Dappa Dan

You're right. He's worth that and a player. It all comes down to how you value the guy. Many on here have him as a fly in the ointment who's a distraction and only gets in the way every trade period. The same people say Wiedeman is basically just as good. I'm not with them. I've been watching all his games just like everyone else, and I think he's a generational talent, the best KP forward under 25, and will go down as the best of his era. If you don't see it that way, then I won't argue with you. Hell, you may be right... But if we're talking value, what we're losing, what we stand to gain... Then you have to run an experiment, and imagine the best sub-25 KPF you can imagine in your mind. THEN apply a trade value. Aside from how we see him though, fair enough, I can't argue.

I've watched us get screwed while clubs like Hawks and Pies give up junk for players like Omeara, Aish and others... I see your point. 2 firsts etc etc... My view, and I've been saying this for a long time now, is that 2 firsts isn't actually enough. It sounds great, but break it down. The two Freo picks are likely 4 and 5 (5 and 6 after Lynch moves)... which isn't enough to get Max King. We would get May and another mid. Or May and a pick. Hell, even IF Max fell to us at 5, he's a 200+cm player... we had Watts and Weed take years to do anything of use, and neither were anything like the value Hogan is. Even if a KP player taken at that age came on, it'd be 5 years from now when we're in a different window. That's IF those picks turn out good at all. Which so often, they don't... especially talls. Hogan, Weed, TMac... Now becomes TMac, Weed, Preuss... Spare me. Lever, Omac, Frost now becomes May, Lever, Omac.... An improvement, but not much of one. I just rate Jesse that highly that even 2 picks, while the going rate, doesn't fill me with enthusiasm.

I have a sneaking suspicion the last time he signed, he agreed behind closed doors to extend two years until the new CBA was done, with a view to leave then to maximise his value.

Bloody hell. So we have Jesse contracted for another season, which is a better position, and we're still not going to get two firsts?

I can't seem to find the details anywhere... but what was Lever when he came to us? Contracted? For a year or two more?

Another thought for those still in shock... I wonder if, had Jesse not done his foot... And was still playing and starring for us in finals... would be be seeking a trade?

I think most people were saying they didn't want him to be traded. Not that he absolutely wouldn't be. Subtle but important difference.

I haven't seen much of him... I know he's contracted and signed away.... what's he like (modern player comparison)

You're assuming people give a stuff about "points value." That sort of stuff matters when you're dealing with the clubs who need those points for academy players. In the real world a first rounder, or early first rounder is of huge value. Consider this year losing Hogan... and getting pick 5 and a player. Is pick 5 enough to get Max King (if they want him)? If not, then it's not as valuable. Points be damned. The same is true of the Lever trade. We did it cos we had identified the kids we wanted, and knew we could get them later. Fritta, Spargo... these guys have worked out fine. It's not madness at all. They didn't choose to trade him. He's wanting out. They're making the best of a bad situation.

Agree. And I believe we said the same thing when Lever was up for trade last year. Still. It jangles the nerves a bit.

Melbourne’s starting point in a trade for Hogan would be to ask for Fremantle’s first draft pick, which is currently No.5 but will be pushed back to six by a Tom Lynch compensation selection. There might be other components to that trade but they would be unlikely to also receive Brisbane’s pick 4 for Hogan if they traded it to Fremantle for Lachie Neale.

Trading Hogan for a pick 5 that probably won't be early enough to get a King twin, and even then will take 5 years to teach him... assuming he's any good... Which we know from the Watts situation, is fraught with danger. This is a [censored] joke. Again we get screwed. Generational talent, and poof, gone before he's done anything.

Melbourne’s starting point in a trade for Hogan would be to ask for Fremantle’s first draft pick, which is currently No.5 but will be pushed back to six by a Tom Lynch compensation selection. There might be other components to that trade but they would be unlikely to also receive Brisbane’s pick 4 for Hogan if they traded it to Fremantle for Lachie Neale.

Can we get a King twin?

I'm worried that we're not. One year to run, just has to say he's not signing and we're screwed.

That's one of the more brutal posts I can remember reading.

I suspect you're right, but we are being pushed to a trade we wouldn't otherwise have taken... and possibly for unders. Get ready people. Apparently it's happening. Brace yourselves. This one will hurt.

I wouldn't call Wentz dual threat. Wilson definitely is... I have Wentz a bit more like Romo. Can squeeze out of tight spots unusually well, and avoids tackles if needed as he's bulky and strong... Which means sometimes he'll run for 10-15 yards out of nowhere. Wilson, TBH, scares the hell out of me as an NFC fan. He's so good. And yeah. Fitz might be your huckleberry. Some veteran guy who can come in and not lose you games. Winston is back this week, so you'd think it's possible they put him back in.

Sigh... I'll go through it yet again... LITERALLY as soon as Hogan went out, our average score per game dropped for the season. It's not Naive. It's a fact. He's a superstar of the competition and we're not "better" without him, no matter what garbage footy media you're swallowing. What's Naive is thinking that because Kingy has to write articles about potential trades, it suddenly makes sense to trade away arguably the best KPF in the game under 25. Jesus I'm getting sick of going over this. He missed 2 H&A games and 2 super finals in which Weed played well, but didn't even come close to playing the kind of footy Hogan has played for... going on... 4 years now. Don't believe everything you read Doc. We're not better with Hogan playing for someone else. And he hasn't been "found out"... He was playing injured since the bye, and on one leg still managed 2 100+ SC games, and 2 in the nineties before he had to call it a day. You want to see a player found out? Wait and see what happens when they lock down on Weed as he grows to superstardom.

Can't believe the myth that we look better with Jesse out is still going.

I'd happily have Eagles hand him over. I don't think they'll go for it though. Apparently Foles has right of refusal, and wants to start somewhere for more than 13 games. Jimmy G will be back under centre week 1 next year which has Nicky Franchise out of a job again... I reckon you should look at the only man who's thrown for 400 yards in 3 consecutive games in history... Fitzpatrick. Couldn't agree more. I have Mike Vick as my Avatar cos he got me into NFL. But dual-threat QBs just scare the hell out of you. Newton will probably go down as the best ever and he's not even that well liked. The whole time you watch guys like that have flash in the pan seasons, Rodgers, Brees, Brady, Manning just keep on keeping on. Wentz now too... elusiveness but not reliant on his legs. You get one of those out of a draft and you sit back and enjoy being relevant for the next 15 years. Luck has been devastated by injury, but even through all that, Colts fans know he'll EVENTUALLY come back and do things.

Yeah the question was always can Foles hold down his spot. As it turned out just holding his spot wouldn't have been enough. He needed to be a superbowl MVP to beat Brady, as he ended up having a great game himself. But it's still a fair point to make. Making playoffs was almost certain by the Rams game, but I was worried about superbowl wins... and without the main player who got the results... I had to pick Eagles to not go far. It's still unbelievable even 6 months later. lol... Not gonna dignify that Eli comment.

This is why I wrote Eagles off last year after Wentz. It's simply too big of an injury to come back from. Different circumstances of course, and timing... Most of the heavy lifting had already been done by Carson... But it felt like it was over. Speaking of Wentz... He didn't exactly set the world on fire, but I have to say, I forgot how good he looks when he's on. Eagles season has started.

2 in top 5.... Great effort. Did Braysh missing out on the first few rounds cost him the medal?

Miami 2 games clear of all the other three teams in their division will have that city humming.