On 02/07/2011 at 09:41, Dockett 32 said:

I think if our (or anybody's I suppose) smaller, quicker and more skilled players get space to work in, they can be very effective. We've shown this a few times this year. Bigger bodied top sides don't provide that sort of work environment however and the law of physics then takes over and we get monstered.

Perhaps we would have a 'plans b & c' for such a circumstances.

Agree on the more mature bigger bodied aspect re last night. Not a top side though.

To me one part of this plan should be not to play too many outside players the likes of Bennell/Morton on tight smaller grounds like this. And if we're going to keep playing this style of running the ball off our half back line, then you're going to need some damn quick players coming off that half back line and they'll also need sublime kicking skills.

Bennell may be handy on the bigger grounds where he can find space and others can find him free and he can burn off his opponent, but on the confines of Etihad, i don't believe he's capable. Neither is Morton. Too slow and loping, easily caught and pressured. Also doesn't like the hard one on one contact like Bennell. And you are going to need this in your game to play smaller grounds (and even the bigger ones too a lessor degree). There's no avoiding it. Eventually you're going to have to go when it's your turn and crack in.

This is where Davey is a huge loss for us i feel. I didn't like what happened against the Saints either, but a player who does what he does through the zones and press, is very hard to cover/replace. And he could/can lay a decent tackle and pressure the ball carrier when he's on, unlike Morton and Bennell.

IMO we need 2 - 3 Davey types (with an extra injection of courage) running off the half back line, breaking the lines and finding their way through the press zone with speed and sublime passing skills, mostly by foot, if the FD insist on continuing with this half back running game plan. If we can't, IMHO we're going to need a fairly massive change in game/plan strategy going forward if we're to make any substantial progress with this team in the coming years.

"Eventually you're going to have to go when it's your turn and crack in."

+1 and keep doing it repeatedly until it becomes very regular , habitual and instinctive. Certainly at Etihad anyway. There's not much fancy stuff happening there tonight either, so I think you may be onto someting about smaller bodies and lack of space at the joint.

MCG a slightly different proposition perhaps.

Scapegoat.

Bennell's not done as a player, but he will be within a year if he doesn't add a string or two to his bow. He's got that pace but never uses it, rather like Morton has height but never uses it.

Will get dropped again soon, but won't be delisted.

  On 02/07/2011 at 14:25, Artie Bucco said:

Scapegoat.

Not really, he just didn't play well......

We have a number of outsiders. Bennell looks really sus in a game like this. The fact is, if we have a critical mass of strong, head over the ball players, we can carry the odd outsider for their speed and finishing skills. In a game like that at Etihad we can't afford more than one or two.

As much as Jurrah is down on form and confidence, and had a shocker ( is that the first or second game where LJ hasn't scored a goal?), who here is suggesting that we shouldn't have played him? Should we drop LJ for the Darwin game? I don't think so. Supply into the F50 wasn't exactly plentiful.

Morton we know about, but it seems the FD are wanting to play him into form because they see his upside. I am far from convinced.

If Bennell's disposal was better he would deliver a higher dividend for his limited possessions. ATM he is not good value.

Geelong persisted with guys like this (think Byrnes, Stokes) and kept playing them in the twos until they were of value. In a team with such a good work ethic like Geelong the engine room is so strong that these guys look ok. Stevie Johnson has days when he looks completely disinterested but can turn it on in a way that few others at Geelong can.

I think Bennell and Morton should both back to Casey for a while but Jurrah has to play in Darwin.

I'm not sure if Morton is ever going to realise his potential because as I have said many times on this forum, his kicking action is so flawed, and if his disposal is no good then what value does he provide. I think Bennell is worth hanging on to for the immediate future

  On 02/07/2011 at 14:25, Artie Bucco said:

Scapegoat.

Not at all.

I think the large majority of supporters have a lot of time for Bennell, but here are some stats for you....

Bennell is averaging 10 disposals a game. That's 1 less than last year, and 2 less than his debut season. He also averages less than 2 tackles a game, and his stats have all gone down since last year.

Just as a comparison, Nicholson, who has been a sub as many times as Bennell this year, is averaging 14 disposals a game, and nearly double the tackles.

We cannot keep carrying guys like Bennell in the side, who don't give us much. 10 disposals a game is very poor, when even as a fellow small defender Strauss averages 18 disposals a game, with a lot less experience.

There is no doubt he is very quick and can use the ball well, but it doesn't help us when he rarely gets near it, especially when he is also timid around packs, doesn't tackle (and with his speed he should be hunting them down!) and doesn't gut run.

  On 03/07/2011 at 03:21, Jaded said:

Not at all.

I think the large majority of supporters have a lot of time for Bennell, but here are some stats for you....

Bennell is averaging 10 disposals a game. That's 1 less than last year, and 2 less than his debut season. He also averages less than 2 tackles a game, and his stats have all gone down since last year.

Just as a comparison, Nicholson, who has been a sub as many times as Bennell this year, is averaging 14 disposals a game, and nearly double the tackles.

We cannot keep carrying guys like Bennell in the side, who don't give us much. 10 disposals a game is very poor, when even as a fellow small defender Strauss averages 18 disposals a game, with a lot less experience.

There is no doubt he is very quick and can use the ball well, but it doesn't help us when he rarely gets near it, especially when he is also timid around packs, doesn't tackle (and with his speed he should be hunting them down!) and doesn't gut run.

Covered it perfectly Jaded

  On 01/07/2011 at 16:19, davey_magik said:

Made look second rate by a 34 year old? Halls first goal was a good kick to his advantage, no defender could have stopped that, the second one was a missed mark from Gysberts meant Frawley lost sight of the ball and to be honest I can't remember the 3rd. Frawley was beating Hall in the few times it was one on one.

The Cooney goal was the fault of whichever midfielder was on him at the time, not Chips. Chips job was to play on Hall, why is he meant to run to Cooney as well?

I don't think Chip was great tonight at all, I do agree he looked a bit uninterested which is most unlike him, but he wasn't made to look second rate by Hall nor was the Cooney goal his fault.

Back on topic I don't think Bennell will become an AFL standard player, has lovely skills and pace but is soft and doesn't get the ball enough.

Thats the problem right there, they are playing like a bunch of individuals, not my opponent so I wont man him up. Chip spotted Cooney running into space and decided not to put pressure/man him up, if thats our attitude then its no wonder we are shite.

After about 48 hours i'll cut chip some slack. Reckon Warnock should have been brought in for Hall so chip could focus on his run and carry.

Scapegoat.

I'm not against him being dropped, but he's still used by some as a scapegoat.

At the moment Bennell is treading water in a wide ocean.

He's not alone, so might not get eaten by sharks right away, but we'd be hoping that once he sees a couple of teamates get chewed up he get's in motion.

I'd still hold a little hope for him, he has a whole lot of 'attributes' in his favour, but being consistently in our bottom six performers isn't a good place to be.

  On 03/07/2011 at 09:48, Artie Bucco said:

Scapegoat.

I'm not against him being dropped, but he's still used by some as a scapegoat.

Read Jaded's post Enforcer.

Needs to get involved more.

If you are stopper/tagger and do your job properly then you can afford to have Bennell's numbers. If you are in the team to be a run and carry line breaker you have got to get the ball more. It means you are not working hard enough to be the link in the chain.