Macca

Yeah ... home town decisions do occur. I freely admit that but how do you fix it? Other professional sports can't and if you think the problem is just confined to the Eagles, you need to look elsewhere as well. As previously stated, the sport needs to be fixed first. Make the game easier to umpire otherwise the problem remains. I see what you see ... but I'd rather address the problem from the front-end rather than the back-end. How do you reckon you'd go umpiring an AFL game? My view is that it's an absolute nightmare to umpire. Incorrect disposal is no longer incorrect disposal. Throws are allowed. I could go on and on And the umpires are acting under instruction. You should be blaming the league ... that's where the problem lies.

I agree but the sport needs to be improved dramatically for the complaints about the umpires to die down to a minimum. Even in the 'Open' footy of the 70's there were a thousand complaints. It's that sort of game. Small improvements won't be making much difference as it's a complete mess right now. But improvements need to be made, all the same. Just because I don't blame the umpires directly doesn't mean I've given up. The odd bit is that nearly everyone here is on the same page in terms of what we see ... it's the apportioned blame and the fix which are the issues. As for now, I'm not blaming the umpires where as others will. My fix ... post #136 Feel free to critique it or make any comments that you like. I would appreciate the feedback. Another question ... does the AFL even know how big the problem is? I reckon they just look at the $$$$'s.

Ha ha! Appreciate your feedback GCDees Read my post above for my fix ... but it is highly doubtful whether even 1 person would agree with my fix entirely Some of it yeah but all of it, not a chance. But I'm having a go because I see what everyone sees ... a myriad of mistakes. Most want to blame the umpires for those myriad of mistakes but I have always thought it was the actual game issue (the rules and how the sport is played) By the way, I have been hearing the same level of complaints about umpiring since the late 1960's. There has never been a year where the umpires haven't been in the firing line. So if it is every year as I'm suggesting, the outcomes are similar to the flawed drafting system we have. A system problem rather than a back-end problem.

It seems that as much as I am diametrically opposed to most on this thread I am at least putting up a possible fix willmoy Most others are just annoyed at the umpires and want it fixed ... full time umpires being the main answer But that would never be enough as the sport is extremely difficult to umpire right now and it is harder to umpire than it ever was Here are some of the suggestions that I have put forward previously ... all designed to improve the sport and make it easier to umpire - 15 a side - Either no interchange or 10 rotations per team for the entire match - More defined rules such as incorrect disposal being clamped down on and 'Around the neck' being paid for crude tackles only. Any ducking to be penalised retrospectively. - keep '666' in to accompany the above - Full time umpires - Kicking backwards to be outlawed (must kick over the mark) and a mark only paid if the ball travels at least 20 metres There's almost certainly more that can be done to make the game easier to umpire but that'll do for now. But there lies another problem ... most don't have a problem with how the game is currently designed or played ... many want the game to be left alone. 'Let the Game Evolve' is the catch-cry. My rebuttal is that unless we make the game easier to umpire, the problem with umpiring remains. And right now, I am not apportioning blame on the umpires. That's the back-end of a much bigger problem.

I said that the whole yelling and screaming at umpires is part of the sport For proof ... go to any game. The yelling and screaming is there for the whole match bar a few quiet spots here and there. And it has been going on that way since the 19th century Why? Because the game cannot be umpired correctly therefore there are numerous mistakes made. Therefore the crowd yells and screams at the umpires. It's not rocket science. So if you want every decision to be correct, please explain how that can happen. Genuine question. Has to be a feasible answer too. No pie in the sky stuff Be realistic.

I believe numerous people would be put off umpiring based on the hate, abuse, disrespect and anger that would come their way as a matter of course. And the word coming out from football bodies is that it is hard to attract umpires to the sport. In junior footy umpires are doubling up or umpiring numerous games on the weekend. And that has been the case for decades Of all the thousands of people who contribute or read this site, how many are umpires or would do it. I'm guessing very few. The proof in the pudding is in the eating. You could do it because as you said, umpires can earn in excess of $100k per season Why not give it a go? What have you got to lose? And for anyone out there who is a footy umpire, come on here and have your say. Those at the coalface would know more than us.

Whilst the football community continues to spread their hate, anger & disrespect towards umpires, not much should be expected in return. I mean, what do people expect? That catch-cry of 'They're only human' is an insult in itself (if you think about it) And because of that hate, anger & disrespect I believe we are never going to attract enough people to umpiring. Who would want to do it? So the umpiring ranks often attracts certain types as a general rule (in my opinion) You get what you pay for and it works both ways. Daisy Thomas shouldn't expect any favours given his way in the foreseeable future (if he is guilty) I have seen umpires being called cheats on this site hundreds of times. That sort of stuff creates a vicious circle. No good comes from it. Apart from all that, footy is by far the hardest sport to umpire so mistakes are going to be made as a matter of course If any sport needs video replay it's footy ... yet footy only has goal line replay and not much else. But bringing in video replay for all questionable calls would lengthen any given game by hours. So it isn't feasible. But I also believe that a large part of following footy is the whole yelling and screaming at the umpires bit ... it's part of the sport for most. It is part of the fabric of the game. That stuff matters not for me thus you get the other side of the argument

The real answer is to deconstruct and then reconstruct (kicking action) ... but I am not sure that any of the clubs have ever gone down that path often enough. At our club, has it ever happened? Under 18 players are not the finished product so therefore all aspects of a draftees game need to be looked at as soon as they arrive at a club. More so in the juniors if we're being proactive about it. The yips (or choking) in front of goal has a correlation to kicking actions. Stewart Loewe was one who improved his kicking in a substantial way but I can't think of too many others. The sport is more about keepings-off than it ever was so kicking to position is of paramount importance. Kicking for goal the same. You can't turn the ball over and you have to be accurate in front of goal. Practice makes perfect but practising with a poor action is often a waste of time. You'd like to think that the club would be on top of it but in the case of Petracca, his kicking action hasn't improved from what I have seen. And because if that, the yips can get worse. He'll be sledged about it too which will only accentuate the problem. But he is not the only one ... we have any number of players who have technique issues with their kicking. And we just lost a very winnable game (again) because of our poor conversion rate Footnote: Right handed Golfers who block the ball out to the right (under pressure) have technique issues. And they know it too so that's why they often reconstruct. Lefties the same. Doesn't always work though as muscle memory is a strong factor.

You need to be proactive on this issue if it is such a problem for you. Contact the AFL with your concerns. It is no good voicing your concerns on these types of forums as nothing will come of it. And don't ask me to do the same as I don't have a problem with the inconsistencies of umpiring ... never have, never will. And make sure you put your argument across in the same manner ... with the Melbourne Football Club at the forefront. And don't start using capital letters either. Send them a link to this thread while your at it it (Umpires hate Melbourne) ... you could also link up all the other similar threads from the various other clubs that are along the same lines. You want change, make it happen. Garner support from others but those others can't start arguing in a macro way all of a sudden. The argument has to remain as a Melbourne Football Club issue. Come to think of it, you might want to contact the MFC first. Let me know how you go dc

I might kick it back to Sunday's only for a while fellas ... just like the racing thread, need a break! Happy to continue on with Sunday's though.

I am as passionate as the next bloke ... and level headed (mostly) I did overstep the mark here last night and I do apologise for that. No excuses either. I spent decades on MC's and when you do that you learn very quickly that you can't make excuses and the winning comes from hard work, sweat & toil. And talent with good coaching. And you can't get sidetracked. The premierships followed. Laver & Federer just got on with the job and they are regarded as the 2 best ever. The Cats played fair and what a team they were. So it is entirely possible to be a fierce competitor and play sport in a fair manner and be very successful. Robbie is another great example - I never saw him once dispute a decision. Set a great example.

If we play to our best and kick straight we're quite capable of beating any team ... the talent is there despite Lever, May, Hibberd, Melksham & Lewis being out injured. Gawn, Brayshaw, Oliver, Petracca, T-Mac, Salem, Jones, Hunt & Harmes can all be very good whilst Frost, Garlett, Hore, Oscar, Fritsch and a few others can all play their part. Friday was encouraging despite our poor conversion rate ... I'd say most didn't give us much of a chance but I'm convinced that we kicked ourselves out of it. And that's a damn side better than not being good enough.

We have to win at least 2 of the next 3 to have any chance ... we can't be 4 & 8 by the time the bye comes around. 5 & 7 (or better) and we're a chance. Getting our good players back will help but if Gawn, Brayshaw, Oliver, Hunt, Harmes, Petracca, T-Mac, Jones, Salem & maybe Frost, Garlett & Hore can all produce their best in all the upcoming games, we can beat any team. It's a big ask but that's the standard required.

Jack will find his best form soon enough ... he's obviously carrying something which makes him look a bit proppy and not freed up in his movements. We've had a few like that this year including T-Mac who looked to have rediscovered his movement in the first half on Friday evening. Jones is another and Hibberd early on. Harmes took a while to get going as well and Petracca the same. From an overall team point of view the side seemed to spring into action on Friday night but we can't let our guard down in any given upcoming game. Have to win at least 2 of the next 3 games. We just need to bring our best. We've got enough good players available to win games.

In general we don't have a crowd factor in terms of influencing the umpires but every now and then we do ... we'd be at the bottom end of the scale though. Circumstances govern that way of thinking. As for umpiring decisions in our favour, that sort of thing is rarely acknowledged on this site ... when it's the other way around though, it's quite a different story. Read any game day thread or post match thread for confirmation. In the game on Friday night, we got the rub of the green in the first half but I didn't see any acknowledgement of that. Again, these are just opinions as many here would probably vehemently disagree with me. In the round 22 game last season at the Eagles there was a thread created here a month beforehand where various people chimed in with how much we were going to be on the receiving end of dodgy decisions. Didn't happen as there was barely a murmur about the umpires - we won the game of course so there's your probable explanation. You can keep asking me questions but the bottom line is that I see what everyone else sees ... my reaction is different. I've given you and others food for thought so we should close off.

Well people keep quoting me as they don't seem to like what I've got to say. I'm just replying in kind. Besides which, your side of the argument is repeated by hundreds of posters on a constant basis on numerous threads. My view is not even close to squaring the ledger And I believe that I'm right in what I'm saying ... for many here, they've never witnessed or even acknowledged the other side of the argument. As I said previously, it's drummed into us from a young age that the umpires need to be treated like the enemy. I don't agree with that assertion so there you have it.

Just an observation ... it might be crowd related, who knows. See, I don't believe we get a bad run with the umpires in general - so I notice it when we are the beneficiaries. I'd say most others don't as in my experience, too many get caught up in the injustice when we're on the receiving end of dodgy decisions.

The point I'm making is that umpiring errors happen (I see what everyone else sees) and that those errors happen for all teams - even the Eagles (more so away from home) So, it's not just us. But by reading this site, you'd think it was just us being on the receiving end of dodgy decisions. What do reckon opposition supporters would think of this thread for instance? "Umpires hate Melbourne" ... they'd probably get a good laugh out of it. And there's no admiration for the Eagles Fortress-like home ground advantage ... more so an acknowledgement that these things just happen. And the same things happen in a lot of sports. I have just never been one to blame umpires ... not as a player nor as a spectator. And there's others like me too ... they are just not very loud about their thoughts. For good reason too - who needs the angst? I do this every year for a couple of days and then I shut up. I like to send a message, that's all.

We are a long way off having a fortress-like home ground advantage ... it could happen as I suppose anything is possible but I don't even see the Pies or Tigers creating that sort of atmosphere at the MCG. Not against the other Victorian teams anyway. The Eagles have that mantle and their supporters know it. Us against the interstate teams? It's possible but the crowds we draw against the interstate teams aren't large anyway. Right now, the club needs to find a way to play high standard consistent footy. The rest takes care of itself if that happens. Besides which, I often find that we get a good run from the umpires when we play the interstate teams at the MCG.

We do it too (the 'Ball' cryout)... and so does every other supporter group. It is just that the Eagles fans create a fortress-like atmosphere that creates an advantage. A lot like Victoria Park, Princes Park & Windy Hill ... back in the day. And it rarely, if ever happens at the MCG. Footy Park was the same but I am not sure about the Adelaide Oval.

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Yep ... that is the real issue. If we were switched on from round 1 we'd be sitting on 5 or 6 wins. The fact that we are 3 & 6 is an indictment on the FD and the list. We wait around til round 9 before playing our best. Bit late.

I have also pointed out that certain teams in any sport will get more home town decisions than other teams In professional sports with full time professional referees. And that has been happening for decades. It is just a quirk of pro sports and it falls into the 'does happen' category. Good luck trying to fix it. I'd rather get on with it rather than get bogged down with injustice issues. And it's true, we generally don't have a home field advantage with regards to the umpires. Although, against a number of interstate visitors we've had a good run on many occasions. We're not always on the receiving end of poor decisions. We're often the beneficiaries. In a way, it all evens itself out although I do concede that the Eagles get a better run than other teams. But the fortress-like atmosphere that their fans create is the factor that contributes to that advantage. Some would say good on 'em for doing so. It's a lot like the various soccer nations having to play at Montevideo (Uruguay) I could give you a stack of other examples. Any number of EPL teams get a better run at home from the refs as opposed to away from home. Same deal for the NFL, NBA and the MLB. All with full time professional referees.

I reckon we got the best of the umpiring in the first half and into the 3rd quarter. And we often get the rub of the green in many other games. So it all evens itself out ... in my opinion. Do you remember the last 5 minutes of the QB clash in 2017? And equally, numerous people here are suggesting that I should jump up and down and complain bitterly. Not just on this thread either ... on numerous threads on a constant basis. it's never ending. I've never done it and I'm never going to do it (complain bitterly) As previously stated, I view the sport differently. Others think like me it's just that they don't want to get involved. It's a minority view obviously but so be it.