Macca

Carlton losing today now means we can't finish any lower than 6th unless Carlton can somehow make up close on 20% on our percentage. That equates to about 240 points (40 goals) What comes with that is at least one guranteed home final Of course, if we finish 4th or better we'll be guaranteed 2 finals and we may well play all our finals at the MCG (if the cards fall our way) So it won't be 7th or 8th

If I'm going to stick my neck out then I have to be prepared to argue my case So if you disagree with what I've said, that's fine. I can argue back. It's called a discussion and we don't have to agree So obviously, when it's a touchy subject like the one surrounding Jesse Hogan, there's going to be some to and fro And I'm well aware of that so the pushback is going to happen What's the big deal? It's not like any of us are involved in the actual decision making Just chewing the fat My motive is for the team to be a better team. As it is for everyone here If we were in a pub talking like this, I guarantee that we'd probably have a good laugh about it as we were stating our cases And I'd like to say I'm out of here as well but I just know I'm going to be quoted again! haha

Hogan wouldn't be the only KPF that we could look at So you are wrong about convincing myself ... the thread is about Hogan, not a general thread about KPF's If we did have a general thread about available KPF's his name would obviously be brought up Anyway, we've got Weideman as our no.1, no.2 or no.3 key forward this season and beyond (depending on injuries) ... unless JVR comes on or we get another KPF from elsewhere (and they are hard to acquire) What's your choice? Another year of Weideman next year or Hogan? By the way, I certainly wouldn't have Hogan back for sentimental reasons ... it's his footy that I'm interested in

I reckon if you (and others) were to look at players as commodities only, you might see things differently We often get too involved emotionally or detach ourselves emotionally. Where as my view is unemotional. More clinical As an example, Demon supporters hated Big Carl but when he came and played for us and then coached us, we loved the bloke Me, I never hated Carl for starters so when he came to us I just looked at what sort of value he would bring It's the same with Hogan, if we believe that he has got his act together off the field (on the field, he's playing quite well) then why put up a stop sign? Do you not believe that Hesse has got his act together? Are you concerned about a relapse? If so, why? So if he has got his act together and can play good football, there is no risk

I disagree We demanded those picks and got them. Do you not remember Peter Bell holding out? I'm not surprised that many will hold a grudge. That's how these things work (the mob mentality, group-think, the establishment view etc etc) Question for you What is your real issue with Jesse? Do you hate the bloke? Do you not have a forgiving nature?

So why on earth has he persevered with Weideman?

His 3rd chance at GWS has been his redemption so that can't be counted as a 3rd fail And if his 4th change of environment is also successful then that's 2 from 4? At the back end. Trending the right way I'd also argue that his numbers in his last year with us (2018) were very good. And we missed his presence in the 2018 Prelim final. He had a more than decent year in 2018 And technically, we'd be giving Jesse his 2nd chance at our club He had his father's death to deal with along with contracting testicular cancer He had a lot on his plate when he had his troubles He's got his act together and that's good enough for me. I'd have him back right now I'd the rules allowed it. Low salary and can play. Cost? At most, a high 2nd round pick. And it wouldn't be too difficult to prise him away from GWS ... they need to trade players We lack key forwards who can play and remain on the field What's not to like? I've thought all year that the difference between winning multiple flags (or not) is a functioning forward line. We could be back to Weideman as our main man in a week or 2 if Brown's knee plays up again Right on the eve of the finals Finally, Jesse wasn't part of a fire sale ... we valued him so highly that we ended up getting pick 6 & pick 22 for him from Freo ... and we turned those picks into May & Sparrow We could get him back for about pick 35 That's a bargain

The Lions have played well and will be tough to beat in a fortnight. They play their home ground well Carlton are ordinary and if we lost to them next week (with or without Cripps) that would be a huge disappointment 12.10 to 3.6 is damning

Even more damning if Ah Chee misses a game through concussion protocols At least 2 weeks, possibly 3 for Cripps

Players are responsible, that's just the way it is now. Matthews, Darcy & Hodge are too old school He'll get cited and could be 2 games out. Maybe 3. Looked blatant to me Ah Chee was subbed off as well Cripps is in trouble Unbiased view as well as I recognise that we play them next week

North are a rubbish team ... I'd say they are doing their best But their best is not good!

It is certainly not a silly thread for any number of reasons For a start, we need up and running KPF's for next year and beyond. 3 genuine types are needed when factoring in injuries So where do we sit right now? I'm not sure we've got 1 genuine starter unless Brown & T-Mac can be injury free in the future. And both will be in their 30's from next season ... injury prone in your 30's? Weideman & Mitch Brown are not the answer whilst Van Rooyen is a project player I understand Weideman is contracted for next season but we might view him as a 4th ruckman/spare KF. He can be the new Mitch Brown So, in an ideal world we bring in an established KF to bolster the ranks Who's available? Does our club give Hogan a 2nd chance? He's stayed out of the news for near on 2 years now and he can still play. I still view him as a proper forward who has presence and gets to the right spots We've all been afforded 2nd chances in our own lives so why not Jesse?

Ah yes, Civ The last hope is the mathematical possibility We've still got that one up our sleeve!

I remember that and at the time I thought I'd cop plenty of grief coming back, Col ... but that didn't happen. It's fair to say that the appraisals were rather damning! Fast forward to right now and most of our players are down on their best in some ways, haven't come on or have stagnated The optimists will point at our standout performances (Impressive Lions and Freo wins and our 10 & 0 start to the season) whilst the pessimists will focus on the 6 losses from our last 10. And both evaluations are correct in isolation But from an overall perspective, we are just not playing well enough right now. As a team or as individuals Beat Carlton and everything can change ... one win and then we play for the next win. And the next win would be for the double chance in the finals. It's all on the line and the way forward is crystal clear. We've eliminated the grey area with those losses

Numerous players are down on their best whilst others have stagnated or just not come on The best way to evaluate is to look at how we have played in the last 10 games 2 excellent games with 8 x Non A Grade efforts ... and that's way too many. 2 or 3 off days might be acceptable for a supposed A Grade team. Not 8 We were not all that impressive against the Crows & Port whilst we lost 6 of the other 10 games with below par efforts So if we are loading, tapering or whatever, it isn't working. It's like the pot of gold at the end of the rainbow

Fulham go ahead of Liverpool 2-1 with 20 minutes left. Who would have thought? Klopp pacing on the sidelines nervously Still time for the Reds if they're good enough

Oh and @layzie The last 15 times we've met the Pies in a final we've prevailed 14 times We own them in September!

Good outcomes don't come easy, layz Might be just the wake up call we needed, losing last night. We now know what's required to go deep in September. It's crystal clear and there are no excuses. If we were getting ahead of ourselves, that thinking will have disappeared In an odd way, Ed's words have made sure that we now need to clam up and just get the job done. I can see the team becoming totally focused now with no distractions As for Collingwood, they are a dangrous opponent and it will be a challenge to beat them next time. They are very efficient when they have the ball and they stifle the opposition when the opposition have the ball. Eventually they win the ball back and they are off They have close wins and they lose many of the stat categories but their efficiency wins out. They don't waste their opportunities. And they don't give up Every time they win the ball back they've got a plan to score with that opportunity A bit like when Tom Brady has the ball in his hands ... efficiency is the forte Our coaching staff can learn from how the Pies play ... we need to be more efficient and not waste possessions So we learn from the loss so it's not a total disaster (much like the Cats have learnt from their PF loss to us) We're still in the game and we've still got the game to win big

No sweat layz, we'll beat the Blues next week and then our destiny will be in our own hands (which includes playing for a top 4 berth with a possible re-match against the Pies or Cats first up in the finals) You've got to love a challenge and we'll be up for that challenge The next win changes everything and we will bounce back ... the lads will be smarting about last night's result

@Gorgoroth@layzie@Dee Zephyr@Go the Biff@Clintosaurus @JV7@DeeSpencer@Dappa Dan@titan_uranus@DemonDave@BDA The practice games have started already! Not that the result means much but the Jags went down to the Raiders on Friday There's a full list of games next weekend including the Packers @ 49ers on Saturday ... 10.30am Oz time If you've got the ESPN app, you'll find all the scheduled games If I get a chance I'll try and find what the main talking points are going into the new season (apart from the latest installment of the Tom Brady show!) Season proper kicks off on Friday Sept 9th (Bills @ Rams) Happy to run with the tipping comp again. We should get enough starters

Yep, they've got that home field advantage and England have traditionally done well in the track & field events too Looks like it's going down to the wire, TD Because of work commitments I haven't been able to watch and follow the games closely this time around ... and there's only 2 years to the Paris Olympics! Will try and catch up tonight, tomorrow & Monday. There's still a stack of medals to play for

Well it all kicked off this morning 9.30pm game tonight is Fulham vs Liverpool

All this talk about not wanting to get into a shoot-out is a bit moot If the opposition want to attack at breakneck speed through the corridor, criss-crossing or switching play towards goal then it's up to our team to stop them doing that (if we can) If we intercept then we are in a great position to counter-attack at speed. Hesitate and the moment is lost Teams are abandoning the safety-first way of playing (boundary line play or holding on to the ball for an eternity) Working for a stoppage can be counter-productive unless positives come from those stoppages One thing is for sure, we haven't played with an open forward line for most of the season. The other teams have flooded back with a high concentration on intercept marks ... and with the better teams, they intercept and then they are off to the races To play at that breakneck speed using all of the ground requires highly skilled players. McRae has summed up his list of players well and he is playing to their strengths

Oh, ok I often get right into the EPL later on ... that would be way different if I followed a title contender Would love to take a point off Man City in the early hours on Monday so am hoping that City are slow out of the blocks (hoping!!!) And how could I not embrace a player named ScaMacca? My kind of player, roy!!

We can obviously still win the flag but the forward line is in urgent repair Petracca forward, Max CHF, Van Rooyen in a forward pocket Add in Fritsch, Brown & Kossie and suddenly the forward line is much improved Backline & midfield is fine. No issues there Bowey can be the spare small forward (or ANB or Spargo) One of those 3 plays but 2 miss out Melksham out as well and Harmes can therefore go into the midfield rotations Petracca to spend 30% on the ball Forward line is the issue ... scores say otherwise but structurally we are being found out Teams are scoring freely or moving the ball out of our forward line with ease That has to change