No use having good skills if you can't get the footy.

What player is that directed to?

old55s comment about Dunn playing as a defensive forward

Yep. I agree now that you mention it, old.

Would you play him in front of bell?

I would. I have often thought he needs to play forward.. but that train has sailed.

I'd probably put him ahead of Bell if only because he seems more versatile.

I think next year there will need to be 2 delistings. For me delistings should be 2 of these 3: Jamar, Newton, Wheatley

As for trading i think its imperitave that we trade Bell. For years he has shown little and i just dont think he will ever deliver.

If we look at hawthorn, they were strict and delisted and traded players that were ok but nothing special to move forward. Bell is a fine depth player but hey we cant have that atm.

I think next year there will need to be 2 delistings. For me delistings should be 2 of these 3: Jamar, Newton, Wheatley

As for trading i think its imperitave that we trade Bell. For years he has shown little and i just dont think he will ever deliver.

If we look at hawthorn, they were strict and delisted and traded players that were ok but nothing special to move forward. Bell is a fine depth player but hey we cant have that atm.

Each club has to make room for 3 picks in the November draft.

As our midfield improves over the next couple of seasons I just can't see Dunn holding his spot. Sure he's an ok tagger but in a good team a tagger needs to also win the footy and use it well.

He's very lucky to be still on the list.

Yes agree, Dunn vs

McDonald Bruce Green Davey

Moloney Sylvia McLean

Valenti Buckley Jones

Bartram Grimes Morton Maric

Blease Strauss Bennell Jetta Bail WATTS

That's 21 blokes, the best 7 or 8 to get picked in the midfield

Just cannot see Dunn being good enough to earn it...

I think next year there will need to be 2 delistings. For me delistings should be 2 of these 3: Jamar, Newton, Wheatley

As for trading i think its imperitave that we trade Bell. For years he has shown little and i just dont think he will ever deliver.

If we look at hawthorn, they were strict and delisted and traded players that were ok but nothing special to move forward. Bell is a fine depth player but hey we cant have that atm.

The season hasn't even started yet. 2 years ago Bell was one of the few shining lights. He had a crap year and he wasn't the only one I would be waiting for some time during the season to make judgements like that on our players. The players I think should be under the pump next year are.

Jones, Miller, Sylvia, Dunn, Bell, Moloney, McDonald, Robertson, Cheney, Meeson, Rivers, Newton, McNamara, Wheatley, Zomer, Davey, Jamar, Spencer, Valenti and Whelan.

I don't think the coaching staff rate Jones 18th in the B&F and when they wanted Redden in the draft to help out the midfield they only mentioned McLean no mention of Jones at all.

Miller and Wheatley had reasonable years but if they go back to playing the footy they have played in the past they could be trade bait.

Sylvia, Dunn, Bell, Davey and Jamar have stagnated another ordinary year could see them as trade bait.

Moloney, Rivers and Whelan have been too injury prone over the years.

McDonald and Robertson are getting old.

Cheney, Meeson, Newton, McNamara, Zomer, Spencer and Valenti at the very least need to be playing good footy in Casey's Seniors if they are in the reserves they will find it very difficult to retain their spot on the list.

Cheney, Meeson, Newton, McNamara, Zomer, Spencer and Valenti at the very least need to be playing good footy in Casey's Seniors if they are in the reserves they will find it very difficult to retain their spot on the list.

Meeson and Newton are contracted for 2010. Sad thing is they can have rubbish years and still be on the list for 2010.

Newton was one of the more perplexing re-signings (for 2 yrs) in recent years for the MFC.

Newton was one of the more perplexing re-signings (for 2 yrs) in recent years for the MFC.

I agree but the lack of forward options at MFC possibly gave him a life line. This year is critical for him if he is serious about AFL.

Meeson and Newton are contracted for 2010. Sad thing is they can have rubbish years and still be on the list for 2010.

Newton was one of the more perplexing re-signings (for 2 yrs) in recent years for the MFC.

True but if Newton and\or Meeson are langishing in Casey's reserves the club would have to consider paying them out like Carroll and you would think they would be on a fair bit less than Carroll was.

If Meeson and Newton weren't contracted for another 2 years I would have put them in a different catergory like the better pull your finger out or your gone catergory.

Yes agree, Dunn vs

McDonald Bruce Green Davey

Moloney Sylvia McLean

Valenti Buckley Jones

Bartram Grimes Morton Maric

Blease Strauss Bennell Jetta Bail WATTS

That's 21 blokes, the best 7 or 8 to get picked in the midfield

Just cannot see Dunn being good enough to earn it...

More like 10 - 12 . . .

True but if Newton and\or Meeson are langishing in Casey's reserves the club would have to consider paying them out like Carroll and you would think they would be on a fair bit less than Carroll was.

Carroll was paid as a consequence of a series of off field issues which allegedly contravened the terms of his contract. Newton and Meesen are in a different position. Its not a matter of just paying out players who have been given excessly long contracts because you dont want them. The AFL and MCC have both kicked in $1million this year and would not be happy with costly contract management issues.

Meeson and Newton are contracted for 2010.

Agree that Newton received two years but can you provide a source for the Meeson contract?

Cheers

Agree that Newton received two years but can you provide a source for the Meeson contract?

Cheers

No I can't provide a source, but I've read time and time again on this site that the MFC gave Meeson 3 years when he crossed over from Adelaide.

Rhino Richards is also confident that Meeson is on a 3 year contract, and he has his sources.

how many games games has meeson played who ever put him on a 3yr contract has obviously more money than us shocking decision poor judgment hope it wasnt bailey

how many games games has meeson played who ever put him on a 3yr contract has obviously more money than us shocking decision poor judgment hope it wasnt bailey

Meesen's a speculative listing. Saying to him 1 or 2 years is tantamount to saying "We think you're pretty crap, you have two years, and if you don't lift, you're turfed."

He's a ruckman, and young ruckmen take time... As I remember PJ frustrated a lot in his first few years. Enough to have him traded out of WC (albeit from a ruckman-heavy list) and look at him now.

Giving Meesen a few years really allows him to get settled and show why he was picked so early, and if he dribbles through a few games in '09 and '10... then comes out and plays 22 in '11, we'll be calling it a masterstroke.

On the surface, perhaps the reason he's been persisted with is that he fits the mould you need for a modern ruckman. Big engine, not too slow, and no glaring holes in his game. The beauty of PJ was that he had all those first few years to fix up elements of his game, like no overhead marking. If Meesen is given the time he could get there. And something about that pairing of PJ and Meesen makes my mouth water. The idea that you have PJ running down speedsters like Sherman one moment, then when he goes off for a breather, you get Meesen coming in and you don't lose any of that pace or mobility. It's just a theory of course, but still...

Personally, I reckon people will find mature-aged ruckmen will be a drafting choice of the future. Even some KP players could be recruited later and pay handsome dividends as there's less risk. Martin is a good example of this. Predicting star ruckmen at 17 years of age is fraught with danger. Not even NickNat is a guaranteed star ruckman yet. If you apply this logic to Meesen, we basically got a guy at 20-odd, saving us a couple of dead years on the list.

I, like everyone else, am not sold on the guy, and think he's as much of a chance NOT to make it as anything. But you HAVE to give these big kids a chance over a number of years.

dappa dan thanks for the reply im trying to figure how to quote i push the button but its not happening any way i saw him play at casey this year and it was very disapointing any how i hope he comes good but im not holding my breath i dont think he played enough games at the crows to warrant 3yrs cheers

You need to press reply to get the quote in your post.

He's right about the big lads taking a while to develop; hence why a large portion come from late draft picks

You need to press reply to get the quote in your post.

He's right about the big lads taking a while to develop; hence why a large portion come from late draft picks

thanks mate

More like 10 - 12 . . .

well you are obviously counting flankers when we are discussing true midfielders... in any case I don't see room for Dunn in any role

No I can't provide a source, but I've read time and time again on this site that the MFC gave Meeson 3 years when he crossed over from Adelaide.

Rhino Richards is also confident that Meeson is on a 3 year contract, and he has his sources.

This is my problem mate, almost everyone on the board is saying he's on a three year contract. It is my opinion that he is on two. I'm not satisfied with the evidence supplied thus far by people claiming he's on three. That said, no-one, myself included, can provide any evidence either way.

dappa dan thanks for the reply im trying to figure how to quote i push the button but its not happening any way i saw him play at casey this year and it was very disapointing any how i hope he comes good but im not holding my breath i dont think he played enough games at the crows to warrant 3yrs cheers

I see your point, but perhaps you'd consider that you're applying the logic to a ruckman that you would apply to, say, a tallish flanker? You can't expect ruckmen to come in and have Nathan Jones-like starts to their careers. Their bodies just aren't anywhere near up to it. How many ruckmen play heaps of footy in their first few years? And even when they do get a few games (Leuenberger, Kreuzer) how often do they dominate?

I think it's fair to say that for a pick 8, he's been a let down. But we didn't pick him at 8, we traded a later pick for him.

Picking him up at MFC was ALWAYS going to be speculative. But there's no point speculating on a player like Meesen if you're not willing to follow through with it. When picked up at age 20 (or thereabouts) the club would have set goals (mostly attitude and training related) for the kid, and if he met them, give him another couple of years. At the end of, say, a 4 year period, if he was floundering, consider mature-age rookie, or trade/delist. I would be worried about us if we DIDN'T leave every stone unturned. As I said above, this model or mature-age recruitment of ruckmen has worked beautifully with PJ... If you look at his situation a ruckman had to go from WC cos they had a few good ones, and it was unclear if he would make it. He still ha market value, because we traded for him... we didn't take another team's cast-offs. The same is true (in principle) of Meesen. Though I will agree he's shown nowhere near as much as PJ at a similar time.

Ultimately what we're talking about here is backing the recruiters, and their long-range assessment of a player's capabilities.

Its funny that we traded a third round pick for him and Adel thought they were being ripped off but because we had a higher PSD position had to let him go or get nothing. They also offered him a contract so people in the AFL must thing he can play.... hopefully he proves it

Its funny that we traded a third round pick for him and Adel thought they were being ripped off but because we had a higher PSD position had to let him go or get nothing. They also offered him a contract so people in the AFL must thing he can play.... hopefully he proves it

I've spent the 1st half of last season talking up what a steal we got him for............ Then I saw him play a couple for sandy.

Needs to take a big step this year or will find himself uncontracted at the end of 2010. I really hope he comes on as we need another ruckman moving forward.