JACK VS JACK

[e25 5]

Agree also. I've alluded to this play in the three words thread. He was cooked by his senior teammate there.

Yeah, it's a shame.

Miller did some nice things today, but a recurring theme throughout his career has been reacting sluggishly to what is happening in his immediate vicinity.

Leading for the ball, when it is being kick directly at him, he can do, but in general play he can get a bit lost.

Bartram too, although he did some good things, was guilty of this.

At one stage a chain of handballs in the defensive 50 came unstuck because he failed to recognize he was on the forward edge of congestion and needed to make a run to be released.

Instead he got caught ball watching, trying to figure out what his teammates were doing and the player with the ball got crunched waiting for his movement.

It made the player with the ball (think it was Dunn) look ordinary.

These 2 players in particular interrupt the flow of our ball movement and when this is rectified we will be much better for it.

Confidence has a lot to do with it. Confidence in your teammate to win the ball and get it to you so that you can leave your man to make a run without fear of being burnt on a turnover.

Unfortunately for these 2 I think confidence is not their only problem and they are on borrowed time.

[45HG 1,539]

Tick to the OP.

The best thing we, as Dees fans, can do, is to stop talking about him for a while and let him develop.

[Dappa Dan 2,188]

My expectations of Watts may be too high, but at the same time 95% of posters on this site need to expect more. We need to stop giving him praise for pulling off basic football skills like hitting a target to a leading player or kicking a goal from directly in front.

I actually agree with this. I'm all for people getting off his back... (for the record I think people giving him praise for today's game is what happens when a player is picked on unfairly for half a season), but I won't be saying he had a "good" game, or that he had enough great touches to keep his spot in the side.

He wasn't appalling, but as someone on bigfooty wrote, if we had 3 Jack Watts in the forward line today, we'd have lost by a LOT. It's just a simple thing really, no reason to string him up and crucify him. It's just his output wasn't good enough at this level. Plenty of good reasons why... chief amongst them, he's a kid. No shame in it, but they really should think about dropping him. It's not a knock on the kid, just good selection ethics.

[Toot182 7]

(B) He falls over far too easily (Morton even keeps his feet better)

I heard Doc Larkins on Triple M yesterday say after he'd fallen over a couple of times: "Watts wears a very low-profile moulded boot which is probably be the reason why he slips over" - I noticed this a couple of times when he tried to change direction quickly.

In my experience this means that his feet might be a bit soft/not used to running in harder boots. I have the same problem when I play sport and because the metal studs actually hurt my feet when I run on them too much, I can't use them.

The only problem is do you mean 'keep his feet in contests?' That will surely come with upper body/core strength?

[John Dee 445]

completely agree. After taking the ball, Jack's momentum was carrying him straight

towards Miller and Leigh Brown, not having room to change direction.

Miller was rooted to the spot and too slow to think, but he should have thrown his body into Brown and shepherded for Watts.

Alternatively he could have moved away into space, placing Watts between himself and Brown, so Jack could absorb the tackle and release Miller.

Watts had no options and was relying on Miller to recognize the situation and make a split-second decision and the right play.

Didn't happen.

The basic problem was that Miller had two options and that is one to many for our Brad. He had to move forward and shepherd Brown or turn and run to make space for a handball, isolating Brown and exploiting the two-on-one. Brad was still dithering when Watts arrived and Brown could not believe his luck.

Edited June 15, 2010 by undeeniable

[Mad_Melbourne 877]

i am big wraps for jack watts, and will admit he does make a few mistakes, like any tall forward especially early on. he has been losing his feet lately which is a problem, mind you it will be fixed when he is weighing around 95 kilos, which is still another 10 kilos off where he is now.

i think he leads to really good positions, leads hard and finds hmself in space quite often, and isnt used enough.

his ground kicking is great. goal kicking is great. decision making at times not so great. there is alot to like and i compare him to an early nick riedwolt.

nick riedwolt first season, 93 kilos

2001 St Kilda 6 games 43 kicks 14 handballs 57 total disposals

26 marks 2 goals 2 behinds 3 tackles 1 frees against 3 frees for

jack watts this season ,85 kilos, (last season didnt count as he was still doing vce barely training.

2010 melbourne 5 games 28 kicks 27 handballs 55 total disposals

15 marks 4 goals 1 behind 5 tackles 7 frees against 7 frees for

watts is on the right track IMO, everyone should get off his back, wait until he is weighing about 95 kilos, had 2-3 seasons, and then we can judge him.

[agent_orange 0]

I actually agree with this. I'm all for people getting off his back... (for the record I think people giving him praise for today's game is what happens when a player is picked on unfairly for half a season), but I won't be saying he had a "good" game, or that he had enough great touches to keep his spot in the side.

He wasn't appalling, but as someone on bigfooty wrote, if we had 3 Jack Watts in the forward line today, we'd have lost by a LOT. It's just a simple thing really, no reason to string him up and crucify him. It's just his output wasn't good enough at this level. Plenty of good reasons why... chief amongst them, he's a kid. No shame in it, but they really should think about dropping him. It's not a knock on the kid, just good selection ethics.

Took some nice marks and got the ball moving forward up the ground. Seriously, Watts did as many nice things as Miller today, one has played 8 games, the other over 100.

His first quater was bad - but his first dropped mark was more to do with the poor execution down the field. Needs to learn how to lead. But then again, what young forward hasn't had to learn that in their first 30 games.

As for Miller, the guy is our biggest forward yet doesn't crunch the packs. Harry Obrien put him on the deck had he isn't a big body player.

[satyricon 267]

Of all the times I've seen Frawley at AFl level or at Casey level I never had doubts over him. Other may have but I never did. A KPP is a dud if they don't want the footy. He doesn't demand it unlike Riewoldt did since day 1. My expectations of Watts may be too high, but at the same time 95% of posters on this site need to expect more. We need to stop giving him praise for pulling off basic football skills like hitting a target to a leading player or kicking a goal from directly in front. (And yes, the one he got today was from a free kick that definitely wasn't there).

Apart from stopping the praise, maybe we should also stop the constant criticism as well, you will notice I for one do not join in on any post concerning Watts because they seem to feed on themselves, I am prepared to be patient, if the Footy Dept pick him for the team, I just expect him to give it his best shot from where he is at the moment (realistically), and if he does I am happy with that, my only comment on Monday's game was I thought he did ok, and on the Club website is this

Jack Watts - Jack did some good things. He took some good marks and just needed a bit of length on his kicks a few times. He needs to keep going.

That will do me at the moment

I have joined in on this post just to be au contraire

Edited June 15, 2010 by satyricon

[e25 5]

The basic problem was that Miller had two options and that is one to many for our Brad. He had to move forward and shepherd Brown or turn and run to make space for a handball, isolating Brown and exploiting the two-on-one. Brad was still dithering when Watts arrived and Brown could not believe his luck.

You're right.

Rather than making a decisive action, Miller was waiting for Watts to do it, leaving only one obvious option for him to take.

He wanted to read off Watts, but the problem was that Watts didn't really have any option other than to head straight at Miller and Brown and had to hope Miller would recognize this and make a move.

It all happened in a matter of seconds, but I expect a player like Scully would make it work.

Especially if he had the experience Miller should have.

It's not a reason Miller should be dropped or chastised, but it's an inherent reason why Miller has never taken the next step as a player.

And possibly a reason why he won't be there next year.

[beelzebub 23,313]

Im drawn for some reason two a compelling comparison between two Jacks. One , a seemingly overnight sensation ( but actually his fourth season ) and another in only his second and only 8 games to his name.

Jack Reiwoldt almost seems to have sprung from nowhere. Having been taken by Richmond with its first pick in 06 as their big shiny hope as a KPF he languished in his early games and whilst improving in 08 and 09 he certainly wasnt setting the world on fire. Many observers and especially his own club's followers were wondering about his commitment and indeed his suitability for such a key role in attack. He had the pedigree, he had the runs on the baord in his junior days . He was a marvel suppposedly. But he just wasnt clicking out there on the ground.. His attitude has often been brought into question. Then comes season 010 and after taking a littel while to refind his feet and get up to speed he explodes onto the scene.

Its taken only 4 years for this kid to arrive !!!!

......and then we have another gangly kid taken with a clubs first pick in a draft, indeed the first by any club in the 08 draft.....and there's an eery similarity in progression. A youngen with a prodigious talent, sublime skills and touted as the next great thing in forward's footy and he isnt setting the world on fire. And likewise questions are being asked.

Reiwoldt - 58 games... has arived

Watts - 8 games...is getting there.

and when he does...

why do players suddenly 'step up ' ? why do some take giant strides almost over a preseason....it just works that way for some. There's mental aspects...there's physical ones. Thats just the way it happens....and Jack Watts will also happen....not overninght !!!!.....but he will happen:)

[e25 5]

Ok, there is already another thread on this exact same topic...

But the reason is:

experince (games) + physical development (preseason) + confidence (belief: both in yourself and the belief of teammates in you) = increased output

[Guest Thomo]

Already a topic on this.

My link

[beelzebub 23,313]

Already a topic on this.

My link

my apologies..didnt see it back there..

mods merge please ..cheers

[beelzebub 23,313]

Just thought Id piggy back this thread instead of starting another on jack (as originally didnt..lol )

Just thought id pas this on..

was out with the missus on friday night down at a local venue. Got talking to another couple of whom the lady just hapened to be an aunt of Jack's ( Watts ). She passeed on that he's still just a happy kid.. and still quite in awe of where he finds himself. After delberating for some time between basketball and footy and having chosen the 'great game' he still was mainly focussed on his VCE and its realy only this year that its starting to sink in that he is REALLY playing at an AFL club etc.

She joked that his cousins are all trying to get him to eat more..lol.. to get that weight on. Hes very keen to progress to make it, but she thinks likes many of us it will take another couple of preseasons to get into a real body to do the job. Hes apparently just a nice lad.. but am sure she was suitably biased..lol

just thought id pass that on...funny who you bump into

[old dee 23,781]

Im drawn for some reason two a compelling comparison between two Jacks. One , a seemingly overnight sensation ( but actually his fourth season ) and another in only his second and only 8 games to his name.

Jack Reiwoldt almost seems to have sprung from nowhere. Having been taken by Richmond with its first pick in 06 as their big shiny hope as a KPF he languished in his early games and whilst improving in 08 and 09 he certainly wasnt setting the world on fire. Many observers and especially his own club's followers were wondering about his commitment and indeed his suitability for such a key role in attack. He had the pedigree, he had the runs on the baord in his junior days . He was a marvel suppposedly. But he just wasnt clicking out there on the ground.. His attitude has often been brought into question. Then comes season 010 and after taking a littel while to refind his feet and get up to speed he explodes onto the scene.

Its taken only 4 years for this kid to arrive !!!!

......and then we have another gangly kid taken with a clubs first pick in a draft, indeed the first by any club in the 08 draft.....and there's an eery similarity in progression. A youngen with a prodigious talent, sublime skills and touted as the next great thing in forward's footy and he isnt setting the world on fire. And likewise questions are being asked.

Reiwoldt - 58 games... has arived

Watts - 8 games...is getting there.

and when he does...

why do players suddenly 'step up ' ? why do some take giant strides almost over a preseason....it just works that way for some. There's mental aspects...there's physical ones. Thats just the way it happens....and Jack Watts will also happen....not overninght !!!!.....but he will happen:)

Like your confidence!

However Watts should be compared to Franklin.

Does anyone have the information on how he was travelling at the same age or number of games?

Franklin is a game breaking CPF that is what we need from Watts.

[Guest Rojik of the Arctic]

I'm sick of all this Jack Watts talk. Bring back Newton.

[Juicebox 628]

From memory J.Brown didn't exactly dominant in his first 10-20 games. I could be wrong and I can't be stoooofed looking up stats do back myself up.

J.W's Disposal by foot and even by hand for that matter has been very attractive. And I know there has been X amount of threads and posts on him, but with his potential the discussion is inevitable.

[dee-luded 2,959]

The basic problem was that Miller had two options and that is one to many for our Brad. He had to move forward and shepherd Brown or turn and run to make space for a handball, isolating Brown and exploiting the two-on-one. Brad was still dithering when Watts arrived and Brown could not believe his luck.

I think both just misread the situation, not knowing what to expect from one another. One very small error.