In the 2006 draft we had a choice out of chip (pick 12) or jack reiwoldt (pick 13), Even considering jack's 10 goals and that we need a key forward I would still take chip any day of the week, the guy is an out and out star.

I think there was another thread a couple of weeks ago on this topic.

Good topic for this week Strawbs!!

Interesting to note the battle they had on each other in Round 4...thought that Chip lowered his colors early but as good defenders do he worked his way back into the contest, Jack did kick 3.4 so it could have looked worse on Chip that day.

Maybe says more about Jack because IMO it is the only time anyone has got close to beating Chip, even Stevie J was handled well by Chip when it could've been easy for him to explode, especially knowing Chip was sore through the end of that game.

I'm sure Richmond are happy with what they took and so are we. If you stick with the experts they will tell you it is the defense that wins flags and we have the best up and coming back line in the game (probably better seeing as they are ranked 4 or 5 already)so reckon that we picked the better option and your right Chip is an out and out STAR!

Will be interesting to see the re-match between these two players.

It's also worth remembering that when the did match up Frawley was very unwell and could have been rested if he had not be so determined to play.

Is a dream matchup, been thinking about this myself recently.

I think chip would nullify him, making him more valuable.

Shutting down the opposition's dominant forward is more valuable and disruptive than being one yourself.

I think.

Watts will be > than Reiwoldt in a few years time. I'd rather be in this position now with a very strong backline and an emerging forward line, than a strong forward line with an emerging backline.

Defense win championships.

If you're asking who we'd pick in hindsight, it's a moot point really. All Melbourne supporters will say Frawley and all Richmond supporters will say Riewoldt. Most unbiased supporters will probably say Riewoldt, because 10 goals attracts a lot more attention than anything any defender will ever do. It's only natural.

What I will say though is Richmond and Melbourne fans alike should be absolutely stoked with how our clubs picked in that range. Would we be better off with Riewoldt? Who knows, and who cares. I for one couldn't be happier with how Frawley has turned out.

Both were very good picks, but I would always draft a key forward ahead of a defender.

Both were very good picks, but I would always draft a key forward ahead of a defender.

Why?

Why?

That's also what I want to know, when it is clear that good backlines win you premierships.

Both were very good picks, but I would always draft a key forward ahead of a defender.

Why?

Both were very good picks, but I would always draft a key forward ahead of a defender.

agree with everyone above

why?

the only team IMO to win a grandfinal based around a forward line could be north with wayne carey?

most grandfinal teams are based around a core defence, and hence we have developed our core defence first

That's also what I want to know, when it is clear that good backlines win you premierships.

What are you basing that opinion on? A good backline can't carry a team to a premiership, it takes all 22 players.

I decided to look at past Grand Finalists since 2004, and ranked each sides offence and defence. I based the offensive ranking by points scored, and defence by points conceded during the regular season. I chose 2004 to start this sample to try and keep things current.

2004

Premiers: Port Adelaide (Offence: 3rd, Defence: 4th)

Runners-up: Brisbane (Offence: 1st, Defence: 2nd)

Both teams had a higher ranking in offence than defence, but nevertheless were very balanced.

2005

Premiers: Sydney (Offence: 14th, Defence: 2nd)

Runners-up: West Coast (Offence: 3rd, Defence: 3rd)

West Coast were clearly the better team on paper, but Sydney took home the flag in a thriller despite being one of the worst scoring teams in the competition.

2006

Premiers: West Coast (Offence: 4th, Defence: 4th)

Runners-up: Sydney (Offence: 6th, PA: Defence: 1st)

The Grand Final replay, with another great nail biting finish! The better offensive team won the flag that year.

2007

Premiers: Geelong (Offence: 1st, Defence: 1st)

Runners-up: (Offence: 2nd, Defence: 10th)

The Grand Finalists were the two highest scoring teams in the competition that year. Port Adelaide still squeezed into the GF despite their defence being ranked 10th in the league.

2008

Premiers: Hawthorn (Offence: 3rd, Defence: 3rd)

Runners-up: Geelong (Offence: 1st, Defence: 1st)

As a side note, the top 3 teams after 22 rounds were the top 3 teams ranked offensively. Buddy and Roughead booted 168 goals between them during the regular season and spearheaded Hawthorn to premiership glory.

2009

Premiers: Geelong (Offence: 2nd, Defence: 4th)

Runners-up: St Kilda (Offence: 4th, Defence: 1st)

St Kilda were the best defence the league, and looking at previous seasons they conceded less points than any other side since 2004 (could be longer, but I am only looking between 2004-2009). Geelong were the better offensive team, and won the second premiership in 3 years.

So looking at that sample, every premiership side with exception of the 2005 Swans have been ranked in the top four for points scored and points conceded.

Why?

No real reason, I just prefer forwards. I just find watching a player such as Jonathan Brown to be more exciting than a Scarlett or a Fletcher.

And not saying MFC did the wrong thing choosing Frawley, he turned out to be a great player. But would taking Jack Riewoldt with that selection be that bad? He is averaging nearly 4 goals per game so far this season.

Both are fantastic players, and will be very important to their respective clubs.

Naah. Pleased with Frawley. No mistake made there.

Also, it's easy to say Jack is great coming off a game like that. But given how he kicks it, and given how close he plays to goal and the fact no-one's given him much respect yet, I think we'll find he'll come back to the pack. Double-teamed, worked up the ground, or worked wide... He won't continue in this vein.

In that sense, I'm veeeery comfortable with James. Watts will do exactly what Riewoldt is doing soon enough... and like Jack R., he'll likely go through the same downturn when they see he has to be taken seriously.

Forget debating pick 12 VS pick 13. Think about the clubs that passed up BOTH players with earlier picks.

Hats of to the dees and tigers for making the picks. We both got lucky! Everitt, Armitage and Reid were selected ahead of these guys. I still don't rate Gumbleton either!