QueenC

So I guess we have decided that these people are inept and are therefore absolutely going to make the wrong decision then?

This figures...... Because after playing all season (including at Sandy) in "attack", this being only his second match actually playing in defence, playing on (or at least trying to) the biggest and arguably the best forward talent in the league, who is getting perfect silver service due to absolutely no Demon pressure from our inept mid-field in the first quarter, which gave him absolutely no chance whatsoever, Miller was bound to be the one held particularly responsible for this thrashing. He was completely out-classed by Brown. I am not making any argument otherwise because it would be untrue, and I would be eaten alive around here, but seriously he was not the one solely responsible for the genuinely horrible start, despite his close proximity to it. Sometimes the defence, despite being the easy, cheap, and unimaginative targets when teams get routed, actually need some help from the engine room. And in the first quarter there was absolutely none. Carroll definitely did a far superior job, but a hell of a lot of that can be attributed to the fact that, well he is our primary defender, is trained for it, and therefore should be better and more skillful at that end of the ground, but more importantly for this particular game is the fact that our the mids started actually trying to stop the ball (with a little bit of tackling and stuff) from flying into the Brisbane forward line with the ease of a hot knife through butter. I realise what people think of Brad Miller around here, but he hopefully will continue to play in defence this year (Riley said as much in his press conference) and be given the opportunity to learn the ropes and therefore get this part of his game right. And this is a cheap shot at a popular target in my opinion, sorry.

In your opinion, and that is not gospel...... And for heavens sake stop making out that anyone who doesn't automatically throw Voss away like used garbage condones what happened that night. I realise that it makes your stance more appealing if we are seen as sympathetic to violent outbursts. But that is just ignoring what has been written. No-one here condones what we saw happen.

It is unfortunately quite staggeringly unprofessional. I know that it was just a simple human mistake, but you would think that the kits would be at least double checked before they leave ? Anyway apropos....... Brown on fire in Lions rout "..........It was technically a home game for the Demons, marking the seventh straight year Melbourne has hosted Brisbane at the Gabba. However, Brisbane avoided wearing their much maligned white away strip thanks to a simple gaffe by the Demons. Melbourne inexplicably brought their white away shorts, ensuring a colour clash that officials deemed could only be avoided if the Lions wore their home guernsey – much to the relief of the Brisbane faithful. Early on, it seemed Melbourne also brought a white flag as Brown goaled almost at will in the opening stanza......."

Oh yes, that would have been a fantastic show of chactacter and strength in adversity....... And it would most definitely have got him suspended. Good logic there !!!

I asked the same thing at the time CB........ But to be honest I don't remember seeing them loose anywhere in our forward fifty Although truth be told I may have just missed them !!!

Thought we were playing AFL ?!!! I agree with you BB, that playing angry or releasing anger can bring out the best in some competitors, but that does not seem to be the case for here for Davey and the Saints game from last years finals is most definitely a valid example of him totally losing his nut, being undisciplined, and as a result nearly costing us the game. And while frustration happens to everyone out there, it is how you deal with it or channel it into your footy that can make it become a positive weapon. But I haven't seen that kind of potentially constructive outcome when Davey blows his lid, and while he did work through his anger issues a little better tonight, and played reasonably well in the end, just how much that had to do with hitting his opponent in the opening quarter of the game I don't really know. But the hit was still a stupid and reckless thing to do, and could ultimately and unfortunately cost the team at the tribunal. And no, we are not playing netball, but at the end of the day there is still a hell of a difference between being tough and hard at the footy, and sniping someone in the guts, therefore giving away frustrated free kicks, that in reality aren't going to make the frustration go away, and will probably only make the situation worse.

My particular favourite was after a solid and positive move out of defence, we hoiked it high to Davey who was, at that point in time, in a four on one situation. Not the cleverest manoeuvre you will see on a footy field !!!

David Hookes? While I understand your reference, just who is making what factually happened more complicated that it needs to be? And for the record you may not agree with my take on things Alan, but please don't condescend to me. I am some ignorant fool :angry: (and this is unfortunately not the first time you have belittled my comments either). My opinion it just that, it is not necessarily or absolutely right or wrong, but neither is yours, despite what you seem to think. And I am certainly not defending Voss for his actions on that night, but I will always try to give people a second chance if they make a mistake, especially in this circumstance since it does appear to be a one-off indecent, and therefore I will not condemn him for life for the horrible happening. But if you could actually try to understand what I wrote instead of just patronizing it, then you would have read that we have no true idea what actually happened (unless of course you have first hand account of the event) and footage can always be altered if the press want us to see a particular thing. I don't know if this happened or not. But it is not a complete impossibility. So therefore instead of totally condemning him, and without further thought just write off every other skill, ability and positive attribute he may have, I believe that we should wait for the eventual outcome of the investigation and proceedings. And if your "simple" answer is the right one, then so be it. I didn't like what I saw and would never condone violent behavior (having been on the end of it in the very recent and quite distant past for very different reasons) but there is always more to every situation than the simple back and white. That is life, simple would be great, but not always accurate. And despite what some on here seem think of him now, I am pretty sure that he will still be looked at for the job anyway.

Amazing isn't it !!! That sounds fairly logical........ As good as Bizz has been (named at CHB), he is not really in the same weight division has Brown, unfortunately. Also it would be the supreme challenge for Miller.

His season was officially ended a week or so ago, I think, Rogue........ Anyway good luck to Jared for the surgery, and hopefully it will spell an end to the injury woes he has suffered this year.

Really, I thought that was just me !!!

How right you are kryton....... Petterd's collapse blamed on cyst

I don't think any of us should pretend to know the absolute reality of this situation...... Yes, we all saw the same thing, the same hit, and I am the last person to condone someone hitting out at someone, but the truth remains that unless you were there (and I am not going to hide behind this) you simply don't know what else might have happened beyond what was seen on that video. How much provocation was involved? How much time was there between the incidents? How much happened that was not caught on camera? And given we are basing our assumptions of Voss's character on this particular video, has it been doctored or altered in any way for media purposes? We have absolutely no answer to that, and given no-one seems to know where the hell it came from this actuality is not completely out of the question. But in the end Voss hit the guy. Now, he may have had his reasons, and they may have been damn good at the time, but in the cold hard light of day none of the actions of anyone involved in that brawl should be condoned (not that anyone here is condoning them) and therefore should be punished. But there are always factors that don't get taken into account. There is no situation that is ever completely black and white, and I am sure that as this drags out further, there will be those that will use this to tear at Voss because they can now. As this is something importantly that they could never do before. Does this put his coaching aspirations in jeopardy? Well judging by those that think this makes him suspect on a number of fronts (and many of the points brought up are right) it will do him absolutely no favours. But then again we all knew this was there before the video was released. I do remember thinking at the time, how surprised I was that someone like a Micheal Voss (and a Simon Black, for that matter) got himself caught up in this kind of incident, given his reputation prior to this. That reputation is now damaged, but I don't think it is completely, nor permanently shot to hell. And on a personal note, as I have said previously in this thread, I can speak first hand how these kinds of situations break out, blow up, and collect innocent casualties along the way, but it can be very hard to remain uninvolved when ("if" in this case) someone comes at you and your friends. He did assault someone, and therefore should be punished accordingly (as should anyone in that situation). And it definitely raises some questions about whether he is ready for the position we have available, but I am not convinced that he should be written off completely just yet. As in my opinion there is way too much that we simply don't know. About this or about him !!!

Interesting perspective from Mick Malthouse....... Voss lesson - coaches 'marked men'

Common sense selections........

And this is the way I am going to look at it as well....... I actually don't care which one is better now or going to be better than the other. The way I see it they both will hopefully become a fantastic team And they will be working together to the benefit of the Demons for many seasons to come. And how they work together is vastly more important than picking one over the other. Just my opinion :D !!!

Apropos....... Voss lawyer blasts leaked footage

This is the most common sense answer to the current captaincy question........ Neitz, should and hopefully will, be captaining the team for the what is going to be a huge 2008 season. Beyond that there is no surprise that I also think that McLean is the most obvious and stand out candidate But I am not totally convinced that he is quite ready yet to take over the role full time, at this point in time, or maybe even next year. What is good to see is that there are a number of the younger players (McLean, Syliva, Jones, Rivers) who seem to have leadership qualities. And this can only be a good thing for our future :D !!!

Hopefully all will go well for him, and we will see him again next season. Petterd recovery setback Petterd to undergo lung surgery Best wishes Ricky for a safe and speedy recovery !!!

Well said Deanox...... The club did, to my way of thinking anyway, what they believed was the best for both the individual player and for the team. Maybe he could have debuted earlier, and given the way he has played in his first couple of games that could be a valid argument, but we have no idea what goes on behind the scenes and just because we saw a player we believed was physically ready for the big step didn't automatically make him mentally ready. As has been said there is more to playing AFL than skill alone, and as I understand it Newton's skills were never in doubt. But the point is moot now anyway, he has started what will hopefully be a long, prosperous, and successful football career with the Demons. He may have made his debut at exactly the right time for him (and that is the important part - every players has capabilities and that must be tailored for) and hopefully for the team.

I am not sure that I would trust Aker's opinion as far as I could throw him on the Voss argumnet, given he does have a reason for personal bias. Voss lacks coaching skills - Aker

Miller gets criticised and blamed for anything and everything, whether he is good, bad, or indifferent. It is unfortunately just the way it is around here. But I actually thought he played a pretty solid game last weekend and therefore I don't think he will, or should, be dropped this week. Jaded is right in that Holland is too slow for Brown, bedides it will be interesting to see how Millsy handles this particularly tough role if he is given it. So I am going along the same lines as everyone else, in that Pettard will be out and Bruce will probably come back in.

.......and reading it back now there does seem to be a distinct 'Melrose Place' feel about the whole thing !!!

Oh I am definitely not, but I do know how to defend myself...... From nearly everything other than, of course, a pool cue to the back of the head !!!