Akum

Yep, this is my impression too. Last year it suited us to get the Melksham deal done quickly to be able to get others done. Dodo probably thought we caved in easily, but we had a larger purpose. Dodo doesn't do "larger purpose". This year there's no hurry about the Hibberd deal. We can wait until the last minute if we want to. If they're waiting on 29 for something else, too bad. They either won't get it, or (because we probably really do want Hibberd, whatever it takes) they'll get it with no time to complete their other trades. I'd hate to have Dodoro at MFC.

Probably just me, but I have this automatic reaction against any trade involving Essendon that doesn't result in them being completely done over.

This explains why Dodo might be holding it up.

Yep, this absolutely nails it. Applies to Dunn & Garland too. They all play in the way that they used to as recently as 2014, but we've completely restructured the defence according to the above. We saw a great example of it in the 3rd Q VFL GF, where these three won the ball in defence OK but were unable to do anything with it to relieve the pressure, either for tempo footy or to break out of the forward press by running it out or by precise disposal.

Fair enough, but there's a difference between mids who underachieved with another team before coming to us, and then in their 4th year have still underachieved with us (Newton, Michie & probably BenKen) and mids that we drafted who hasn't achieved much yet (ANB, perhaps JKH), especially if they've been injured. Surely the former are ahead of the latter in the queue to be traded or delisted?

An atypical game for ANB. He was excellent in the Qual final when we smashed them by 12 goals, and the Dogs picked him out as the one to be paid special attention. And they picked right - once they stopped him, we found it really difficult to move the ball forward and get any flow going, despite Clarrie's great clearance game. He was wearing Jed Adcock like an extra shirt for much of the game. Who tags anybody in the VFL?? He's prob never been tagged in his life before. The Dogs realised far better than we did how much the Scorps' running game - which carved them up in the Qual final - and that he was the key to it, and they did a brilliant job of stopping him.

This is your opinion, or something else?

Really hope you're right. On the other hand, at that point in time it may say a lot that Roos et al even thought it was worth meeting with a player who wasn't even a regular at Casey. Surely the brains trust would think differently about him now. He could develop into a real utility, in the sense of specialist "makes-a-big-contribution-wherever-the-need-is-greatest" utility, rather than "not-really-good-enough-for-any-one-position" utility. And therefore valuable to have on the list, especially if (God Lucifer forbid) a couple of our falls get injuries next year..

Well, they did pay the moon & stars for Carlyle. That should keep the fans happy.

He's got the type of attributes we need, and he wouldn't cost much. But he seems like an "in-between" type of small forward who may well end up just doing well for Casey. I'm all in favour of regularly trying out unloved C-graders from other clubs (e.g. Michie, BenKen, Newton), on the grounds that one of them one day might make the big leap up to become A-grade. Let's face it, you don't trade players like this in because you need another C-grader; it's because you hope that one of them will thrive in a different environment, or given a better chance. It's just that the hit rate isn't all that high. Almost all the time, you do end up with just another C-grader. On the other hand, trying to find the "next" Isaac Smith is going to cost a whole lot less than the "real" Isaac Smith.

Think this makes good sense, and can understand why we'd baulk at guaranteeing him the captaincy.

As far as I'm concerned, when you pick up a fringe player (especially a fringe mid) from another team, it's with the expectation that, given a better chance, they'll improve and move up a grade or three. You don't pick up a C-grade mid in the hope that they'll remain a C-grade mid. If they're still a C-grade mid after two seasons, there's not much point holding on to them. Apart from Vince, Garlett and perhaps Cross (though he was always that good) toward the ends of their careers, we've had success with only our GWS pick-ups - Tyson outstandingly, but also Frost & Bugg - and to a lesser degree Matt Jones. All others - Michie, Newton, possibly BenKen (though he still has another year) - haven't really moved on from where they were at their previous clubs. I really like Michie & Newton (and I really liked Aidan Riley), and part of me hopes that they will come good one day, but unfortunately it's hard to argue that they should be kept on our list, especially with the vast improvement in our midfield with the addition of Oliver, Brayshaw & Petracca and the improvement in Kent.

Yeah, but a lot less interesting. Know anyone who might apply?

Or grab "perpendiculating" arm at elbow & hold it up while teammate smashes into unprotected ribs.

On the other hand, Salem & Lumumba & Hunt are moving up the ground more & either getting into space or being put into a position where they're able to create space for others. This is just as important for zone defence. Since Dunn has been back (and Lumumba has been just as important) , the defence has been much better organised. Our forwards are now more defensive & our defence is more attacking!

I'm not convinced. Old-style poster, stuck in superficial assessments based on outdated views, and shows no understanding of zone or team defence. Game gone past him?

(Can't stop this quote appearing - sorry) Some have remarked about Jack Watts going around firing up all his fellow forwards after his goal at the beginning of the last quarter. But there's a telling bit of footage on the replay just before the next bounce. Marchbank goes to Watts, and Hogan physically pushes his way between them, while Watts stands in the way of the incoming Davis. They were working really hard to get the match ups to favour them - Hogan on Marchbank, and Watts on Davis. Both these match ups worked outstandingly well for us and were probably what got us home in the end, with both Hogan and Watts smashing their opponents in the last qtr. Is this our new "game analyst" at work???

About one great quarter IIRC.

It's Addam Maric, not Bennell - they're supposed to be top 20 picks. That's one of those useless pieces of knowledge that, no matter how hard I try to evict it from my memory, it just keeps on squatting there, taking up the room that could be used by something vitally important..

Yeah fair enough. Let's face it, he's had major surgery on each of his ankles a year or two apart. I guess the main questions are how well he'll recover from the surgery, and whether he's going to be susceptible to further injuries. If he recovers well & avoids further serious injury, the ceiling is very high, especially in combo with Hogan. Or he could be Gumbleton Mk.II.

If a tall player was coming back after ankle surgery ... ... could that perhaps influence his speed and turning circle?

Oh well, they did get Howe.

Looks very much like a half-smile too.

far too zen for this thread!

I think he's good at finding space in traffic too. If that's not speed or agility, it's just knowing where to run to - again, the best comparison is with Sam Mitchell, not quick or agile, just knows where to go. He also seems to have a good sense of when he's about to be tackled and has to unload, and when he's got a bit of space and can run it out of congestion.