Due Diligence

[The Reverend 1,736]

Its amazing how Stynes leadership got the whole club unified.

It seems now we are fragmented.

The ability to manage the behaviour and attitude of young men is important. One must have emotional intelligence.

I agree that it requires emotional intelligence but how do you know Neeld doesn't have this? Could it be that we only hear what we are told and that there could be lots of stuff going on within the club and, more particularly, the playing group, that we simply have no idea about and that some of these decisions were beyond Neeld's control. I'm not sure why you think he has poor skills in this area or why you think he is fracturing the club. Why can't you give the guy some time to see if he really is as hopeless as you seem to think? You may be left with egg on your face - and let's not forget that you have to break an egg to get to the yolk.

Edited September 5, 2012 by Crawf52

[Roost It 1,434]

It is a little disturbing no one at the club even rang Ross Lyon. But I guess we've never been known for our professionalism which is why Gary Lyon gets called in every time we start to disintegrate. I guess it's lucky he's around.

[timD 994]

I am aware of what is involved, although not as much as you Tim obviously.

I have said that these tests can be helpful. I have said that I would endorse the use of them.

But it is these tests, and the predispostion to worry about the EI (and everything else one learns from those taking these tests), can lead to over-thinking.

It is the kind of thinking that leads to Darling and Martin being overlooked in drafts.

I can understand why they didn't bother, and I can see the merit of them.

It doesn't guarantee a better process and outcome, just as the way we arrived at Neeld doesn't guarantee a better process and outcome.

Carlton is about to land a great coach and their process was a mix of dumb luck and poor recent performance.

RPFC, the overthinking I would argue stems from not understanding what you are doing (not you personally, but you get what I mean). The psychologist's job is to provide a recommendation along with the test results presented in plain english. What a lot do is provide you pages and pages of generic computer printouts. It is poor practice, but I'd argue you get what you pay for. Lots of places watn quick tests that people can do from home that are obvious, not invasive, and give you perfect results without spending anything on them. They get carp and they deserve carp.

Confusion is from not knowing what the group needs and what is liekly to work best. Those questions are not hard to answer but you do need to answer them. The psych shuld be able to tell you :candidate A has these strengths/weaknesses; candidate B has these ones and FOR YOUR GROUP at this time given your organistion, candidate A is a better fit. THe tests give you part of this, the talent/experience of the psych should provide the rest. It aint perfect by any means but it beats the pants off the alternative.

The question for carlton is whether Malthouse is what they actually need. Does he provide them with more than ratten did? Will he magically create a FB, CHF and FF ('cause they don't have em now)? Will he need his on hand-picked assistants? How long will it take to get and then bed-down that team? Will he need to re-jig their fitness program too? What is the transition period going to be? How long will it take to tweak a game plan (which is inevitable)?

Getting a coach, as is now apparent to me, a potentiall BIG shift. Malthouse is known for being difficult and pernickity. Are Carlton really lucky? Will it be right? Was ratten that bad?

I think comparing the processes and suggesting that rushed and singleminded works because it might for for carlton is along bow to draw.

[Dee Fan 3,247]

This thread seems to be going round in ever decreasing circles, with the same posters airing the same views, but in slightly different terms each time.

What's done is done, we have Neeld and he is contracted for the next 2 years at least, after that, who knows? Maybe then we'll get the psych evaluation done and if he's progress us up the ladder to the top 8 but doesn't pass the psych evaluation we'll cut him loose; is that how it works?

Perhaps if we'd given Prendagast a psych evaluation we wouldn't be in the [censored] position we're in and this thread would be irrelevant.

[timD 994]

Perhaps if we'd given Prendagast a psych evaluation we wouldn't be in the [censored] position we're in and this thread would be irrelevant.

Now I need RPFC to find a shot of a nail being pounded by a hammer...

[Hardnut 327]

RPFC, the overthinking I would argue stems from not understanding what you are doing (not you personally, but you get what I mean). The psychologist's job is to provide a recommendation along with the test results presented in plain english. What a lot do is provide you pages and pages of generic computer printouts. It is poor practice, but I'd argue you get what you pay for. Lots of places watn quick tests that people can do from home that are obvious, not invasive, and give you perfect results without spending anything on them. They get carp and they deserve carp.

Confusion is from not knowing what the group needs and what is liekly to work best. Those questions are not hard to answer but you do need to answer them. The psych shuld be able to tell you :candidate A has these strengths/weaknesses; candidate B has these ones and FOR YOUR GROUP at this time given your organistion, candidate A is a better fit. THe tests give you part of this, the talent/experience of the psych should provide the rest. It aint perfect by any means but it beats the pants off the alternative.

The question for carlton is whether Malthouse is what they actually need. Does he provide them with more than ratten did? Will he magically create a FB, CHF and FF ('cause they don't have em now)? Will he need his on hand-picked assistants? How long will it take to get and then bed-down that team? Will he need to re-jig their fitness program too? What is the transition period going to be? How long will it take to tweak a game plan (which is inevitable)?

Getting a coach, as is now apparent to me, a potentiall BIG shift. Malthouse is known for being difficult and pernickity. Are Carlton really lucky? Will it be right? Was ratten that bad?

I think comparing the processes and suggesting that rushed and singleminded works because it might for for carlton is along bow to draw.

Congrats on the young one timD - a great time ahead.

Your comments are spot on - in simple terms, the more information one has, the better informed the decision - it is how the information is used/interpreted that is critical. Information can be classified as useful or otherwise and treated accordingly, but it is essential to get as much as possible.

I have added the link below which gives one insight into process:

http://blog.rossclennett.com/2012/05/memo-to-melbourne-football-club.html

It's certainly not the whole story, but it is an important part.

[Hardnut 327]

This thread seems to be going round in ever decreasing circles, with the same posters airing the same views, but in slightly different terms each time.

What's done is done, we have Neeld and he is contracted for the next 2 years at least, after that, who knows? Maybe then we'll get the psych evaluation done and if he's progress us up the ladder to the top 8 but doesn't pass the psych evaluation we'll cut him loose; is that how it works?

Perhaps if we'd given Prendagast a psych evaluation we wouldn't be in the [censored] position we're in and this thread would be irrelevant.

Clearly you do not understand RF.

[1 red eye 1 blue eye 771]

Clarkson being restrained:

Clarkson punching wall:

Result of Clarkson's punch:

Not sure he would last as a teacher these days.

Lucky for him impact was between studs, otherwise there d have been but a small dent from his wedding ring. For a 1 in 6 chance of a good laugh let's hope he snaps again sometime soon!

[Hardnut 327]

Would you like to explain what you mean '1 red eye 1 blue eye' or are pictures all you can understand? They are used in psych tests too actually! How about a serious contribution?

[rpfc 28,848]

RPFC, the overthinking I would argue stems from not understanding what you are doing (not you personally, but you get what I mean). The psychologist's job is to provide a recommendation along with the test results presented in plain english. What a lot do is provide you pages and pages of generic computer printouts. It is poor practice, but I'd argue you get what you pay for. Lots of places watn quick tests that people can do from home that are obvious, not invasive, and give you perfect results without spending anything on them. They get carp and they deserve carp.

Confusion is from not knowing what the group needs and what is liekly to work best. Those questions are not hard to answer but you do need to answer them. The psych shuld be able to tell you :candidate A has these strengths/weaknesses; candidate B has these ones and FOR YOUR GROUP at this time given your organistion, candidate A is a better fit. THe tests give you part of this, the talent/experience of the psych should provide the rest. It aint perfect by any means but it beats the pants off the alternative.

The question for carlton is whether Malthouse is what they actually need. Does he provide them with more than ratten did? Will he magically create a FB, CHF and FF ('cause they don't have em now)? Will he need his on hand-picked assistants? How long will it take to get and then bed-down that team? Will he need to re-jig their fitness program too? What is the transition period going to be? How long will it take to tweak a game plan (which is inevitable)?

Getting a coach, as is now apparent to me, a potentiall BIG shift. Malthouse is known for being difficult and pernickity. Are Carlton really lucky? Will it be right? Was ratten that bad?

I think comparing the processes and suggesting that rushed and singleminded works because it might for for carlton is along bow to draw.

Tim, you know your stuff and I would have you my committee. But I would have a healthy scepticism of anything gleaned from these tests or I would have very localised and narrow parameters for the questioning.

I still have my opinion of them and I don't really believe RF's flippant line about Prendergast - I just don't think it would stop us recruiting Gysberts and Cook.

I also don't believe we did anything wrong - we knew the kind of character we wanted and the knowledge base they would bring and we got it.

[Hardnut 327]

Tim, you know your stuff and I would have you my committee. But I would have a healthy scepticism of anything gleaned from these tests or I would have very localised and narrow parameters for the questioning.

I still have my opinion of them and I don't really believe RF's flippant line about Prendergast - I just don't think it would stop us recruiting Gysberts and Cook.

I also don't believe we did anything wrong - we knew the kind of character we wanted and the knowledge base they would bring and we got it.

Sounds like you are out of your depth here rpfc - you clearly don't understand the concept of tests or the real side of job interviews - 'we' knew what we wanted - if 'we' did, then 'we' got it wrong, badly (character, knowledge base ...ability to deal with people, salesmanship, bucket players that you then want to trade and then wonder why you can't get anything for them, or wonder why players don't want to come to MFC ...) - unbelievable! What a process!

[rpfc 28,848]

Sounds like you are out of your depth here rpfc - you clearly don't understand the concept of tests or the real side of job interviews - 'we' knew what we wanted - if 'we' did, then 'we' got it wrong, badly (character, knowledge base ...ability to deal with people, salesmanship, bucket players that you then want to trade and then wonder why you can't get anything for them, or wonder why players don't want to come to MFC ...) - unbelievable! What a process!

Your anti-Neeld yapping from the sidelines is so tiresome.

[Hardnut 327]

Your anti-Neeld yapping from the sidelines is so tiresome.

And getting you to engage in intelligent, unbiased discussion about the real problems at MFC is like trying to 'catch smoke with your hands'.

[Dee Fan 3,247]

And getting you to engage in intelligent, unbiased discussion about the real problems at MFC is like trying to 'catch smoke with your hands'.

Do you have any first hand knowledge about the process adopted when Neeld was hired?

Do you have any reliable contacts that have any knowledge about the process?

[Deleted]

[demoniac 1,336]

Files thread under "MFC Messiah Complex"

[1 red eye 1 blue eye 771]

Would you like to explain what you mean '1 red eye 1 blue eye' or are pictures all you can understand? They are used in psych tests too actually! How about a serious contribution?

Sure, on either side of that hole behind the plasterboard there is a timber frame, the hole looks impressive but if he'd hit where the timber was, well, anyhow, looks like I was having a laugh at a serious time, sorry about that.