Undeeterred

And then Lance Whitnall kicked a point from 20m directly in front. What could we possibly do???? We couldn't possibly have tried harder, they just did it better.

Clearly you haven't been reading Demonland for long...

Probably because he was a washed up has been, is my guess WYL.

Tossers of the highest order, the lot of them. Except maybe Roos.

True, true. But it would be a big one...

And if it panned out like that, Collingwood and Essendon in week 1 would be huge.

So many games that shape this in the final few rounds. After going through the ladder predictor on the AFL website, I came up with: Sydney Adelaide Hawthorn West Coast Collingwood Geelong North Essendon ------------------ St Kilda Freo Carlton Richmond ...... But, this is based on: Rd 19 Haw v Geel - Haw Ade v Ess - Ade Rd 20 WCE v Geel - WCE Ess v Nth - Nth Sydney v Collingwood (in Syd) - Syd Rd 21 Gee v St K - Gee Ess v Coll - Coll Rd 22 Syd v Haw - Syd WCE v Coll - WCE Rd 23 Haw v WCE - Haw Gee v Syd - Gee St K v Carl - St K A few of those go the other way and things could look very different. Adelaide are a monty for top 4, and probably top 2, with Melbourne and Brisbane away and Gold Coast, Freo and Essendon at home.

That post was made pre-merge, when ANOTHER new 'who should go' thread was started. And more new ones, on the same topic ad nauseum, are tiresome.

These threads are becoming incredibly tiresome.

Great, now that tonatopia is here, we have critical mass for a true Neeld bashing thread to get rolling.

You can't tackle somebody from 3 metres behind them.

I'm not saying we wouldn't be worse without Jones, because we clearly would have been. What I'm saying is there is no point saying 'what if'. Yes, it could have been worse. But if we had a full team in, it could also have been better.

I didn't get to see any of today's game, but this argument is fallacious. I mean, imagine if Clark, Watts, Jurrah and Jamar did (and I'm sure there are others...)

I love the irony of this thread (and I'm not immune!), when many of us are banging on about how T Cloke should pull on a Melbourne jumper in return for bucketloads of cash.

Get Jones and Howe signed up, then put the cue in the rack until we sort ourselves out towards the end of the year, is my view...

OD, I mentioned switching, not trades, and I'm aware of Clokes free agent status. All I was thinking about was when players moved between the two teams... Excellent get! That too. Interesting.

Not that I want this to happen, but I reckon he will be better off hiding out in Freo. Collingwood supporters would probably lynch him if he played for Carlton. I have no idea of the right answer to this, but when is the last time a really star player switched between Carlton and Collingwood? I bet it doesn't happen often...

Beams, Wellingham and Reid have all signed up, according to the Hun. Clearly, Cloke's moola is being spent elsewhere. He's gone.

Oh seriously, you are bloody kidding me.

Completely agree. Much better to get a proven star than retain heaps of 'quality' picks and hope they turn into 'quality' players. Been there, done that.

Very interesting that there is deafening silence on our out-of-contract list. Surely we are waiting to see how much we have to give Cloke before we get moving on that. Given we have to pay 90-something % of the salary cap, and we'd have to pay most of our players overs to get there, why not front load the cr@p out of Cloke's contract, and sign all the rest of our muppets (with a few apologies eg Jones) to something more like what they are worth? With Clark and Cloke front-loaded, there will be plenty of room in 3-4 years to sign up the quality mids we will draft this year to the wages they will hopefully deserve by then. I just can't see how this could be a bad idea.

Sure Jose. Imagine he dropped it pre-committal. How do you think that would go down? Damned if they do, damned if they don't.

Ummm that is absolutely factually incorrect. Guilty means that a jury has decided it is satisfied that the evidence proves beyond a reasonable doubt that the accused committed the crime. Not guilty means they aren't. That doesn't mean the jury doesn't think the person did it. Simple as that.

Why, because if he was playing for us he would have been odds-on to have a knee reco within 10 minutes or something?

Fair enough - I guess that's where we disagree. I reckon you can only go 6-7 max, and I can think of 6 to go well before Greeny. He's one I'd save for next year's chop, which, sadly, will be just about as big again...