Why can't you just accept that Bizzell is still a very good player?

I never said he was a terrible player.

A very good player? That's stretching it. You are clearly blinded by the fact that he is obviously a favourite of yours, which is fine, we are all guilty of that sometimes.

He is an ordinary defender, if he wasn't, he wouldn't have spent over a year at Sandy.

His disposal is ok, he knows how to zone off and help the other defenders, but one on one he gets beaten more often than not.

He doesn't have the strength to play on big forwards, or the pace to keep up with small forwards. He does what he can, he works hard, he is courageous, but more often than not he gets caught behind his opponent, and that's not good enough when he is playing CHB.

I remember what happened to us when Robbo was playing CHF and Bizzell was at CHB... we came 14th.

I never said he was a terrible player.

A very good player? That's stretching it. You are clearly blinded by the fact that he is obviously a favourite of yours, which is fine, we are all guilty of that sometimes.

He is an ordinary defender, if he wasn't, he wouldn't have spent over a year at Sandy.

His disposal is ok, he knows how to zone off and help the other defenders, but one on one he gets beaten more often than not.

He doesn't have the strength to play on big forwards, or the pace to keep up with small forwards. He does what he can, he works hard, he is courageous, but more often than not he gets caught behind his opponent, and that's not good enough when he is playing CHB.

I remember what happened to us when Robbo was playing CHF and Bizzell was at CHB... we came 14th.

That's why when we have a full side Bizzell plays on a flank/pocket.

Quite critical, but also clever and entertaining joeboy.

That's why when we have a full side Bizzell plays on a flank/pocket.

I rather Bell, Bartram, Petterd etc...

Bizzell has a year, max, left in the game.

Whether or not he gets a contract extension is irrelevant, as with a fully fit side, he won't be getting a game.

I'm sorry but I can't get excited by 30 year olds who decide to come to life when their careers are finished.

Nobody here is raving about Ward shutting down Betts, and IMO he was just as good/poor as Bizzell today.

Good on Bizzell for making the most of his opportunities, he deserves to finish his career on a high.

Bizzell played in the reserves last year primarily because injury derailed his season. He has been a very good defender for the football club over a long period of time and his actions had a lot to do with Al Nicholson staying in the AFL as long as he did. Plays a very similar role to Rivers and only aging legs are diminishing his output nowadays...was a v.good player

Yeah, Jaded you just speculate wildly about young players who you have no idea about

Yeah, Jaded you just speculate wildly about young players who you have no idea about

Would you like to give me some examples, or do you figure that by paying me out needlessly I'll start agreeing with you?

Bizzell had two very good seasons for the MFC. One of those seasons we finished 14th.

I'm happy for him that he's playing well, because he will continue to get a game as long as half of our backline is out injured.

BTW, he was fit at the end of 2005 when we played finals. He just couldn't cut it.

I'm sorry but I can't get excited by 30 year olds who decide to come to life when their careers are finished.

He should have done more with that broken leg last year. Poor form Biz.

Just because he wasn't selected, doesn't mean he shouldn't have been selected. The selection committee (Daniher) made a lot of bad decisions.

Even without injuries he is in the best 18, let alone 22. His recent performances justify this.

Even without injuries he is in the best 18, let alone 22.

Is he really?

Who's in your best 22 then, and if he is in our best 22, when didn't he play finals in 2005 when he was fit?

And why wasn't he playing in Round 1 when we had a full list available?

And why wasn't he playing in Round 1 when we had a full list available?

Because the man who just lost his job was in charge of selecting the teams.

Just quickly, my best backline ATM:

FB: Whelan Carroll Bell

HB: Bizzell Rivers Petterd

Because the man who just lost his job was in charge of selecting the teams.

Predictable answer.

Not everything was Daniher's fault.

We played very well while Bizzell wasn't in the side, and nobody was complaining then.

Show me your best 22 and how Bizzell fits in there.

Examples are Warnock, who has looked ordinary at AFL level and was stitched up in the VFL this weekend, yet you are saying should play this week at the expense of ward, bizzell etc...or CJ who you have consistently moaned about not being in the side even though he has been dire... or Bell who you will praise even if he has an ordinary game...you consistently deride experienced or old players who have been good performers at the club and prop up your glamour boys at all cost without a balanced view. They are playing the young kids!!!

Examples are Warnock, who has looked ordinary at AFL level and was stitched up in the VFL this weekend, yet you are saying should play this week at the expense of ward, bizzell etc...or CJ who you have consistently moaned about not being in the side even though he has been dire... or Bell who you will praise even if he has an ordinary game...you consistently deride experienced or old players who have been good performers at the club and prop up your glamour boys at all cost without a balanced view. They are playing the young kids!!!

1- Warnock has been playing well in the VFL this year, and he showed a bit when given a run earlier in the year (ahead of Bizzell in case you forgot). We promoted him off the rookie list for a reason.

2- CJ too has been playing very well at Sandy all year, and deserves an opportunity to show us whether or not he can make it at senior level. If he does nothing to impress by the end of the season, then trade him, don't die wondering.

3- I'm not alone with my praise of Bell. He's been our most consistent defender this year.

4- I never said they weren't playing the kids, they are. But the bottom line is, will Brown or Ward or Bizzell be around when we win a premiership, or more to the point, could they help us win a premiership (Neita, Junior, White etc.. certainly can/will)? If the answer is no, than I'm sorry but I can't get excited by their performances, not when we're second last.

I thought Brown was appaling last week and deserved to be dropped, but as I noted before, he did very little wrong today.

Ward did a great job on a very dangerous Betts, and his pace is something we sadly lack.

Bizzell was Bizzell, did nothing extraodinary, nothing shockingly bad either. He got beaten by his opponents one on one, but came into his own when each team had a loose player in their defensive 50.

Bizzell played in the reserves last year primarily because injury derailed his season. He has been a very good defender for the football club over a long period of time and his actions had a lot to do with Al Nicholson staying in the AFL as long as he did. Plays a very similar role to Rivers and only aging legs are diminishing his output nowadays...was a v.good player

Oh big al he will never go out of my memery he gets another mention. <_<

Brown - good in spurts

Carroll - shortcomings exposed - brave

Bizzell - steady and handy

Ward - some poor finishes

Miller - he cant kick

Petterd - bugger bugger bugger

Wheatley - can he kick :-)))))))

Dunn - not best game

McDonald - on ya Junior !!!

Bate - really very good :-))

Newton - has found home :-))

Jones - we need him

Sylvia - finding some polish

C. Johnson - good.........and bad

P. Johnson - becoming more accomplished

White - good "followers' game

McLean - use the force !!!

Robertson - robbo !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Davey - was he playing ( f**king amazing goal ) ...hell..a dollar each way !! :-))

Frawley - getting better :-)))

Godfrey - give another year :-)

Buckley - not too shabby

Miller was hard at the ball all match. you guys obviously see what you want to. i dont care for miller either way but he played a much better game than carroll FFS. Bizzell was patchy too . Miller was consistent throughout and he seemed to add a touch of physical toughness to a increasingly fragile backline ( next year with Rivers and Bell back it will be so much stronger). I reckon leaving Miller in the backline for the remainer of the year will give him some much needed confidence.

it is always a good idea to play players who can play up forward and down back. eg Chris Grant can be damaging both CHF and CHB. Just give miller a chance. dont forget the final against Freo last year BOG for us. Sure one game doesnt count for much but he does have talent.

I am sure i will cop shizenhower for this post and so be it.

Why can't you just accept that Bizzell is still a very good player?

I agree, i love the Show biz kid and with Rivers is the only two backmen we have that can effectively read the play..

Is a awesome third man up and can still perfrom one-on-one. In a year or two he will go and Rivers will be bigger and dominate

Biz can still offer plenty and lets not forget in the early stages of this decade he held our defence up with Wheels and big Nicho...

each week when i read these i often wonder if i was watching the same game.....

For his first game back in a while i thought Miller was pretty solid today. people on here bag him alot but with sometime down back i think he is a real shot at being a class defender, one that can pinch hit each week on the biggest strongest opposition forward. He has a good motor is a good grab and given the chance i think he can read the play well with the ball coming in at him. You all praise Brock and he s been ordinary lately, i thimk we should all remember the team is got about as much structure left to it as the world trade centre and this has a massive impact on the whole team.... mclean miller and the rest.

CAN we get through this year without bagging miller each week for nothing and see what develops, its not like there s much to lose. p

LOL...just saw the post above, Couldnt agree more.

At the risk of sounding like ...just anothr bagging of Frosty I'll explain my frustration. There were some good passages of play by Miller, yes folks..actually some quite good ones.. ( count limited to fingers on one hand )... there were more than a few workmanlike efforts. ( about two hands worth !! lol )..and now the frustration, his disposal. On more than 5 occasionns his disposal , or poor thinking of choice either resulted in a grubbed pass to a Melbourne player, a kick so poor directed its hard to guess who it was to, a kick to an unecessary contest ( i.e a better choice was a kick to another player, or handball) ..or on more than a couple of occasions a direct turnover by placing it at easy reach of a carlton player. Now in fairness he wasnt totally alone. But he did take the guernsey for it today. I find it annoying. He may or may not get the rest of the season to develop some backman acumen, however i doubt it he seems alllost at sea down there. Its just a reality!!

His disposal isn't perfect, but I raise you Ward, Carroll, Brown... half our backline can't dispose of a footy.

I just watched the replay and wanted to add that Miller was indeed good. Punched the ball when necessary, got some tricky handballs away to keep the play moving and managed to shut down his opponent very effectively. Made one stupid kicking error, but apart from that had a relatively clanger-free match.

CJ, while he didn't have a huge amount of the ball, I thought was OK for not having played a senior match for so long. The thing that let him down was his kicking, which is uncharacteristic as his disposal is normally one of his strengths. Definitely worth persisting with, and I'm a firm believer in his ability to translate his skills to this level. He IS good enough to be an AFL footballer.

Bate was magnificent. He outran 5 opponents and I think he's really found his spot at CHF. One of the most powerful marks/kicks/run combinations I've seen in a player in a long time.

Also, when Sylvia and Jones tackle you, you stay tackled.

Overall, and as Tim Watson so kindly pointed out, we have some really exciting future prospects who we must persist with. I saw Neita, Green, Bruce, Whelan, Yze and TJ (who I'm sure was asleep) sitting in the stands, and it didn't bother me because their on-field replacements were more than filling their shoes.

These young players will carry us towards that elusive premiership better than any Melbourne side in recent times.

Sylvia - chance for Bluey

C.Johnson - worse than Grgic

Newton - legitimate Neitz successor

Buckley - star in making

Have to agree with goodoil, every week Jaded has a good old whinge that C.J is not in the side and yet again when he is selected, he is very, very ordinary, same goes with Miller....but as always Jaded manages to put a positive spin on both their games...makes me laugh

Have to agree with goodoil, every week Jaded has a good old whinge that C.J is not in the side and yet again when he is selected, he is very, very ordinary, same goes with Miller....but as always Jaded manages to put a positive spin on both their games...makes me laugh

Tell me about it

Its embarrassing when someone continually pumps up the tyres of a very ordinary footballer

His disposal isn't perfect, but I raise you Ward, Carroll, Brown... half our backline can't dispose of a footy.

I just watched the replay and wanted to add that Miller was indeed good. Punched the ball when necessary, got some tricky handballs away to keep the play moving and managed to shut down his opponent very effectively. Made one stupid kicking error, but apart from that had a relatively clanger-free match.

CJ, while he didn't have a huge amount of the ball, I thought was OK for not having played a senior match for so long. The thing that let him down was his kicking, which is uncharacteristic as his disposal is normally one of his strengths. Definitely worth persisting with, and I'm a firm believer in his ability to translate his skills to this level. He IS good enough to be an AFL footballer.

Bate was magnificent. He outran 5 opponents and I think he's really found his spot at CHF. One of the most powerful marks/kicks/run combinations I've seen in a player in a long time.

Also, when Sylvia and Jones tackle you, you stay tackled.

Overall, and as Tim Watson so kindly pointed out, we have some really exciting future prospects who we must persist with. I saw Neita, Green, Bruce, Whelan, Yze and TJ (who I'm sure was asleep) sitting in the stands, and it didn't bother me because their on-field replacements were more than filling their shoes.

These young players will carry us towards that elusive premiership better than any Melbourne side in recent times.

Jaded - a very funny comment re TJ. Well done.

Biffinator.

Tell me about it

Its embarrassing when someone continually pumps up the tyres of a very ordinary footballer

I agree. CJ's not up to it.

The last quarter summed it up when he had 30 minutes to pick up the ball on the members wing at a crucial time in the last quarter, but couldn't control it, over-ran the ball and a Carlton player cleared the ball out.

I'm all for playing him for 3 or 4 games in a row, but he should be make way for Bell, TJ, Bruce, Green etc...when they start coming back. Fairly sure he'll be delisted or traded to WCE/Freo for a 4th rounder at very best.

Meanwhile I think people are being harsh on Ward. Overall I think he's been solid this year and he's done some good shut down jobs on the likes of Leon Davis and particularly Eddie Betts yesterday. Been an excellent replacement for Whelan. Has also kicked some wonderful goals in the last 2 weeks. Like Bizell, should be granted a 1 year extension as they are solid depth at worst.