PJ_12345

It's their club too WYL. They also support the dees, they also have donated alot of their spare time, money and sanity to help this club - like everyone else here. Again, to suggest that DM has has sat on his arse, "enjoyed the free food" and hasn't tried to improve the club is plain offensive. As WJ said re the tanking, we made the right decision - it'd done, move on. The $500,000 fine is tough, but at the end of the day the most important thing is that the club is ultimately not guilty and our draft picks are secure. I don't know about you, but I would never risk the chance of losing Viney, Toumpas, being guilty of tanking and being more in debt. As for 'I'm not a quitter/dont support quitters' - I hope you don't smoke.

Churnalism.

I'm not saying don't track his progress, I'm saying track it with something comprable - not a goal he wants in 3 years

We the case good? Yes. Was it water tight? No. Is there good precedent? No. Do you know what judges usually say to sporting clubs that take their code regulator to court say? This is not a matter for the courts, there are rules in place, if you have failed to act in those rules, which your regulator has said you have, then bad luck - f&*k off. WYL I don't think you appreciate the repercussions of if we went to court and lost. We would have been charged, we would have had a bigger fine, we would have had much more significant costs, we would have lost Viney and Toumpas. The case wasn't water tight - it was grey as grey can be - and in the courts grey can be argued as easily for as against. Its true we are the worst team. In history? No. I'll try and find an article a few weeks ago which addressed our previous crapness No one is sweeping any of this under the rug. Don has done a number of things, ie delt with the tanking - just because they didnt do what you wanted to, doesn't mean he hasn't done anything.

Performance has been terrible - but what did you expect? To fix our list some have to go and thanks the the beautiful nature of drafts/trades - if you have to drop alot, you'll get stuck with the current list we have - crap. But rebuilding is a long process, no one said this would be quick! Gains for 2011 was Sellar, Magner and Clark Gains for 2012 was Viney, Jones, Terlich, Evans, Dawes and Byrnes Gains for 2013 was Hogan, Barry and Toumpas We have got rid of the dead weight and for once got some good players coming in next year! I had wrote off this season at the start. I also dont expect us to win another game for the rest of the season. I dont want quick fixes and a few wins, I want this culture rebuilt and the list overhauled. Then I want the wins I think we should get!

Feel free to judge him but dont compare 3 year goals with 1 1/2 years progress. Apples and apples. Is MN capable of meeting his goals? Yep - has a proven track record. BUT Can MN, the FD, and the players meet his goals?... at this stage no way in hell. Our result is because of all of them are failing. Viney and MN sorted out our list. Got some great hopefulls coming through, got rid of the dead weight but as a result our list this year is crap - the seniors could have been handled better in 2011. Jackson will sort out our FD and organisational structure, and help with choosing a new CEO. As for the coach, I'll support MN till the end of the contract.

Right about Sheahan, apart from that MN's work doesn't look that bad (see below) 2011 National Draft: National 2 36 Rory Taggert Melbourne 0 National 3 52 Josh Tynan Melbourne 2 National 3 54 James Sellar Melbourne 20 Rookie 1 6 Jai Sheahan 0 Rookie 2 24 Thomas Couch Melbourne 3 Rookie 3 42 James Magner Melbourne 17 Rookie 4 59 Leigh Williams 0 Delisted: Maric, Campbell, Johnston, McNamara, Wonaemirri, Newton Traded Out: Warnock Traded In: Clark 2012 National Draft: Mini 1 2 Jesse Hogan Melbourne 0 National 1 4 Jimmy Toumpas Melbourne 3 National 2 26 Father/Son Jack Viney Melbourne 6 National 3 48 Dean Kent Melbourne 2 National 3 52 Matt Jones Melbourne 7 National 4 68 Dean Terlich Melbourne 6 National 4 71 Rookie Promotion Daniel Nicholson Melbourne 4 National 4 72 Rookie Promotion Michael Evans Melbourne 5 Rookie 1 3 Nathan Stark Melbourne 0 Rookie 2 19 Mitchell Clisby Melbourne 0 Delisted: Petterd, Bate, Nennell, Cook, Sheahan, Williams, Lawrence Free Agency: Moloney, Rivers Traded Out: Morton, Gysberts, Martin Traded In: Barry (mini-draft), Dawes, Rodan, Pedersen

His goal was a long-term target and you're judging him less than 1 and a half seasons in. Not really a fair or comparable time frame is it?

Choco is already signed up at Richmond if my memory serves me right.

Spare us WYL with the tanking, every post you raise it up. It would have cost more, still wouldn't have been settled by now, and we would have lost - no good precedent for sporting clubs and codes in the courts. If we had a water tight case we would have gone to court, but we didn't so move on. The club was found not guilty, and most importantly our draft picks were secured. Also people can debate about the good and bad decisions he has made (that's fair), but to suggest he has sat on his arse, "enjoyed the free food" and hasn't tried to improve the club is plain offensive.

Fair call WYL. For me I see the culling of players like Morton, Gysberts, Cook, Bennel ect as improvement.

Why the f*&k would anyone want to be involved with this club?? Seriously, if I were a potential board member, CEO or coach I would laugh and walk the other way... we act like Peter Jackson actually wants to stay with this club, we act like experienced coaches are abundent and if they are they want something to do with the club, we act like we can axe a coach or a player, pay off their contract, and dont worry guys we will just throw millions at another, we act like axing will solve all our issues, all we do is complain about past events which we cannot change - move on, we complain about how the club settles on tanking, but forget at the end of the day it meant we were found not guilty, was cheaper, and we secured our draft picks - which such as Viney have been our best players, but what pisses me off the most is that we elect a coach who wants to change the culture of the club so we don't continue to be the worst team in the AFL like we have since the past 6 years, and then after 18 months call to axe him over short-term results. The culture of the club and players is toxic, the culture of the supporters is terrible and short-term orientated, the precedent of how people who have tried to change it have been treated is poor, the players are not only talentless but worse effortless, and the media loves to have a dig at us... why would you jump on board a sinking ship? Haha and we act like people want something to do with this club...

His right - there was no effort. Get rid of the blazers, get rid of the "first and forever" slogan. I can't help but feel that these inhibit this lazyness, that the players take where they are for granted. That they can go out there, produce such an effortless performance, and think that there are no repercussions. We might be first, but if they keep up this effortless perfomance we wont be forever.

I think Rodan is a fill in for when Viney isnt there Also Cook wasn't even good enough for VFL let alone AFL... there was a reason he never played an AFL game - no muscle, no skills, not worthy of taking someone elses place

Out: the whole team In: the Auskick kids

Again, as I said originally said, its not uncommon. It isn't a black mark, the loan was paid quickly (loan term was 2 years), obvious were structures in place (it was secured and interest was paid) it's done and move on. You say the board should be accountable for this years debt, when I raise up then that they should also be accountable for the debt demolition you go on and talk about donations, but still don't give them credit for raising that money - as if it will just walk in off the street. And then go on about profit and sustainability You say that employee loans are blasphemous and a governance perspective a no no. When I raise up it is common place, and that it is non-existent in public companies (which is true)... yet so conveniently neglect private companies which is where it most commonly takes place... You consistently sidetrack, dodge and change most of my comments. Starting to get annoying Let me lay it out for you: You give the board credit for this years forecasted loss - shouldn't you give them credit for wiping out the $5 million debt? Are employee loans common place in business?

Don't have time to go through every club's financial reports but I'm am 100% sure there are other clubs and similar instances, probably not such a high amount, but its not uncommon - particularly with businesses and directors I don't have an issue with it, it was paid. I don't encourage it, but Stynes approved it, it was paid... Again I wouldn't encourage it but its not uncommon in business. An no its not a corporate governance no no. Provided there are the right structures in place and its not on something silly like a handshake

Who will coach in between? Mo money, mo problems... never thought I'd quote Biggie Smalls Keep Neeld till CEO sorted and in between see who is out there. We tried Viney before as an interim coach and that didn't go too well... there is always Craig, but again, more money.

Difference is PJ said this before the game, and that was said after...

I know about Jackson, even listened to him before the bounce at the game (addressed his connection with the AFL. Said the MFC contacted AD asking for if there were any experienced CEO's out there, AD called PJ and asked if he could forward his name, and the board elected him). I think your looking into it a bit too much into his media blitz today and Neeld. Particularly considering he was saying we need to give Neeld time. Jackson's experience showed 100% today... I rate him highly.

I am not disputing your view on supporters/donators. RE the loan its not uncommon. I don't have an issue with that, other clubs also have done similar things.

Saying we can't judge Neeld 18 months in??

I am so frustrated at Neeld, I am so frustrated at the players. Watching from the stands today highlighted how poor our standards are. It was unbelievably bad, I cant believe some of the things I saw behind the play... just basic basic stuff

Wow

Tommy mac is out due to shoulder - davey in...