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All this is the caan of worms that Demitriou did not want opened. All clubs have some nefarious doings. The Mfc was scapegoated to highlight the list management (read tanking) that was altering betting outcomes, Essendon were warned about their pharmacological experimentation which was affecting results (read performance enhancing, unfair advantage, betting agency) The next cabs off the rank may well be free agency, father son, drafting (read employment contracts, restraint of trade) which impact on results (read gambling) Gill and the AFL are trying to retain control of their industry but it is now subject to greater external scrutiny. Essendon are still relying on the past of blind adherence to an omnipotent leader.They have managed to delay and this will allow greater transition strategies with less short term disruption to results (read gambling). There has been no market set to date on the odds of players involved in the programs and their future health outcomes (read workcover investigations)

If you are "not saying you dont dislike" and you are " not against the idea of not knowing", your "inability to disagree" may mean something. So easy to misinterpret double negatives. All in jest

I reckon its Essendon who are taking the pi55 jnr

And thanks for the reference to the general site I too do like my music eclectic as possible so will maintain a bit more of a watch on this

We probably have the rhythm section here and the heritage of Mayday Hills asylum means that it a state we can all comprehend. But appreciate the walking frame does provide inconvenient moments. The Angels are headlining a concert down here and await with interest their lineup. The Brewsters were magnificent there last outing here but did comment themselves about the altered life styles of an ageing group. Makes you wonder how Keef, Mick, Ronny etc keep doing it.

Good get Tim Thanks for the reference Did enjoy it The guitar is great especially the bottleneck segment. You are right it needs to be cranked up. If you are ever performing in NE VIc let us know It would be interesting to catch you if this is a representation of your music.

Great pics Thanks I have been reading some research on salmingrunning.com about aspects of footwear and effects on the body,(feet, legs, knees, hips). One of the things that is mentioned is the effects of heel strike and overstriding. Many of the pics particularly those when in kicking action show both these factors. There is a shot of Jones kicking and retaining a moderate stride and mid foot contact. It might be just a small thing but its the detail that your great shots show 666 . One of the papers evidenced that cushioning of the heel through footwear advances has not reduced injury and may lead to complaceny and lack of consideration of technique. At elite and high performance level these small matters can make a difference. Hope the correct running and movement techniques are being applied with our footwear supplier and through close appraisal by our fitness, health and coaching staff.

In this case the players are on a winner. If they are absolved of participating in a drug enhancement program they continue in an almost exalted role as a continuing player with attendant rewards and long term compensation from the club for their loyalty If they are seen to use drug enhancement program they sue the bejeesus out of the club for long term compensation

Would not want to lose Melbourne (our true heritage) as it ties us to the place and decreases relocation so should always reference Melbourne Demons. Demons is the abbreviated marketing term matching symbols Hawks Bombers Bulldogs etc and was particularly important in establishing visual brands for Crows and Eagles etc as interstate teams were added Its interesting that these marketing symbols are often abbreviated as well Pies, Dogs so Dees is the natural extension of the Australian common vernacular heritage which is economy of language. I have also posited previously that it lends itself to a distinctive cheering cry. GO DEES can be syncopated into a number of rhythms and can be used to convey pace expressively.

mention on Whats the Col thread that he (Garland) is rarely mentioned in training reports Ruffles said he was at the other end with defence Can anyone add any comment?

Hey lets get a giant horse and and ....Katy Perry .......and....and.....OH NO its been done

Maybe they are just preparing the football world for the, what seems inevitable, penalties. When they play a second string team it will because there is solidarity amongst all the players to support those poor innocent few who have been unjustly treated with less rights than the ordinary citizen.

Thanks rpfc and TGR for your insightful and instructive appraisal of these sessions. It helps me appreciate the complexities and the effort people are undertaking. I reckon your clubs whoever they are are fortunate to have people with your interest, passion and capacity. Feel free to continue to provide your perspective on this and any other coaching and team related issues. I will regard your posts with a degree more authority.

"players have less rights than ordinary citizens" Seems includes right to have phamacological experiments without oversight of workplace regulators, right to have requests for legal actions to be discontinued ignored, rights to meet AFL stipulated arrangements to be challenged by the coach. .

noted a bit of that zig zag in soccer where the ball is passed around a defender who was gaurding space. The player who originated the move then moved forward into space providing an alternative attacking option. Progress was made to attack . the only option to negate this is one on one which then requires getting a match up that is in your favour. Theres more to this training than meets the eye. Hope it is an indication of an enhanced performance.

I have noted previously that the intensity of a game seemed to produce the variance between training drills and match results. I was keen to observe a greater focus and apparent effort just from the photos you and others supply. You and others have noted that there seems to be greater intensity than past years. Is this continuing? Are players pressuring each other at every contest? Thanks heaps everyone for the reports which are filling me with a renewed enthusiasm for the season.

Hardy could have nothing to worry about it looks liked joker is on some sort of performance enhancing stuff

Lets hope the Dees visit there on grand final day soon

I think the players may as well continue training as they have already established that they cant read or comprehend. They also need to establish the impact of any decision will have on their future and maybe even to set a baseline for their fitness as it diminishes due to long term effect of drug taking. This is the worst feature of this matter that "unknown" drugs with unknown impacts have been knowingly administered . Little, Hird, the doctor, Danks etc must surely be held responsible somehow. Switzkowski has already identified the practice and for the AFL to allow Hird to continue association with the league is the scandal

Thanks WJ I got a bit overwhelmed the more I read. There seems to be a thoroughness from the beginning that belies any of the suggestions that ASADA or AFL have been unaware of what they were dealing with. Even the Federal governments apparently overblown involvement reported as political posturing can be seen to support the processes undertaken. The reference to International bodies must also send a shudder through any AFL player who may have dismissed the importance of advice proffered by any one about what they should or should not ingest, or indeed on any treatment. There may be a review of AFL compulsory obligations but I also see a clear intention of the AFL to control its sport and a greater sense of responsibility than I thought it displayed or possessed. There is much fascinating reading and much more to come obviously but I cannot see this sorry saga ending in anything but disgrace, disgust and dissapointment in and for Hird and the EFC. I hope it does not tarnish the AFL. ( and I never thought I would express that thought)

The issue wasn't even included as a news item and was only mentioned as a throw away line from Mitch Has been listed for the project on 10 and no mention on 9 Waiting to see how channel 2 features it

Finally a question on channel7 news to father Tim on the blow to James Hird This is nether a negative to the players or James or a positive for ASADA says Tim Makes you wonder why Hird bothered then? and how it would have been reported if he had won

Hird has to pay ASADA costs. Hope they are considerable. Was the length of preparation and presentation overdone to inflate the costs?

Now that Hird appeal is lost Does that mean the ASADA case will proceed any more quickly? Will an outcome be reached before the NAB cup?

Just waiting for 2.15 This site has shown some of the most interesting and conflicting debate of the issues. Thanks for all who contribute. I was talking to an Essendon supporter last night who is still adamant that this will all disappear as the afl cannot operate with Essendon rubbed out and if more than 2 players are rubbed out that will be the outcome. He was of course selectively using his understanding to justify his position. He says Hird is guilty and not supported by the club. He says that the AFL may lose some fed government funding but would pay that back and continue without ASADA. He says Workcover havent acted as there is nothing for them to act on He seems to think what many have expressed that until you see an actual injection of the actual drug as JP outlined it is all [censored]. He may be delusional. I congratulated him on his strong support for his club and hoped that he understood that the national and international impacts of drugs in sport is the issue here and may be bigger than Essendon. I hope that he and other EFC supporters are not lost to our game if the consequences of the actions are totally revealed and an Arnmstrong like admission is finally revealed.