Fantastic news about Rivers and Bartram. We desperately need these two to have injury-free seasons (well, careers actually).

I have huge hopes for Dunn. He is my adopted player for 2008, especially if he is given a permanent role in the midfield.

Which is pretty much how much Neita averaged for last year as well, but I digest... Bate's a good mark, if you want him to take 12 a game play across the HBF.

Yeah and Neita had a very poor season, thanks for agreeing with me.

Bate does not play as a key forward and he definitely doesn't mark like one, but hopefully he can improve in this area.

Fantastic news about Rivers and Bartram. We desperately need these two to have injury-free seasons (well, careers actually).

I have huge hopes for Dunn. He is my adopted player for 2008, especially if he is given a permanent role in the midfield.

I also have huge hopes for Dunn. The dimension he will bring to our midfield in years to come is outstanding. I think he's a very intelligent footballer, and unlike everyone else on our list, he appears to get BIGGER every year!

Bang him in the middle, throw himself around a bit, float forward and kick a couple of goals a game. Sounds Easy!

Bring on Sunday

Yeah and Neita had a very poor season, thanks for agreeing with me.

Bate does not play as a key forward and he definitely doesn't mark like one, but hopefully he can improve in this area.

Only White, Carroll, Green and Bruce took more marks last year... Bate is a good mark. He's not Jonathon Brown, but for a kid that's still only 20 I think he goes alright.

Only White, Carroll, Green and Bruce took more marks last year... Bate is a good mark. He's not Jonathon Brown, but for a kid that's still only 20 I think he goes alright.

Until we plant Bate at CHF for 22 weeks solid, you can't criticise how many marks he takes in a season.

With the rare chances he's had at CHF last year, he's looked the goods.

He also hits a leading forward in front of their eyes more often than anyone else on our list, even if he looks awkward in getting it there.

i cant believe what im hearing about bartram..i thought the day would never come...this is some of the best news i have heard in a while!!

Until we plant Bate at CHF for 22 weeks solid, you can't criticise how many marks he takes in a season.

With the rare chances he's had at CHF last year, he's looked the goods.

He also hits a leading forward in front of their eyes more often than anyone else on our list, even if he looks awkward in getting it there.

Exactly, he is a much better midfielder than he is key forward and right now we don't have alot of midfielders who are capable of this type of delivery. Playing Bate up forward sacrifices a potent weapon that we have.

Exactly, he is a much better midfielder than he is key forward and right now we don't have alot of midfielders who are capable of this type of delivery. Playing Bate up forward sacrifices a potent weapon that we have.

Bate and Dunn are both 192 as is Morton. They are all capable of playing in the midfield and kicking goals from Beyond fifty, if we can develop the likes Newton or Garland as a KPP, then we are going to have a very handy attacking set up.

quote ='myfavouritemartian' date='Mar 16 2008,I.m with you on this 'zebgrowler'.

I'm not.

Thanks for the reports on the match, fellas....very informative.

I'm slightly disappointed because other posts(on other threads) had me hopingthat Cale might have been ready for AFL. Now I know!

Glad about Bruce, Wheatley,Dunn and Bartram.

We need Wheats for point kick-ins!

This thread is turning onto something more than its title suggests.

For mine, I am a Melbourne supporter start and finish. I do go along to Sandy practice games most years; pleasant Sunday afternoon, plenty of Demons running around. I also make it a point to catch any Sandy on the ABC. I have become a Sandy supporterby default.

I actually want Sandy to play the best side that they can pick - end of story. I want any Melbourne players to experience playing in a club where success is everything and a winning culture is endemic. That is the most valuable thing that, in my opinion, Sandy offers. People on this site were bemoaning Newton's perpetual selection in the Sandy reserves and he is now a fixture in our senior side, and still only 20. I count that as a success. Would his getting undeserved game in Sandy seniors not have exaservated the attitude problem that was evident early on?

Just on the unmentioned Saunter, he was sorely missed in both Sandy games that I have seen this year, what is happening to him? Sandy need him badly.

I'm slightly disappointed because other posts(on other threads) had me hopingthat Cale might have been ready for AFL. Now I know!

Don't be disappointed, Morton is a work in progress. Watch him live and you will be salivating. He is very green and needs to fill out a bit. But, we have a real beauty.

The other two Morton boys braved the hot sun to come and see Cale play. I would say that we have the tallest of them and Richmon the stockiest. Mitch is an axehandle across the shoulders.

I was down there today in the very hot conditions and anyone would have struggled today. For what it means here is my observation of the demon players today.

Bruce - Thought early he was just going to jog around and show the same amount of interest the rest of our senior players have over the pre season. But to his credit his efforts got better and better and was as good as anyone on the park. His third quarter goal where he set the play up in the middle and then gut busted run into the forward pocket to receive back was one of the two major highlights of the day. From reports it looks like DB has a softly softly approach to returning players but he has to play round one.

Rivers - Saw a half of his game at Cranbourne where I thought he returned super but today was much tougher conditions Still did pretty well and ditto round one as Bruce.

Whelan - Started on the bench and looks a little way from senior football. When he goes in he goes hard and when he returns to our backline things will look better

Bartram - Look better then last week and I thought today was real encouraging. Ran fast (there is a novelty for Melb outside of Flash!) and his vertical leap when he was caught under a centre bounce and had to ruck was great. Was pleasing today.

Johnson - Chris I am sorry I dont think is a best 22 footballer. He didn't play bad today but he certainly didn't stand out either.

Wheatley - Got plenty of it but sometime his decision making was poor. I just don't know about Wheats anymore.

Dunn - I echo others on the site that he does look an impressive type who could be a hard match up for other teams. Strong runs all day and reasonably tall he will definitely play a number of positions. I think 2008 is the year he could be our match up for the the taller stronger midfielders who dominate us - Cornes, Goodes etc. Hope he plays Round 1

Zomer - Played full forward and tried real hard but didn't get near it. Didnt help for a lot time it came to him he was two or three on one but development is the key there.

Frawley - Was good in patches but I am not sure where he fits in. Too short for key position I think but still only young. Was ok today but does add to our list of poor users of the ball though.

Morton - Second highlight of the day. He is skinny and made some mistakes (who didnt today) but gee does he excite you. Played on the wing, clean hands great pickups, thought his way through traffic brilliantly and kicked a goal which had class stamped all over it. I know he is our highest draft pick since Col and Brock but he is the one I most excited about. Quite tall so depending on how he fills out could be a KPP who plays like a midfielder (have we ever had one of those ?) No pressure but here comes number 10 !.

Seen the Geelong and Kangaroos pre season games and shattered after both (particularly Kangas) but seeing Bruce, Morton, Rivers and Dunn just made the light at the end of the tunnel a shade brighter

For those that couldn't make it today you didn't miss much as the game was shorten by 30 mins in the second half and conditions made it very tough.

Roll on next Sunday and me with all my wisdom and footy knowledge would play Rivers, Bruce, Dunn, Morton and possibly Bartram from today.

Did Valenti play?

Did Valenti play?

No

Did Valenti play?

Doubt it... the club didn't seek and exemption for him to play.

Good to hear from the brave souls out there today in that heat.

Just on Bruce, how was his disposal?? Has it improved from last year, based on what you saw today?

Good to hear from the brave souls out there today in that heat.

Just on Bruce, how was his disposal?? Has it improved from last year, based on what you saw today?

I thought it was quite good today. His goal after the gut busting run was all class as he was in the pocket (near the Sandy changerooms) with the wind blowing into his face. Not sure if it was just the jumper that made him look different but he did seem to have a slightly different kicking action. Could be just hope rather then fact though !

I want a change if the attitude of the Sandy Board is as unsympathetic as Zebgrowler is and doesn't recognise this as a partnership. I'd probably opt for a change if we got a better deal at a better ground. That's just business and is no disrespect for Sandy.

I think on the whole the relationship has been good. You yourself have said how Melbourne were accommodating when the partnership was formed and that other partnerships were less favourable.

All I'm suggesting is that the partnership has some issues that affect MFC and Sandy need to be aware of that and accommodate a solution or at least be prepared to compromise. ZG says "if you don't like it go somewhere else or do your own thing". In essence so do you. Sylvinator raised an absolutely valid issue. He, and accordingly our club, was ridiculed as a result.

It's pretty insulting to say "if you don't like it do your own thing" because you know we can't. But rather than recognise the issues you want to play tough man.

Where is the respect for us in this partnership? Be tough but if we do go you won't get as good a deal elsewhere and that will be your loss. Alternatively you can go it alone. Has a stand alone VFL club played in a GF since 2000?

I want a change if the attitude of the Sandy Board is as unsympathetic as Zebgrowler is and doesn't recognise this as a partnership. I'd probably opt for a change if we got a better deal at a better ground. That's just business and is no disrespect for Sandy.

How many times do you get down to Sandy games, & over what period of time?

GO ZEBRAS...and DEMONS

A gentleman and a scholar.

I have no idea why zebgrowler on the other hand wants to downplay Sandy GF wins of recent times which I would remind him have included ex Melbourne listed players. Surely this proves the alliance is strong from top to bottom? Those complaining that the development of Melbourne listed players has been hampered by the alliance IMO are scapegoating Sandy for the inability of some to take the step up to AFL.

He provides much needed dash and yes the ground really is too small, so there's much congestion, but Wheatley's passing today showed why at best he's a reasonable AFL player and will never be elite.

I didn't see this Sandringham game. That said, I would have thought Wheatley's foot skills were decent, and particularly over long distances. I've always felt he's lacked that 'hard edge' as a defender, and that's where room for improvement was needed (if he was to be played as a defender, ofc - I'd like to see him played more up the ground).

i cant believe what im hearing about bartram..i thought the day would never come...this is some of the best news i have heard in a while!!

Certainly good news.

How many times do you get down to Sandy games, & over what period of time?

If you can explain to me what relevance that has to the strength of my argument I'll answer.

Can you tell me how many games of football you've played and how many games you've coached?

Those complaining that the development of Melbourne listed players has been hampered by the alliance IMO are scapegoating Sandy for the inability of some to take the step up to AFL.

I think that in many cases you're right, but that is not always the case. Newton was certainly disadvantaged by the presence of Sautner and Crowe. Frawley and Garland have been held back by Lamb. It's mainly KP players because of the limited spots on the ground. It not just relates to being picked, it relates to where the player plays when they are picked. How many games did Newton play at FF for Sandy? Garland was another significantly compromised in the position he was played last year.

Rucks are another issue but that is not Sandy's fault and the proposition of multiple partnerships or a system that exists in SANFL or WAFL seems sensible.

If Meesen, Jamar and Johnson stay fit Spencer will most likely play a full season in Sandy seconds regardless of merit. Being so much more experienced these three will always be Sandy's first choice ruckmen and more immediate value. But in the long term Spencer may well be the best future ruckmen we have on our list. He would benefit from playing a higher standard. Let me paint a scenario. Let's assume Jamar is the only player of those 4 out of contract at year end. Let's presume he's not up to AFL standard and we've decided to delist him at year end but he is a standout at VFL level. Let's assume Spencer is playing well in Sandy 2nds and we want to give him exposure because we see him as developing into a good player. Or perhaps we just need to see him at a higher level to see if he can cope. Sandy of course, under the ZG beat my hairy chest philosophy won't pick him.

I tell you what I'd do if Sandy wouldn't play ball. I'd sack Jamar. That way he wouldn't be able to play for Sandy and Spencer would get a run in the Sandy seniors.

And that would be stupid. Sandy must be prepared to compromise to assist the partnership and get off their high horse about being an independent club. They are not and they decided not to be when THEY accepted a partnership.

There is nothing wrong with Wheatleys speed or skills.

He is a great long and accurate kick.

He trains beautifully.

When he plays and the pressure is on, he plays within himself. He does not go.

If he is kicking out from full back he will wait and then kick 20 meters to someone in the back pocket. He may kick long from full back one in every three or four kicks.

he has a leap that is rarely seen.

I think he should be an elite player.

However, he has whatever you would call the OPPOSITE of White line fever.

I find him deeply disappointingly as he has been on the list for eight years.

If I had to pick someone to play for my life, I would rather have Simon Godfrey in my team.

Those that keep pumping up Wheats tyres are IMO believing what he is capable of (a fair bit)and not what he shows.

If Dean Bailey makes headway with him, he has won me.

Those that don't see Wheatley's monotonous errant passing mustn't watch the game closely enough. He looks terrific cutting a swathe through the backline and can roost the ball a long way, and his passes are often nearly perfect, but time and time again they 'just' miss the mark, only to cause a turnover.

Put it to the test and watch for this in 2008. He's done it his whole career.