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2 minutes ago, deanox said:

There are differing views on abortion sure. But expressing those views in discussion does not need to be offensive. 

One side of that debate says "everyone must follow my religious perspective" and wants to demonise and shame those who don't. The other side of that debate says "it's up to the individual to choose in accordance with their own beliefs". 

If that debate gets offensive it's because one side has decided to attack the other or force someone else to act a certain way. It's not because the topic has to be offensive.

Agree with that. You can have a discussion with differing views on abortion, without being  offensive, and instead respectful via tolerance that it is a topic of opinion with no right or wrong answer. 

My point is, how does this have anything to do with RACISM, where we need to get to a point of zero tolerance. This is where I don’t see any relevance or connection between the left/conservative debate, free speech and RACISM. 

22 minutes ago, faultydet said:

That's not what Cranky is advocating sue.

I think you know that.

No mate, it’s not at all what Cranky is advocating.

Cranky brought up the example of abortion, as a topic that will have differing views, with potential for offence - I agree, this is a topic, where people should be free to have their own personal views......there is no right or wrong view. 

But I am really struggling to see the connection between abortion and racism, in terms of allowing free speech......displays the ignorance clearly in my opinion. 
 

5 minutes ago, Cranky Franky said:

I've not mentioned Trump & extremes of the left and right are mirror images.

I think your views on tolerance & free speech are naive. Take Christians or muslims quietly telling gays that their holy book says they are an abomination & will burn in hell. Surely most gays would find that highly offensive.

I find anti abortionists holding signs outside health clinics highly offensive. 

Some people have thick skins others are highly sensitive. I maintain that in vigorous open debate someone will be offended but to censor such debate is not acceptable in our society.

 

 

 

And herein lies the challenge of Eddie, Koz and mates getting the peace and respect they deserve. 

knowone is trying to prevent open debate - RACISM is very different to open debate / free speech, and simply can’t be tolerated - unfortunately it is too engrained in many, and they won’t be able to be rehabilitated via education. 

Definitely employ a private investigator. The Mrs will have an end date of putting up with your lack of empathy, if she hasn’t already. 
 

1 hour ago, Colin B. Flaubert said:

I’d add, and this is just my take, for partisan positioning.

Prior to Bob Hawke, the main political fault lines existed along the lines of economics. Multiculturalism, opposition to apartheid, and a non discriminatory migration policy were the consensus. How fast we proceeded towards monetarism was the sticking point (Fraser himself, while introducing the Razor Gang cuts, was never a free marketer at heart).

When the ALP was elected in ‘83 and introduced the wages accord, floated the dollar and scrapped central wage fixing, it was about the same time that the ‘Economic Dries’ were starting to assert themselves in the coalition against a backdrop of ascendant neoliberalism in the UK, USA and New Zealand. That being said, they had to wait until Howard rolled Peacock until they took over.

With Australia now having a bipartisan economic policy, the space for policy difference was negligible. Despite Harold Holt being the de facto dismantler of White Australia, the ALP being a fervent believer in it up until the days of Whitlam and Don Dunstan, and the dominant and formidable presence of the firmly anti racist Malcolm Fraser (a part of me really hopes that in an alternative reality that Trump made his ranting phone call to him or Keating about the refugee swap), there had always been a nativist and ethnocentric side to some conservative voters that could be mined. This stretches back to the New Guard in NSW, the League of Rights and the electoral success of Joh Bjelke Petersen.

Sadly, the issue they split from the national consensus involved discrimination, migration and multiculturalism. And that’s why for me race being political isn’t an issue, it is it being partisan that is. (I get the feeling we are roughly on the same page anyway, it’s just some definitions where we diverge).

P.S. I realize this deviated a bit from the main topic so if @iv'a worn smithwants to discuss this further, we should take it to DMs.

The history of racism is an important part of the education process.

If trying to empathise with someone who has been racially vilified, it is important to imagine ourselves in the situation of discrimination and understand what has been endured. This process obviously makes it easier to understand why behaviour such as Tex’ is so painful to so many, and why as a community we need to get better to prevent un-necessary pain and trauma. 

It is great that there are signs of improvement, but I must admit, I do get frustrated when I hear someone say “well at least it’s better than the 60’s or 70’s”  We need to lift our standards and work towards a near future of zero tolerance. 
 

31 minutes ago, Little Goffy said:

I just watched Eddie Betts' short video on Fox Footy about how it was affecting him and it really prompted one very clear thought in my head.

Eddie knows Taylor Walker, worked with him for years. Walker was his captain for a time and also a vital person to work with in that Adelaide forward line. Eddie has to digest the idea that all along when people were directing racist abuse at him and others, his former captain and very close colleague had a bit of underground sympathy for all that ####.

Now that Pickett also has been abused it gives us a very close to home analogy. A part of Kozzie's mind has to be considering the idea that any given one of his teammates, his captain, his forward line colleagues, might quietly be all right with it, too.

Then Pickett, a young player in a role which is exposed to bad days no matter how good you are, also has to process the possibility that maybe there's a midfielder who would rather honour someone else's lead or there's a voice on the selection committee that still thinks Aboriginal people lack the discipline to train properly and that's why Pickett's form is up and down.

And if he has the courage to stand up to the little signs and ambiguous comments, he runs the risk of being perceived as 'oversensitive' and going down the Lamumba path, or even getting his own experience of the Goodes disaster.

What a trap. You're in it even if you're not in it - the Melbourne Football Club could be a true haven of decency but no Indigenous player could be sure.

 

Great post mate - this is spot on, and needs to be part of the education/awareness. 

18 minutes ago, Cranky Franky said:

Jesus Goffy talk about pessimism. 

I'm happily married but I've found out the neighbour's wife was unfaithful so now I have to spy on my wife because there's a chance she'll be unfaithful as well.

 

Given your attitude, I would say there is a massive chance she is cheating on you.

watch her closely! 
 

A great week to rest some players. Given individual finals spots are on the line, the drop-off in team performance may not be as much as anticipated.

Ie some sore players with half an eye to finals (eg Salem), might be replaced by hungry fringe players who play like it’s their grand final, and as such we still get through with a comfortable enough win.

with no vfl, we have to see the positive of some depth players getting a decent hit-out in case they need to step up to cover injuries during finals. 
 

8 minutes ago, faultydet said:

An individual?

 

You mean a Republican President of the United States?

You people are insane.

He mentioned a politician who has acted in a racist manner historically (fact). The poster, me or anyone else is not bringing up whether we are pro, or against Trump......leftist or conservative. It is completely irrelevant to the topic of this discussion - Racism. 

but you are trying to deflect the topic of racism and bring in “leftist” claims and the like. 

you have yourself a good day matey. 

 

32 minutes ago, faultydet said:

What an absolute load of trash.

Leftists ALWAYS smear the leading conservative with cries of "racist" the moment they assume leader of their party.

It's their "operatus modus" (sic)

 

Cant you lefties leave your politics out of just one thread for goodness sake?

 

 

Disrespectful post.

The point here is addressing the challenge of racism, not politics. 

please be better. 
 

2 minutes ago, Robbie57 said:

Seeing Eddie last night confirms just how damaging this is to the victims and its not for them to carry the burden of fighting racism, its for all of us to do so. I would like to see both our club and Adelaide wear their indigenous jumpers this weekend. 

Great idea! 

2 hours ago, Kent said:

Is it just me or did Kossie look out of sorts? He didn't seem to have much impact when I wathced the replay 

Maybe tiredness?

Maybe stressed by the Tex Walker incident. 

Enough is enough. We all need to get better at calling out racism, and educating people!

too many people ignore it, which is part of the problem. Let your friends, family, everyone know it is not acceptable - Ever! 

1 minute ago, old dee said:

Why do I suddenly feel we can play in the GF? Last night result showed me that we have a resilience that has not  been part of the MFC for some time. We had to travel to WA and be locked up 7 days. Then play in less than ideal  conditions and be in control of the game at 3/4 time to have the game stopped by lightning. After a rest the weagles came out revitalised. In spite of all that we won the game. In years gone by we would have lost that game. We can now win when we have lots of things going against us. Oh I forgot the umpiring.

It is time to forget the past, and embrace this new era we are commencing! 
 

1 minute ago, binman said:

How on earth could anyone pot Ben Brown's game.

He was fantastic. Easily in our best 5 players.

Not better than my boy Nibbler though

Agree with this. 

Brown’s form the last 2 weeks, is exactly what we have been hoping for all year. Can see the confidence rising by the week as well.

Nibbler was massive - nearly best game for the club 

4 minutes ago, binman said:

How can i say Viney will go straight back into the midfield on his return?

Because that is exactly what will happen.

Note i didn't say it should happen. I said it will happen.

But for what it's worth, I think it should happen

I have faith that our coaching group is not this silly. 
 

2 hours ago, Demonstone said:

Michael Lynch's votes in The Age.  Big Benny played well, but no way was he the best player out there

Petracca not mentioned, but received five votes from both Goodwin and Simpson in the Coaches' Award.

This is further evidence that it's purely subjective and we all see things differently.

VOTES
Ben Brown (Melbourne) 8
Tim Kelly (West Coast) 7
James Harmes (Melbourne) 7
Alex Neal-Bullen (Melbourne) 7
Jake Bowey (Melbourne) 6

All this tells you, is that Michael Lynch didn’t watch the game. 
 

4 hours ago, binman said:

Much to some people's chagrin, Viney will come straight back to the midfield once back.

Harmes will then move to whatever role they need to him play - which i suspect come finals will be to tag a gun opposition mid.

On gawn, i amazed how athletic he is for such a tall fella. 

That goal he set up after coming out of the centre and kicking on his left was unbelievable. As was an earlier ground ball collect and evasion before another inside 50 kick (which i think also set up a goal).

How can you say this? 

watch the replay of the past 2 weeks, and then last night - absolute chalk and cheese.

ban Viney from the midfield!! 
 

7 hours ago, Antioch said:

That B Taylor needs to shut completely up. He called Hunt Langdon. He continually barracks for any and all opposition sides against Melbourne. He adds no intelligent commentary. He never comments on poor umpiring decisions when they go against Melbourne.

And how quiet did he go in the 3rd qtr when we powered ahead! 
 

4 minutes ago, Lord Nev said:

Haha yeah never know with old Harmesy, but I reckon you're on the money in that the best chance is Harmes in the middle, and for mine that means Viney more as a mid/forward than in the guts.

Means we can get that burst from Harmes and the forward tackling pressure from Viney.

Oliver handball to Trac handball to Harmes who is in space works!  (But need to see it for another week at least) 
 

Viney getting in trac + Oliver way, and then opposition clears the ball absolutely kills us. Viney should never be in the middle - defensive pressure fwd only. 
 

6. Oliver 

5.  ANB

4. Jackson

3. Trac

2. Harmes

1. Gawn 

apologies Bowey, May, Brown 

36 minutes ago, titan_uranus said:

Off topic slightly but how about Hawthorn's fixture this year.

In a COVID disrupted year, they'll get to the end of the year having only played three games away from the MCG, Marvel and UTAS (their other home). And of those three, one was an "away" game vs Gold Coast at the SCG. 

So they'll only have played two games all year in true foreign territory. 

Irrelevant club for the next decade

:) 

31 minutes ago, Kumamoto_Ken said:

I didn't know that...it changes my prediction completely.

 

37 seconds until the first dodgy free kick.

Maybe we got to the bottom of the dogs “luck” with the umpires, and replicated their strategy. 

I am not joking by the way. Steven May mentioned it on SEN late last week. 
 

17 minutes ago, Kumamoto_Ken said:

Game Day thread will erupt at the first dodgy free kick (I predict 27 seconds in).

Boo Stadium crowd to be even more annoying than usual.

Is all good. Apparently the umps came to our quarantined trivia night. 

Good thinking! 

10 minutes ago, Canplay said:

My concern is the predicted heavy rain -   Both Lever and Petty are great when the ball is in the air but awful when it hits the ground - Lever has the turning agilty of the Titanic...  

wouldn’t stress yourself too much Canplay.

the rain is unlikely to suit their un-contested / marking game style. 
 

I was in genuine shock watching the 2 free kicks to Bont at the end of the game today, as the dogs were coming home strong.

especially the “dangerous tackle” one, that clearly should have been holding the ball against the Bont. 

needs to be investigated. 

even the commentators were too scared to comment, it was that bad!