Undeeterred

Yep. Very, very good point on Collingwood and Richmond. I think WCE would really struggle to fit Hogan in with Kennedy and Darling, but you never know I guess.

They just looked slow and boring and like the game has passed them by. Must have got their coach from the Paul Roos Coaching Academy. Oh, wait...

I'd say our chances of keeping Jesse went up 20% tonight. Freo are done and dusted, especially once Pavlich and Sandilands go. And gee West Coast look good when they are up and running

Sorry, I'm still back on page 5 - and I've counted literally 7 posts in a row of you saying nothing other than this. Ie, adding absolutely nothing to the discussion except carping and pissing and moaning.

And on being given exposure in the seniors to develop - we've been given the messaging for three years now that this is the direction the club explicitly wants to move away from, so not sure why we would then U-turn and do it anyway.

Well yeah, but we are talking about the same premiership coach who admitted in public that he made the wrong selection decision last week. You can't just use 'premiership coach' interchangably with 'infallible'.

Completely agree and that's how it should be, but then why are we telling everyone we're playing players who are ready, when they clearly aren't? Wagner is a long way off from being ready, has been given some exposure and been found wanting, and has no real exposed form different to that in the seconds.

I reckon they've lost the plot. Inconsistent messaging now twice in a row. They keep banging on about bringing up ready players in good form from the VFL. My count is (1) Brayshaw. Yes, best 22 but clearly not ready and zero seconds form to go on. (2) Wagner. Exposed form very dicey and others have been much better performed in the VFL games. Fine to experiment etc, but don't then give us but, more importantly the players, mixed messages. Guys like ANB must be spewing.

Agreed. Carey will just calm him down I reckon, bring him back to earth a bit.

This, precisely. I've been wondering how long it would take for us to twig to the fact that these guys take absolutely no responsibility for team improvement, then say the team hasn't improved and I'm out of here. Jesse could pretty much single handedly ensure that we win 2-4 games more than we will if he stands around scratching himself in the forward line.

I can't be bothered trawling back through the threads, but I'm willing to bet that at least a few of the people in this thread who are heaping it on him would have taken him at 4 regardless.

What a cracker of a first post.

This is beginning to look like the story, if you ask me.

Number 10 is off the mark, though.

'Hard inherited'. Love it.

Best, most thoughtful, considered and insightful post Demonland has ever seen. And spot on the money.

Free kick not paid - Jones was all over Daniher's shoulder. But it did seem odd he was within 20 feet, yes.

Well yes, if they're not ready. On what basis is Weidemann playing reasonable football demanding the right to be 'given a chance to step up'. This whole topic is pure over reaction (not surprising given the OP).

Gosh you two are boring.

It was dreadful. We had a very typical day out when nobody led, old hands kicked it down the throat of the opposition and the coaching box made no creative changes which might have shaken things up a bit. There was nothing like stick Hogan on the ball to stop him whinging, or put Jones across half back to cut off easy ball in. It was just the typical Melbourne slow motion train crash.

This is the first time someone has actually said this, and you're absolutely right. We just have no vision as a club and are always five years behind everyone else.

Funnily enough, for all the doom and gloom we are still 9th and none of the teams below us have a realistic chance of jumping us (including Hawthorn).

We should be arrogant about games like this, and we should shout down people who suggested we could lose. Then our bloody team should have gone out and facking torn them a new one. We will never get anywhere until we expect to win games like that, and our players demand of each other that they deliver. 'Will we, won't we' just shouldn't even be a discussion.

But why on earth would he want to, at this point?

Maybe, I don't know. I'm talking about Friday nights anyway