because it keeps the tax payers employed, so they can keep paying taxes instead of collecting their residuals.

the unsustainable has nothing to do with health & safety.

the unsustainable is the floating dollar in a world of in equal tariffs & subsidies. & peasant wages.

here is an example, econmic pyramid

destroying our manufacturing industry will leave us thus; an island in peril

Unions destroyed our manufacturing industries years ago.

You're too late.

where did you get that picture of tassie d-l? very cool

Judith Sloan on SPC Ardmona:

So who is telling lies? Shadow Industry Minister, Kim Carr, and local Liberal MP Sharmon Stone are a tag-team when it comes to accusing the Prime Minister of uttering porkies about the excessive workers’ conditions and restrictive practices. The trouble is that the evidence is there for everyone to read.

The SPC Ardmona EBA does provide for wages which are 40 per cent above the award; does contain superannuation contributions of 11.5 per cent (above the norm of 9.25 per cent); does allow for some cashing out of sick leave; does provide excessive redundancy payouts for the majority of workers; does provide for a day of leave to attend the Food Preservers’ Picnic and numerous RDOs; and the list goes on. And if the various allowances are so trivial, they should have been cashed out and eliminated years ago.

where did you get that picture of tassie d-l? very cool

but its No' a map o' Tassie, its Von Deemons Land.

in the Sea of Hell

Judith Sloan on SPC Ardmona:

So who is telling lies? Shadow Industry Minister, Kim Carr, and local Liberal MP Sharmon Stone are a tag-team when it comes to accusing the Prime Minister of uttering porkies about the excessive workers’ conditions and restrictive practices. The trouble is that the evidence is there for everyone to read.

The SPC Ardmona EBA does provide for wages which are 40 per cent above the award; does contain superannuation contributions of 11.5 per cent (above the norm of 9.25 per cent); does allow for some cashing out of sick leave; does provide excessive redundancy payouts for the majority of workers; does provide for a day of leave to attend the Food Preservers’ Picnic and numerous RDOs; and the list goes on. And if the various allowances are so trivial, they should have been cashed out and eliminated years ago.

Hannibal I will go with what SPCmanagement has put on the record, thanks. Sloane has zero credibility, she just follows company orders. But really what the SPC workers are earning is a furphy. The real problem is the high dollar, the EU dumping canned fruit here at below cost and of course a plant badly in need of modernisation.

In the absence of facts you decide to make it up?

There was a story by one witness, reported on the radio, who said the Navy did nothing, but let's pretend and besmirch them anyway.

Morrison himself under questioning on this issue said there was capsicum spray used to subdue some people after the boarding. It was thought then some refugees may have fallen on the engine exhaust. That is the official OZ view. So yes some heavy handed action did occur it seems. In the end it is the vacuum of facts coming from our end that hands the political ground to your competitors.

Hannibal I will go with what SPCmanagement has put on the record, thanks. Sloane has zero credibility, she just follows company orders. But really what the SPC workers are earning is a furphy. The real problem is the high dollar, the EU dumping canned fruit here at below cost and of course a plant badly in need of modernisation.

and a culture that is rapidly putting down the locally produced items, for an imported preference.

we are literally selling out the farm.

Edited February 5, 201411 yr by dee-luded

and a culture that is rapidly putting down the locally produced items, for an imported preference.

we are literally selling out the farm.

We don't need farms DL

We can all eat from our imported produce.

Just try and avoid the human feces if you are eating something from China though.

Oh avoid any Japanese foods as there maybe high levels of radiation.

And Growth hormones in US Cows may not be a good idea.

But you may like a little Mad Cow for Europe with your next meal I am sure.

The Anti-Dumping Commission found in favour of SPC on Tuesday in regard to dumping of European fruit. Dumped Italian tomatoes (including those sold by Coles as part of their 'Down Down' campaign), for instance, have reduced SPC's market share from about 70% to 15% in the Australian market in the last six years.

Never mind that the Europeans subsidise their produce to the hilt, let's just go for cheap prices and dump an entire Australian industry employing thousands, because it's not 'viable' under these circumstances. All for the sake of $25 million. It's probably a quarter of the cost of some witch hunt Royal Commission, or about 300 rich women on parental leave.

Maybe the award wages for manufacturing process workers are a pittance.

The Anti-Dumping Commission found in favour of SPC on Tuesday in regard to dumping of European fruit. Dumped Italian tomatoes (including those sold by Coles as part of their 'Down Down' campaign), for instance, have reduced SPC's market share from about 70% to 15% in the Australian market in the last six years.

Never mind that the Europeans subsidise their produce to the hilt, let's just go for cheap prices and dump an entire Australian industry employing thousands, because it's not 'viable' under these circumstances. All for the sake of $25 million. It's probably a quarter of the cost of some witch hunt Royal Commission, or about 300 rich women on parental leave.

Maybe the award wages for manufacturing process workers are a pittance.

its time to start reintroducing tariffs on countries dumping or subsidising their exports to us.

free trade, what a laugh.

& the floating dollar when countries like chyna maintain a low dollar, to undermine the west.

Hannibal I will go with what SPCmanagement has put on the record, thanks. Sloane has zero credibility, she just follows company orders. But really what the SPC workers are earning is a furphy. The real problem is the high dollar, the EU dumping canned fruit here at below cost and of course a plant badly in need of modernisation.

You would.

In an SPC media release sent to all Coalition colleagues by Ms Stone yesterday, [sPC Ardmona] said the excessive redundancy payments had been trimmed back to 52 weeks in 2012. However, the Australian Manufacturing Workers Union has confirmed that almost all of the plant’s more than 400 or so employees were employed under a previous enterprise agreement that provided for redundancy of four weeks’ pay for every year of service, up to a maximum of 104 weeks.

Edited February 6, 201411 yr by Hannibal

But really what the SPC workers are earning is a furphy. The real problem is the high dollar, the EU dumping canned fruit here at below cost and of course a plant badly in need of modernisation.

There seems to be a fair amount of conjecture on payments and conditions. I agree with your second part about the dumping of imported produce being the major problem but would also not dismiss wages and union demands exacerbating the problem.

I work in the TCF industry and it was always going to be difficult for local manufacturers to compete with cheap Asian imports but the TCF unions here have not helped the cause by making totally unrealistic demands.

.. but the TCF unions here have not helped the cause by making totally unrealistic demands.

Really ? Who'd have thought ?

England used to lead the world in manufacturing until the unions excessive demands over the years finally ruined it.

Poor management also didn't help.

There seems to be a fair amount of conjecture on payments and conditions. I agree with your second part about the dumping of imported produce being the major problem but would also not dismiss wages and union demands exacerbating the problem.

I work in the TCF industry and it was always going to be difficult for local manufacturers to compete with cheap Asian imports but the TCF unions here have not helped the cause by making totally unrealistic demands.

A former client of mine manufactured Denim, I'm sure you'll know who, tried to modernise their factory to cope with the Asian market but they needed to reduce the size of their workforce to make them competitive. Most of their employees, they had somewhere near 1100, had been with the company for many years and the redundancy packages they faced meant they simply couldn't afford to put off the numbers needed to keep the business afloat.

They ultimately went in to Administration and the business was sold off, the workforce was reduced to about 200 initially then they ceased manufacturing and all staff are now gone. The new owners really didn't want the business they wanted the land to subdivide the 24 acres in to apartment s and units.

There were a lot of issues that caused the downfall of the business but redundancy packages were right up there with them.

The danger of Government Give Aways , sorry I mean Subsidies, is that they will focus on their own self interest and mates.

A former client of mine manufactured Denim, I'm sure you'll know who, tried to modernise their factory to cope with the Asian market but they needed to reduce the size of their workforce to make them competitive. Most of their employees, they had somewhere near 1100, had been with the company for many years and the redundancy packages they faced meant they simply couldn't afford to put off the numbers needed to keep the business afloat.

They ultimately went in to Administration and the business was sold off, the workforce was reduced to about 200 initially then they ceased manufacturing and all staff are now gone. The new owners really didn't want the business they wanted the land to subdivide the 24 acres in to apartment s and units.

There were a lot of issues that caused the downfall of the business but redundancy packages were right up there with them.

Up until recently ( in most cases) the decimation of the TCF industries was mostly due to years of tariffs/quotas/subsidies protecting local manufacturers from imports and local management not restructuring, modernising and taking advantage of new technologies. Union and Labor demands had little to do with it. In recent time the unions have helped in the final push of nearly all manufacturing overseas, not by excessive wage demands but by bureaucratic demands. Any company buying garments locally ( for example Just Jeans) are responsible for wages and conditions of all businesses all the way down the supply chain whether the purchasing company is dealing directly with those businesses or not. That means a company like Just Jeans is responsible ( and must report) for the businesses providing spinning/knitting/weaving/dying of fabrics, accessories and CMT of garments. Unworkable.

Edited February 6, 201411 yr by nutbean

The Abbott government is just itching for a wages and conditions fight. They want to restore the breadth of Work Choices without actually bringing back Work Choices by name. The bleating here about wages and conditions from the rightists is symptomatic.

An example is the SPC 'wet allowance'. In the refusal of the $25 million, Abbott described this as an example of 'exorbitant' conditions and above-award payments. The allowance was 58 cents a day, and covered employee's protective clothing for those on production lines who were getting wet or exposed to agricultural chemical residue from the washing of fruit. That's not unreasonable. SPC no longer pays the allowance because they supply protective clothing to the workers themselves.

Time we stopped the Work Choices war. Time we started working together for the future benefit of the country rather than creating continual conflict. I agree with Paul Howes.

Is there an example of a country that got richer by driving down worker's wages?

The Abbott government is just itching for a wages and conditions fight. They want to restore the breadth of Work Choices without actually bringing back Work Choices by name. The bleating here about wages and conditions from the rightists is symptomatic.

An example is the SPC 'wet allowance'. In the refusal of the $25 million, Abbott described this as an example of 'exorbitant' conditions and above-award payments. The allowance was 58 cents a day, and covered employee's protective clothing for those on production lines who were getting wet or exposed to agricultural chemical residue from the washing of fruit. That's not unreasonable. SPC no longer pays the allowance because they supply protective clothing to the workers themselves.

Time we stopped the Work Choices war. Time we started working together for the future benefit of the country rather than creating continual conflict. I agree with Paul Howes.

Is there an example of a country that got richer by driving down worker's wages?

58c a day ?

58c a day x 48 weeks = $139 a year for protective clothing that is worn the whole year. You wouldn't be able to buy decent commercial protective clothing for that let alone get it to last a year !! It is unreasonable ( unreasonably low).

it was quoted in the paper that it was 58 cents per hour (not per day)

this would be about $1000 per year, which doesn't seem unreasonable

also quoted that it wasn't paid last year (presumably because coy supplied wet gear?)

coy supplied, then that would seem the best solution anyway

Edited February 6, 201411 yr by daisycutter

it was quoted in the paper that it was 58 cents per hour (not per day)

this would be about $1000 per year, which doesn't seem unreasonable

also quoted that it wasn't paid last year (presumably because coy supplied wet gear?)

coy supplied, then that would seem the best solution anyway

Sorry DC but if its in the paper its must be wrong LOL

Sorry DC but if its in the paper its must be wrong LOL

but it was faifax df, never wrong - LOL

but it was faifax df, never wrong - LOL

I stand corrected then DC

Up until recently ( in most cases) the decimation of the TCF industries was mostly due to years of tariffs/quotas/subsidies protecting local manufacturers from imports and local management not restructuring, modernising and taking advantage of new technologies. Union and Labor demands had little to do with it. In recent time the unions have helped in the final push of nearly all manufacturing overseas, not by excessive wage demands but by bureaucratic demands. Any company buying garments locally ( for example Just Jeans) are responsible for wages and conditions of all businesses all the way down the supply chain whether the purchasing company is dealing directly with those businesses or not. That means a company like Just Jeans is responsible ( and must report) for the businesses providing spinning/knitting/weaving/dying of fabrics, accessories and CMT of garments. Unworkable.

After the War a number of Knitting Mills started up in Melbourne with the majority of the business owners around the same age, consequently quite a few of the owners retired around the same time. The kids didn't want to continue the businesses so they simply closed the doors and sold off the equipment.

There were several reasons for the closures, besides the age of the business owners and imports from China was just one of them. The greed of the Retailers was another.

Up until recently ( in most cases) the decimation of the TCF industries was mostly due to years of tariffs/quotas/subsidies protecting local manufacturers from imports and local management not restructuring, modernising and taking advantage of new technologies. Union and Labor demands had little to do with it. In recent time the unions have helped in the final push of nearly all manufacturing overseas, not by excessive wage demands but by bureaucratic demands. Any company buying garments locally ( for example Just Jeans) are responsible for wages and conditions of all businesses all the way down the supply chain whether the purchasing company is dealing directly with those businesses or not. That means a company like Just Jeans is responsible ( and must report) for the businesses providing spinning/knitting/weaving/dying of fabrics, accessories and CMT of garments. Unworkable.

I was actually referring to Bradmill Textiles who were the only Denim manufacturer in Australia and prior to their demise were exporting denim to America.

I still look after the Outdoor Fabrics business; this was sold off to a Public Company in England but they are able to handle day to day matters here. This company is the remnants of Bradmill Outdoor Fabrics, Brella Industries and another manufacturer they bought and closed down in Sydney. Unfortunately they only dye and treat here now, all the fabric is manufactured in India.

I was actually referring to Bradmill Textiles who were the only Denim manufacturer in Australia and prior to their demise were exporting denim to America.

I still look after the Outdoor Fabrics business; this was sold off to a Public Company in England but they are able to handle day to day matters here. This company is the remnants of Bradmill Outdoor Fabrics, Brella Industries and another manufacturer they bought and closed down in Sydney. Unfortunately they only dye and treat here now, all the fabric is manufactured in India.

Robbie I think it is the Bradmill buildings I see driving back from Geelong just before the Westgate. A great industrial structure and icon but I notice the low level buildings have been demolished and the iconic multi-storey part of the Mill is deteriorating with graffiti and broken windows, quite sad if it all goes.it is part of our industrial heritage and some of it should be preserved.