Dappa Dan

I really wish we could do that in the AFL. The team-specific calls, that is. I've let my gamepass lapse finally. Too expensive, not worth it.

Welcome to the thread Zeph.

DV... Mate... What the hell are you talking about. What's this now. 10th quote and you're still full of hot air? Still haven't said anything new? Keep digging.

Ha. much appreciated Macca. You're a gentleman and a scholar as always. I have seen it, just the once, so I'll enjoy again. Yeah would be good to get the comp going again. Comps run quite well with 12 names. I have 2 others who I know would enjoy. Possibly 3. Maybe even 4 (myself included). You gotta have a critical mass of 50% of those really into it though or it descends into a bit of a waste of time, as it was last time. My brother and I actually started the original demonland AFL keeper league, and it was a similar disaster of abuse and misunderstanding. I pulled out when he was being abused, he pulled out soon after. So it IS a hairy concept. So I think I'll keep prompting everyone, and if they go for it one day, I'd be happy to manage. But until then... I'll be taking you @Gorgoroth @layzie @cowboy_from_hell down, and returning to my rightful place on the NFL thread throne.

Terrific stuff Pickett. A bit of mayo thrown in there with the wording too, I like it. But I STILL have the urge to put the gun-to-your-head question... I'll hold off for now though. OH YES THERE IS! lol Like Pickett, I'll be putting that question to you if we all live long enough to see Clarrie retire in the Red and Blue one day and get to take stock. You've more or less answered it for now. Robbie the best you've ever seen play the game? Says enough. And yes, great point on Ollie. If we want to break down players into types... Neitz is still the #1 KP forward. Hogan isn't there yet, and I suspect won't get there. Schwartz would have beaten Neitz by a nose... enough's been said on that topic. What Ollie does, though... Here's yet another way to look at it... You know how we're a poor club, and other clubs get these logic-defying players... Voss, Hird, Sam Mitchell, Ablett jr, Dangerfield, Fyfe... These absolute magicians that play the game in a way you don't really understand... Watching those guys as an opposition fan, you never really knew what it was like to be a fan of their club. We had so many stalwarts. Proud players who did more than I'll ever do... But we never had anything like this. And it's not a one-off year for him, or a short burst of brilliance. The whole league has taken notice inside of 50 games. Elite really isn't a big enough word. Some of the stuff he does... No-one else in the league does. You're absolutely right... If you really feel every possession that MFC gets, then watching him is a kind of joy none of us have ever known, other than when watching other club's players with a healthy dose of envy.

Maybe the one BIG area AFL has it over NFL. The spread of game times. I like your idea of watching live. Thing is, in a fantasy comp, you get the news more or less as it happens. I can't hack the 4-5am games... Sometimes I wish I wasn't hooked on fantasy footy. I still feel like maybe one day we'll have enough demonlanders to start a league.

Always one, isn't there. Aussie fans have a long way to go.

Yeah that's a good point. I wonder if you can prepare a young list of midfielders for that. I don't even reckon the coaches knew what they had when he was recruited. I remember in Oliver's second pre-season the media were always asking who's the best of the big 3 young players who've come to the club... Oliver, Hogan and Tracca. You expect Hogan cos of everything he does and what he represents. But nearly everyone had Oliver out in front. I was confused as I hadn't seen enough. Almost 2 full seasons on... and I get it now. So if he's only had 43 games playing at this level, how well can you know what he's going to do if you're a midfielder playing next to him? How do you coach the players around a freak like that to take advantage of the absurd Jedi-like things he does?

Yeah exactly, if you try to cram other names into the conversation, there's always caveats. Scott Thompson should absolutely be in there, but he left. Certain players are outside and he's inside. Certain players played what amounts to a different sport... So I understand there's a problem with oversimplification there when you ask "who's the best midfielder in your lifetime." Thing is... As you say, on pace, he'll have them all beaten very soon. I think I posed this question 21 games ago for the first time when he rounded out his second season, and in that time I expected people to throw restrictions on the question, or categories... and it's actually gone the other way. Now I'm wondering if he's the best PLAYER we've seen in our lifetimes. Never mind this midfielder stuff. I was 7 in 1987 so never really got the Robbie Flower experience that our long-in-the-tooth friends on here did. THESE are the guys I wanna hear from. What would Clarry have to do to get into the Flower/Oliver conversation? I sometimes ask a similar question about Mitch Johnson's ashes series and push them on a comparison between that series and how Lillee played. How close were they, who was scarier, who was faster etc etc... And it's that sort of level of comparison. I can't make the comparison, so I look to my elders. The Jedi thing. Mate... it's not one a week. It's many of the contests he goes to. There's the thing a player like Braysh does where he barrels through and by force of will releases a loose ball. With Oliver, my best guess is that as a kid he had a coach who told him to set up at a clearance and look closely at where your opposition is... then if the ball falls to you (and it does, cos of Max), get it as soon as you can and release as soon as you can in the direction that those oppo players AREN'T. It's like watching Vader predict where the lasers are going to be before he light-sabers them away. And it's not just one massive play. He does something freaky at 5-10 contests a game.

I mull this over every time he puts another paragraph on his legend. Is this what we'll have or will he adapt further. I don't wanna be glass half empty, but I think it's pretty much what we see now. He's taken the criticism and I think doubled his metres gained this year. They put him forward on the weekend for good results. But I think mostly he won't get quicker, or find a bigger tank. The only jump up we might see is 10% when other clubs start playing youth and he's 25+. He is already so professional. Genuine question... Who was it 20 years ago that he hasn't overtaken yet? I put this to a mate who was born in the early 70s... who's the best midfielder the clubs seen in your lifetime... and he said Todd Viney. Clarry hasn't quite got the accolades Todd did yet, but I think it's fair to say he'll go past him. That's amazing. I remember seeing it when he was drafted and thinking, ok yeah, sure, but is he quick enough? I didn't know that that wasn't just his highlights. That's every contest he goes into. His pattern recognition and ability to understand when his opposition is off balance... he's like a Jedi. Man, the recruiters really do earn their money.

NOW try and edit that to make it seem like you were making a sensible point. Bold away. What I am TRYING to do is get you to stop quoting me. I don't WANT to block you, as it's a terrible way to go about a footy forum with strangers, and I can see you're not a troll, you're just hopelessly misinformed, and you're really very very bad at understanding Australian Rules Football. My interest in Jesse Hogan, demonland and posts promoting the idea of trading him (which you're backtracking on now, but I've PROVEN you want to do above, not that I expect you to see the simple fact I've shone a light on) is to debunk the ridiculous, and frankly absurd idea that the club gets anywhere with the trade you propose. Get this through your head. I DON'T BELIEVE WE NEED ANOTHER BIG NAME MIDFIELDER. Why? Because I'm not stupid. You can think what you want, but you open yourself up to ridicule when you try to pass your crackpot theories off as "facts." If we do need another player, midfielder or otherwise, there's plenty of other avenues to take. Our list is the envy of almost the entire league. You seem to have it in your mind that we need to have draft capital to trade on to get the next Dangerfield or something. No. What you NEED is to secure a good core of players, and allow the draft/free agency/wantaway players to take care of themselves while the core matures. Oliver, Hogan, Trac, Salem, Viney, Lever, Brayshaw, OMac, Fritsch, Hunt... THESE are the guys you cling to, and when you have needs you look to what you have to let go of, then you draft and trade accordingly. What we HAVE is two guys that are among the best KP players in their positions IN THE ENTIRE LEAGUE... who are not even 25 yet... And you want to say sayonara to one of them to get in "a couple" of top line midfielders. If that's true, then does Harmes get a game? You know Harmes? Our BEST midfielder on the weekend in the biggest game we've played in 12 years? Who outplayed Oliver, Tracca, Shuey, and a host of others? We have the IDEAL list build to contend for the next 5 years, spearheaded by a guy who's been a superstar from the first day he wore the red and blue, in the best attack IN THE GAME... and you want to break it up because you think we have too many KP forwards. And you think you're being CREATIVE?!!! Get a grip. Stop panicking about the state of our midfielders. They're growing at exactly the rate they should, maybe even AHEAD of where they should be. The big names that will represent the club in the Bartel/Ling/Scarlett/Ablett roles are already there... it's just they've only just ticked over 50 games. Like you, I'd like to see a touch more silk (though not at the expense of hard at it players)... Everyone in the league is looking for that. But we CAN get it through other means. Face facts. Hogan is NOT someone we push out the door. As I've said before, if he wants to go, then that's a WHOLE other level of damage control. But until he shows signs that he's out, we get every last minute out of him we can. And as I say, you go ahead and have your wacky ideas. That's what we're here for. But you can expect me to prove again and again how daft this one is.

That's news to me. Excellent. If Foles went to greener pastures and we had Sudfeld as the backup, I wouldn't be altogether annoyed. But it'd be a sad day.

I CAN tell you what it is you want.... Because you already TOLD us what you want. You see how to use the quote button? PLEASE stop using it on my posts. You've said nothing new for, what are we up to? 8 quotes now? When you come up with something new that ISN'T idiotic mindless babble about trading the best forward we've had since Neitz... THEN feel free to post away. But even then, please... Let me type this nice and slow now since you've ignored it yet again... DO NOT QUOTE ME.

Would you categorize both as career backups? Or is Kizer looked at as an heir to Rodgers? What would you suggest is Rodgers' retirement age? 40+?

Started well hasn't he. Very interesting. Like I said last year, I thought Hundley was gonna be ok. But as time went on he did make a bit of a fool out of me.

It's amazing we have (easily) the best attack in the game given the quality of our inside fifty ball. Even on the weekend it was spectacularly bad at times. Goody's got a quantity over quality thing going with inside fifties... But I'd love to see us use our good kicks going inside fifty a bit more, rather than solely out of defence. Salem is a good example. Melks has already covered himself in glory in this field. Kent is a really, really important player in this regard.

Will he ever. I had no idea the umpiring thing was such a hot topic for WC and their supporters.

Yeah the whole league has learned so much from us. I wonder if you remember around the time Neitz was wrapping up and we turfed all our stalwarts like Bruce, Yze, Robbo, White and others. Either tapped them on the shoulder or played them less... and went hell for leather at a youth policy that saw us in the doldrums for over a decade. I remember back then I has such faith in the club to teach and bring up young players, and wanted the mediocrity gone so badly I was all for a full top-down rebuild. Roos got it right though. Get Cross and Vince to teach the kids and buy in to the new squad mentality. Brilliant. Long way to go of course, but it's now been definitively a successful investment. Need to cultivate a Howie Roseman now. Mahoney, anyone?

Coach's dream isn't he. Weed has to play whatever games we get for the rest of the year even if he struggles. You gotta see what you have. And even if he fades in and out of games, he only needs a quarter to impact it. And barely anyone's stated yet the difference it made to Max's game being able to have a chop out who has an impact at the centre bounces.

So you've been wrong for two years now. That is new information. Can't say I'm interested in it, or that it matters. You absolutely DO want to trade him. Go back over our recent messages and your "play Weed, trade Hogan" stuff and say with a straight face that you DON'T want him to be traded. "Truth be known" that's not a truth in any way shape or form. Jesse has been tried up the ground as a roaming CHF, midfielder, even the odd stint in the ruck and desperation move at CHB. He's kicked bags of goals again and again playing as a deep forward, at a better rate that some of the games GREAT deep forwards, all in a time when defence reigns supreme. I must have said this half a dozen times, and every time proved you wrong. I won't be doing it again. Put your fingers in your ears all you like, just don't quote me. Weid will be a great deep forward will he? Well you may be right. How many games has he played as a deep forward? How many goals has he kicked? How many did Jesse kick with a poor midfield in his games at the equivalent time? Once again, your formatting needs help. "On the other hand, 'Weide' will be very good deep forward" is an opinion built on... well I can't for the life of me see what it's built on... but it's an opinion. The FACTS are that Jesse, in a direct comparison, is already ten times the deep forward Weed is. You wanna talk predictions? Then I go back to what I said over and over and over again... Let's come back to this when their careers have settled and see how they look. "Now, with these forwards, and Tmac as well.... who plays CHF just as well as Hogan" No. He doesn't. He's kicked a lot of goals, but he's not as good as Hogan is. How often do you see them triple team Tmac. "what else do we have as options, to get the class Mids into the lineup, which we need." Free agency. Trade. Draft. Any other questions? We'll be fine with the brigade we have + the regular influx of players. We're a destination club. We DON'T get better by trading out the second best young KP forward in the league. What's this now. Seven times? "So, there's some more facts, for you to chew on." Give me strength.... Those were for the most part OPINIONS. Not FACTS. How long has it been now and you still don't know the difference? I'll say it again. Please stop quoting me.

Pointing out facts, DV. You should be used to it by now.

Recruiting of Neeld. Trading of Thommo. lol

I was with you when my brother suggested it halfway through last year, and I laughed in his face. So we took a closer look and I have to say... he's made an absolute fool out of me. But we all see the game differently. We could come back to this later in his career. There actually isn't too much data to go off as far as his field kicking goes.

Oh I do. But it's nothing compared to the GFs. Again. Just my opinion. Not trying to change your mind, mate. Oooh yeah. I still have mates who are yet to come back to following MFC closely since the Balme era. Daniher was my big one. Two finals = Div title. Yeah I get what you mean. If you're good enough to be in the top 6 in a conference (6/16) then that's mathematically harder than making finals in the AFL (8/18). So I get what you mean.

Jesse has no problem with a hard ball. What I'd like to see him eradicate completely is him appealing to umpires while the ball is still live.