Beach Road Bazza said:

Sandringham Biddlecombe Summers Crowe Buckley Valenti Holland

How did Clogs go? Named in the Best I see but no ones mentioned how he went. I still believe that he (and Yze) are in our best 22 but I can't see them getting back into the side with DB.

Also noticed that PJ didn't get in the Best. Does that mean that people here believe he played better than he actually did or did he just get unnoticed by whoever was naming the best players?

Nonetheless, it's great to hear that he dominated. Him and Jamar are both in good form - I don't think we've ever seen that before.

  Dee man said:

How did Clogs go? Named in the Best I see but no ones mentioned how he went.

Nonetheless, it's great to hear that he dominated. Him and Jamar are both in good form - I don't think we've ever seen that before.

Holland to me looked like he just did enough, without really going. I didn't think he looked to me like someone really trying to fight for his career. Smart game but halfhearted.

what about ooze ?

  Green N Juice said:

what about ooze ?

Was there in his street clothes, looked OK.

  Green N Juice said:

what about ooze ?

Did not play.

  dee-luded said:

Holland to me looked like he just did enough, without really going. I didn't think he looked to me like someone really trying to fight for his career. Smart game but halfhearted.

Agreed. Was just going. Not that he doesn't try but at this stage there are a lot of people ahead of him.

  Dee man said:

Also noticed that PJ didn't get in the Best. Does that mean that people here believe he played better than he actually did or did he just get unnoticed by whoever was naming the best players?

For his first game back Dee man I thought he was fantastic. He reads the play so well and was able to creatively setup forward thrusts throughout the course of the game.

I for one have no problem with having all three of Jamar, P Johnson and White in the same team. One in the ruck, one on the pine and one in the forward line.

even though everyone was calling for a key forward to be dropped because the forwards weren't chasing enough out of the backline?

Whelan has been crook of late (intestinal I believe), which is why he was replaced in last weeks side. He was apparently over it, until todays game, hence why he didn't play the rest of the match.

Also, if you kept an eye out, Robbo and Junior were both in attendance

  MFC4Life said:

A very underwhelming performance. Willy on top for the majority of the day. We got to within 5 points in the third quarter but it blew out after that, Willy having a 7 goal last quarter:

Bode: Found a lot of the ball as a loose back flanker but clearly not in our best 22.

Buckley: Did some very nice things and kicked a few goals. Sure he breaks the lines and carries it which is all well and good but there is no accountabilty. If he loses the ball it is always usually and instant turnover.

Cheney: A few touches but nothing special. Learning the game.

Dunn: Uninspiring. A few nice touches but should be dominating at this level.

Chris Johnson: Solid VFL footballer

Paul Johnson: Great game. BOG Sandy player in my opinion. Got heaps of the footy with great disposal and virtuall acted as an anchor for wherever the ball was as well as being creative. Should have an instant return next week.

Maric: Great 1st quarter but then tailed off. Kicked 1 or 2 goals.

Martin: Pleased with his game always trys and most of the time does very nice things but still has the occasional *k up.

Meesen: A worry. Gets the ball but is so unsure and cannot take a contested mark. At this stage nowhere near our best 22.

Whelan: Solid first half but did not play at all in the second. Don't know if he's injured but he certainly wasn't limping.

Valenti: Usual statistics but often gets caught short because of lack of speed.

Have to disagree with you on a couple of things there. Johnson's opponents were the 2 most influencial players in the game so for that reason is no where near BOG. Skipper and more so Street were dominant in the ruck, gave them first use at the stoppages and ran forward without any defensive pressure too often.

Also, Valenti only looks slow in your eyes becuase he gets the ball in tight positions. If he was an outside runner like Buckley (who you all say has so much speed) you'd all say he was quick. He so often gets the ball with 2/3 opponents around him and does so well to clear the ball as he does. Valenti is in Melbourne's best 22 at the moment and should/deserves to get a game.

  bodeistheman said:

Whelan has been crook of late (intestinal I believe), which is why he was replaced in last weeks side. He was apparently over it, until todays game, hence why he didn't play the rest of the match.

Also, if you kept an eye out, Robbo and Junior were both in attendance

I think you'll find it was unrelated to the sickness that kept him out of last weeks game.

  Deelicious9 said:

I think you'll find it was unrelated to the sickness that kept him out of last weeks game.

And it was related to ............................?

  Deelicious9 said:

I think you'll find it was unrelated to the sickness that kept him out of last weeks game.

Yeah I'm curious too as it was reported that he was out due to gastro. Are you implying something more sinister..?

  MFC4Life said:

Buckley: Did some very nice things and kicked a few goals. Sure he breaks the lines and carries it which is all well and good but there is no accountabilty.

The lack of accountability and endeavour was the reason I was happy to see Buckley demoted, and it's disappointing to hear there was no accountability in his game v Williamstown.

  deestroy08 said:

Yeah I'm curious too as it was reported that he was out due to gastro. Are you implying something more sinister..?

I reckon it was more head related. I noticed the Sandringham doctor looking into his eyes with one of those little torch things. Getting him to try and focus and stuff. He also got up to do a few run throughs on occassions which makes me think he was testing something rather than having gastro/stomach pains.

  MFC4Life said:

Whelan... Maybe being kept in cotton wool for next week? Probably off too early for that though... and we were losing, so doubtful.

  Deelicious9 said:

Also, Valenti only looks slow in your eyes becuase he gets the ball in tight positions. If he was an outside runner like Buckley (who you all say has so much speed) you'd all say he was quick. He so often gets the ball with 2/3 opponents around him and does so well to clear the ball as he does. Valenti is in Melbourne's best 22 at the moment and should/deserves to get a game.

Agree with this. In the games I've seen him at Sandy last year, and there were a few, I thought he had a little bit of pace. What made him great wasn't whether or not he was quick, it was his head in traffic... I reckon Mitchell is slower, but is similar in the sense that he knows what to do once he's got it.

I went to the All-Star game on Saturday, and had the best seats and view of my life, and I had a close look at a number of players. This was a game played almost completely with players' minds on the ball, not the man. The pace of the game AND the individual players was stunning...

Mitchell still got a bit of it and did ok, setting up plays... but this is where I think people worry about players like him and Valenti.

If we assume that those 50-odd players are the biggest, fastest and best players going around... then THAT'S where Valenti would struggle. I hnk in dour in-and-under games where we need a hard-nut to get us first use, he would break even, may even excel... but when the games open up, he won't be able to keep up.

So, long story short, I don't think Valenti is as slow as people say... but by the same token, I think he'll get found out against the top players in the league... but then, isn't everyone?!

  Dappa Dan said:

So, long story short, I don't think Valenti is as slow as people say... but by the same token, I think he'll get found out against the top players in the league... but then, isn't everyone?!

I think the concern is Valenti's lack of pace at AFL level and that he will be found out by not just the top players. Given the make up of the MFC midfield with its strengths and weaknesses I dont see what Valenti adds at this point. I dont accept the comparison with Mitchell as Mitchell is far superior in the stoppages and is complimented by players with different and better attributes than some of the players in the MFC midfield.

With Grimes due back and Neitz not far away we already have a dilemma in having Wona remain on the senior list. I cant see Valenti being elevated and clearly the Coaching panel have not elevated him given the tough season to date.

  Rhino Richards said:

I think the concern is Valenti's lack of pace at AFL level and that he will be found out by not just the top players. Given the make up of the MFC midfield with its strengths and weaknesses I dont see what Valenti adds at this point. I dont accept the comparison with Mitchell as Mitchell is far superior in the stoppages and is complimented by players with different and better attributes than some of the players in the MFC midfield.

With Grimes due back and Neitz not far away we already have a dilemma in having Wona remain on the senior list. I cant see Valenti being elevated and clearly the Coaching panel have not elevated him given the tough season to date.

If that's is indeed the case then why would the club have even bothered drafting him as a rookie in the first place? Obviously the club has seen something in him or else they wouldn't have drafted him in the first place.

Rookie spots are always a risky venture for the players, they've been drafted but have no guarantees of getting a game, which is entirely dependant on long term injuries. I'm sure Valenti is not 'sweating' on being elevated this year, his mindset would be to perform as best that he possibly can throughout the year in the hope that he'll get added onto the list at the end of the season.

  Jarka said:

Rookie spots are always a risky venture for the players,.....

As they are for Clubs...

As I recall Valenti was the last player rookied by MFC this year and may have been the case of the best of what was left. And when rookied there is not necessarily the surety or expectation of elevation. He's has got time to prove himself.

  Jarka said:

If that's is indeed the case then why would the club have even bothered drafting him as a rookie in the first place? Obviously the club has seen something in him or else they wouldn't have drafted him in the first place.

Rookie spots are always a risky venture for the players, they've been drafted but have no guarantees of getting a game, which is entirely dependant on long term injuries. I'm sure Valenti is not 'sweating' on being elevated this year, his mindset would be to perform as best that he possibly can throughout the year in the hope that he'll get added onto the list at the end of the season.

I understand what your saying Jarka but you must ask yourself why he wasn't selected instead of Wonamaerri. Yes, Aussie was no doubt picked because we needed a forward but if Valenti's form and talent is such then why didn't the club elevate him?

  MFC4Life said:

I understand what your saying Jarka but you must ask yourself why he wasn't selected instead of Wonamaerri. Yes, Aussie was no doubt picked because we needed a forward but if Valenti's form and talent is such then why didn't the club elevate him?

I didn't say that his form and talent demanded selection, I was just pointing out that if what RR is saying and he is far too slow for AFL footy then why did the club bother recruiting him in the first place? It's highly unlikely that a player can increase his speed that dramatically over a short period of time, so the club must have seen something in the kid.

So why did the club draft him?

Edit: I have no opinion on whether he should be elevated mid year or not

First VFL match for years! Great atmosphere and very enjoyable sitting near the fence yelling instructions to the players as they ran past.

I was impressed with Valenti's game, the kid may not have blistering leg speed, but his mind seems to work faster than most players in the team and he generally seems to extricate himself from tight spots with some aplomb. He's also a damned hard worker which is a big big plus.

If he's not in our best 22 as yet - he's heading that way! (and yes I know he's a supplementary player).

And I think Stephan Martin has the makings of a very good AFL footballer and would like to see him given a shot at the big time later this year. Good height, good leg speed and seemed to read the play quite well.

Simon Buckley sure is fast of foot but seems to be a bit slow of mind (he's the reverse of Valenti).

Paul Johnson played well with little ruck support. I remember a couple of years ago his marking was constantly called into question. Well, it's improved!!!

Young Maric. Looks about 12, played well in fits and starts, but to be expected from a school kid! In a couple of years when he grows up he could be a very exciting footballer.

  Jarka said:

So why did the club draft him?

The Club neither recruited or drafted him, they rookied him. Rookies are typically players show potential to make the higher grade or have attributes that make them potentially AFL players in the future. There is no certainty either way for the player or the Club that they will play AFL football. Their futures can be a mixture of ability, performance and opportunity.

Like other rookies, Valenti has a number of positives to his game but they come with limitations. At this point I dont think those positives overcome the limitations sufficiently to warrant selection to the senior list. The Coaching panel would have more in depth but similar view.

He has his rookie contract to establish his capabilities. And his lack of elevation against Wona's ascension is probably more a case that players of Valenti's attributes are already on the MFC list at present.

I would expect that the MFC list is in for a huge shake up come year given that Bailey knows fully where the list is at and who he thinks can actually contribute to his plans. Valenti has a big opportunity to get elevated..if he is good enough.

  Dee Dee said:

I was impressed with Valenti's game, the kid may not have blistering leg speed, but his mind seems to work faster than most players in the team and he generally seems to extricate himself from tight spots with some aplomb.

Thanks for the game summary Dee Dee. Your thoughts on Valenti's mind working fast reminded me of Judd's performance for the Big V. Perhaps its was the groin or the quality of the company he was keeping but the explosive pace of old just wasn't there. However he more then compensated through speed of mind and speed of hands.

Pleased to hear that Martin is coming along well...high hopes for him.

Who and where are Sandy playing next weekend?

  Jarka said:

I didn't say that his form and talent demanded selection, I was just pointing out that if what RR is saying and he is far too slow for AFL footy then why did the club bother recruiting him in the first place? It's highly unlikely that a player can increase his speed that dramatically over a short period of time, so the club must have seen something in the kid.

So why did the club draft him?

Edit: I have no opinion on whether he should be elevated mid year or not

RR has an opinion from what he has seen at this point in time but he is not finitie with his judgement. Valenti may prove him wrong and I hope he does but the only way he will get a game is if one of Jones, McLean, McDonald maybe Bartram or Moloney get a long-term injury. In fact the more I think about this is probably the reason why he was picked as a rookie, if one of these blokes went down he would step in but if it doesn't happen he won't get a game.