Go Ds

GW said "It’s not easy. It’s actually bloody hard. The looks on some of their faces broke my heart, especially the young boys. I wish all those who relentlessly bag our players could turn up to Gosch’s on a day like yesterday to see the hurt on their young faces" I can't see your problem with this. Many people don't like seeing strangers upset, let alone acquaintances ( or whatever GW and the players are). One can be more excited for someone who just won Tattslotto than another who just won a $20 pub voucher. But for both there's a degree of joy. Similarly one can sympathise with someone whose icecream fell into a puddle and then minutes later have more sympathy for someone hysterical at a car crash site. Melbourne players feel like **** at the moment. How they learn and move on from here could be argued. But I'm not sure why you're doubting their emotions or applying Whataboutism to this.

Possibly. I certainly don't know exactly what the High Performance team is or what Mission's role was either.

Hmm, interesting theory. I'm sure there are plenty in the inner sanctum that knew where we were at for the past 5 or 6 seasons ( or ends thereof)

Hmm, I would've still been scratching my head but assuming you're right about Misson I stand corrected. Obviously not everything a player does at home will be monitored. But I'm surprised with all the ways a player's ability and performance can be measured that much escapes a fitness coach.

Fingers crossed But like fanmail it would very easy for such a letter to not get proper consideration.

Yep. I get people venting their spleen. Honestly at times I get the feeling some people only support a sports team just to whinge and moan. We won't stop this. I certainly screamed and swore at my TV as we lost the unlosable. But ultimately it's not constructive and I suspect most of the time damaging. No one needs to say a thing that the club and players don't already know. Often it's best to let people work through their problems in peace. Too bad that's impossible in this city's "AFL goldfish bowl" with now 24 hours a day commentary.

Surely almost every factor is the responsibility of both coaches AND players. If not that creates opportunities to avoid responsibility and the positive change, you rationally desire, doesn't happen. This is not my wheelhouse. But I'd assume come the break after Mad Monday the coaches will at least give advice how to return for preseason reasonably fit and the players follow it. Actually on the same theme wouldn't players get instructions all the time for their weights program, cardio, nutrition and so forth ... and the players follow them? And don't clubs monitor a staggering amount of stuff? I'm sure players think they had their usual hard-running game until the GPS shows otherwise. Anyway we do need to improve fitness. But unless players are deliberately cutting corners or being uncooperative it's incumbent on the coaches to help guide and redirect players towards those goals.

Umm, you seem to be deflecting. GW was pointing out that the players do care about our horrible loss and season. Surely no one's claiming they're the unluckiest people on the planet.(!) As to St Kilda's 666 "plan" could it simply be that Wanganeen-Millera knew he had a great chance of running inside 50 , and same as for many decades, the tactic of creating space can let a player be found separated from opponents? It could well be no team had a contingency plan for what fate dished up for either team last Sunday.

Actually an interesting question. Do Melbourne supporters prefer being miserable or euphoric?

Yep, even after yesterday's demoralising capitulation I still roll my eyes at the hysterical negativity here

Maybe they do care but as per the quote Gawn's said I think originally from Daniher "when all is said and done more is said than done". Yes, it's crude but when will the Melbourne FC stop putting its **** in the blender?!

Yep! And if staff or players just hope to succeed they probably should be moved on. (BTW that wasn't my main point)

I'm sure I could find others. But don't forget other teams have these moments too. Even IF we're the worst it may well be only slightly. (We only concentrate on our team.)

Ok. I agree with a lot of that. But still a club's employees mostly would "go into work" each day focussed on on-field success. I don't think the fact that even the 18th team gets a cut of the pie means many in the staff want to just coast along.

What are you talking about? Maybe there are players or staff that prioritise getting more spare time who take short cuts. But overall surely every club wants success, success, success even it's more a coincidence that that's the same thing the supporters want. Surely no one on the MFC payroll wanted that result today nor would be surprised supporters didn't either.

A) If the players are at fault it seems bizarre they'd not only claim it's not them but also go out of their way to throw someone else under the bus. Regularly players would get delisted not due to lack of ability but because they downright refuse to follow coaches' instructions, and come October, they've used up every last bit of coach leniency. Ive no idea why our players cannot get things right. But it might mainly be selfish or stupid players or conversely it could be you're right and Goodwin should be turfed before November. B) If Goodwin has lost the players a much easier plan is to just keep failing spectacularly - a 10 goal loss to West Coast next week may well save everyone a fortune. Just keep in mind if he hasn't lost the players his sacking may do more harm than good for team morale and suddenly like with GC and GWS's debut drafts we're forced to watch Tasmania take the highest picks we desperately need (and if the players are the problem we prolong the suffering a few more years while throwing away the rare phenomenon of a coach who proved he could win his current team a flag)

No, you can't claim losing Treloar was a good idea. If someone's started betting on roulette and is losing a grand or two each month it can't be claimed he's a brilliant punter because he's in a better car (which is because his salary went up 100k you don't know about and nothing to do with his punting losses)

Huh? Everyone wants perfection but how about we accept most of what happens with our club? Unless a posse of disgruntled fans can assert beyond reasonable doubt their club needs drastic change and these fans act on that , brooding about your less than perfect team only causes stress and misery. Anyway I remember how frustrating to see time and time again Melbourne have false dawns. But now, unlike quite a few adults, I know what it feels like to see my team win a flag (and they don't.... and supporters attitudes can be so different to the players and coaches... who I hope are never satisfied and always want to improve and have more success.)

I am but some random fan. I'm sure there are people at the club in a good position to answer you. Unfortunately there may be too many stupid, incompetent people 'steering' our future. I dunno - it's hard to see any sunshine after today's waking nightmare.

Do we have a sports psychologist? So often we underperform due to complacency or fear. Surely we need a new one (and obviously a new fitness coach) before the preseason starts.

Umm, but did they? I already asked this. Collingwood might have gone backwards one step due to losing one or both of those players. But if the introduction of the likes of McRae, Nick Daicos and Bobby Hill moved moved them forward FOUR steps it would be easy to overlook that overall Collingwood moved three rather than four steps forward and that Grundy and Treloar's moving on were actually mistakes. Anyway, I expect some upheaval come our finals-less September. Hopefully this will be done by competent people showing due diligence.

It's just an estimate. I'm sure at the end of some season he'll realise it's time. End of 27 or 28 is realistic. But like other old-timers he might go longer if his body and motivation are still strong.

Do we honestly know most of the behind the scenes discussions players have with other teams? Correct me if I'm wrong but unlike players in the draft these ones can decide which clubs they move across to. Is it possible Melbourne tried to get these players in vain? Didn't North have few years where they failed to get players such as Dusty and Josh Kelly?

I'm not sure Treloar leaving didn't hurt them. Buckley lasted only half a season and the Pies were awful in their first year without him. Collingwood have been great since. But how much of that is McRae, Nick Daicos and other players as opposed to good planning?

Umm didn't they mainly get rid of those players because their salary cap was 'bursting at the seams'? And weren't Collingwood paying a good portion of their salaries at their new clubs?