted player free agency period (1) closes Friday November 10 - NAB AFL delisted player free agency period (2) begins Friday November 17, 5pm - NAB AFL delisted player free agency period (2) closes Friday November 24, 5pm - NAB AFL National Draft (Sydney) Saturday November 25 - NAB AFL delisted player free agency period (3) begins Sunday November 26, 2pm - NAB AFL delisted player free agency period (3) closes Monday November 27, 5pm - NAB AFL Pre-season and Rookie Drafts Wednesday November 29, 2pm - Final AFL club list lodgement * All times AEDT unless indicated

By popular demand the 2017 TRADE AND DRAFT LEVERAGE BOARD is here. Some threads relating to trades, drafts etc will be moved from this board to the 2017 TADLB

Please feel free to alert us about any additions to be made to the OP. Any additions must be capable of independent verification.

ADELAIDE In: Bryce Gibbs (Carlton) Sam Gibson (North Melbourne) Out: Jonathon Beech (delisted) Charlie Cameron (Brisbane) Cam Ellis-Yolmen (delisted) Dean Gore (delisted) Jake Lever (Melbourne) Troy Menzel (delisted) Sam Shaw (retired) Scott Thompson (retired) Harrison Wigg (GC Suns) Draft picks: 12 39 77 109 BRISBANE LIONS In: Charlie Cameron (Adelaide) Luke Hodge (Hawthorn) Out: Claye Beams (delisted) Michael Close (delisted) Josh Clayton (delisted) Jonathan Freeman (delisted) Blake Grewar (delisted) Matthew Hammelmann (delisted) Cian Hanley (delisted) Ryan Harwood (delisted) Jared Jansen (delisted) Tom Rockliff (Port Adelaide) Josh Schache (Western Bulldogs) Reuben William (delisted) Draft picks: 1 15 18 40 44 52 93 CARLTON In: Matthew Kennedy (GWS Giants) Darcy Lang (Geelong) Matthew Lobbe (Port Adelaide) Aaron Mullett (North Melbourne) Out: Denis Armfield (retired) Blaine Boekhorst (delisted) Dylan Buckley (delisted) Andrew Gallucci (delisted) Bryce Gibbs (Adelaide) Daniel Gorringe (retired) Kristian Jaksch (delisted) Matthew Korcheck (retired) Rhys Palmer (retired) Ciaran Sheehan (delisted) Billie Smedts (delisted) Liam Sumner (delisted) Simon White (delisted) Draft picks: 3 10 30 73 COLLINGWOOD In: Sam Murray (Sydney) Out: Lachie Keeffe (GWS Giants) Mitch McCarthy (delisted) Liam Mackie (delisted) Adam Oxley (delisted) Jackson Ramsay (delisted) Henry Schade (delisted) Ben Sinclair (retired) Jesse White (retired) Draft picks: 6 38 56 61 70 80 98 ESSENDON In: Luke Lavender (CatB rookie) Adam Saad (GC Suns) Devon Smith (GWS Giants) Jake Stringer (Western Bulldogs) Out: Craig Bird (delisted) Yestin Eades (retired) Heath Hocking (delisted) Ben Howlett (delisted) James Kelly (retired) Alex Morgan (North Melbourne) Brent Stanton (retired) Jobe Watson (retired) Draft picks: 48 67 85 103 FREMANTLE In: Brandon Matera (Gold Coast) Nathan Wilson (GWS Giants) Out: Harley Balic (Melbourne) Zac Clarke (delisted) Sam Collins (delisted) Hayden Crozier (Western Bulldogs) Zac Dawson (retired) Josh Deluca (delisted) Jon Griffin (delisted) Garrick Ibbotson (retired) Nick Suban (delisted) Matthew Uebergang (delisted) Lachie Weller (GC Suns) Shane Yarran (retired) Draft picks: 2 5 42 60 66 71 79 83 97 GEELONG In: Garry Ablett (GC Suns) Out: Josh Cowan (delisted) Matthew Hayball (delisted) Tom Lonergan (retired) Darcy Lang (Carlton) Andrew Mackie (retired) Steven Motlop (Port Adelaide) Tom Ruggles (delisted) Draft picks: 22 24 35 58 72 90 108 GOLD COAST SUNS In: Harrison Wigg (Adelaide) Lachie Weller (Fremantle) Aaron Young (Port Adelaide) Out: Garry Ablett (Geelong) Keegan Brooksby (delisted) Daniel Currie (delisted) Ryan Davis (delisted) Jarrad Grant (delisted) Mitch Hallahan (delisted) Cameron Loersch (delisted) Trent McKenzie (Port Adelaide) Brandon Matera (Fremantle) Adam Saad (Essendon) Matt Shaw (delisted) Mackenzie Willis (delisted) Draft picks: 19 41 50 54 76 94 GREATER WESTERN SYDNEY In: Lachie Keefe (Collingwood) Out: Tom Downie (retired) Steve Johnson (retired) Matthew Kennedy (Carlton) Tendai Mzungu (retired) Joel Patfull (retired) Devon Smith (Essendon) Nathan Wilson (Fremantle) Draft picks: 11 27 28 57 65 89 107 HAWTHORN In: Jarman Impey (Port Adelaide) Out: Josh Gibson (retired) Billy Hartung (delisted) Luke Hodge (Brisbane) Jack Fitzpatrick (retired) Kade Stewart (delisted) Luke Surman (retired) Ty Vickery (retired) Dallas Willsmore (delisted) Draft picks: 43 68 75 81 99 MELBOURNE In: Harley Balic (Fremantle) Jake Lever (Adelaide) Out: Liam Hulett (delisted) Colin Garland (retired) Ben Kennedy (delisted) Heritier Lumumba (retired) Jake Spencer (delisted) Jack Trengove (Port Adelaide) Jack Watts (Port Adelaide) Mitch White (delisted) Draft picks: 27 31 36 47 84 102 NORTH MELBOURNE In: Alex Morgan (Essendon) Out: Will Fordham (delisted) Sam Gibson (Adelaide) Lachie Hansen (delisted) Aaron Mullett (Carlton) Andrew Swallow (retired) Matt Taylor (delisted) Lindsay Thomas (delisted) Corey Wagner (delisted) Draft picks: 4 23 64 78 91 96 PORT ADELAIDE In: Trent McKenzie (GC Suns) Steven Motlop (Geelong) Tom Rockliff (Brisbane) Jack Trengove (Melbourne) Jack Watts (Melbourne) Out: Brendon Ah Chee (West Coast Eagles) Logan Austin (St Kilda) Brett Eddy (delisted) Jarman Impey (Hawthorn) Nathan Krakouer (retired) Matthew Lobbe (Carlton) Angus Monfries (retired) Jesse Palmer (delisted) Jackson Trengove (Western Bulldogs) Aaron Young (GC Suns) Matthew White (delisted) Draft picks: 46 49 59 62 63 86 95 104 RICHMOND In: Out: Jake Batchelor (delisted) Todd Elton (delisted) Taylor Hunt (delisted) Ben Lennon (delisted) Steven Morris (delisted) Ivan Maric (retired) Chris Yarran (retired) Draft picks: 17 20 25 53 55 74 92 110 ST KILDA In: Logan Austin (Port Adelaide) Out: Joe Baker-Thomas (delisted) Nick Coughlan (delisted) Sean Dempster (retired) Jason Holmes (delisted) Leigh Montagna (retired) Lewis Pierce (delisted) Nick Riewoldt (retired) Draft picks: 7 8 34 45 100 SYDNEY SWANS In: Out: Shaun Edwards (retired) Brandon Jack (delisted) Jeremy Laidler (retired) Tyrone Leonardis (delisted) Sam Murray (Collingwood) Michael Talia (delisted) Draft picks: 14 33 51 88 106 WEST COAST In: Brendon Ah Chee (Port Adelaide) Out: Paddy Brophy (retired) Sam Butler (retired) Jonathan Giles (retired) Tom Gorter (delisted) Josh Hill (delisted) Tom Lamb (delisted) Sam Mitchell (retired) Drew Petrie (retired) Matthew Priddis (retired) Jordan Snadden (delisted) Simon Tunbridge (delisted) Sharrod Wellingham (delisted) Draft picks: 13 21 26 32 37 69 87 105 WESTERN BULLDOGS In: Hayden Crozier (Fremantle) Josh Schache (Brisbane) Jackson Trengove (Port Adelaide) Out: Matthew Boyd (retired) Travis Cloke (retired) Stewart Crameri (delisted) Declan Hamilton (delisted) Bob Murphy (retired) Josh Prudden (delisted) Roarke Smith (delisted) Jake Stringer (Essendon) Tristan Tweedie (delisted) Draft picks: 9 16 82 101

My wife hid the finals pamphlet from me. Apparently she thinks I wouldn't have been able to handle seeing it and don't have access to any forms of social media or run a demons website where I would have found out about it anyway.

Use the report button and one of our friendly staff will help you out.

Whispering Jack is usually in charge of that. I think he's still trying to come up with a clever name for it. We're in the process of trying to recall our premature creation of a finals board that was created for our members. Too soon?

Welcome to Demonland.

You can download and subscribe to the Demonland Podcast on iTunes here: https://itunes.apple.com/au/podcast/demonland-podcast/id1220844996?mt=2 You can search Demonland Podcast on any other Podcast catching apps on iOs or Android devices.

Indeed. The chat room is now open. http://demonland.com/Podcast We're live at 8:30pm

I'm in the same boat. Please do call. We love hearing from other Demonlanders.

We'll be LIVE in 1 hour @ 8:30pm Listen and Chat LIVE: http://demonland.com/podcast Call: 03 9016 3666 Skype: Demonland31

To be fair, if we'd made the finals and people got these late they'd be screaming blue bloody murder. Having said that did these arrive late? Also it is an embarrassing [censored] up.

Premature deejaculation is the phrase I've coined.

Cheaper than a shrink.

Call in. It'll be cathartic to vent.

We welcome all Demonlanders to call in. Call: 03 9016 3666 Skype: Demonland31